Would you buy an unregistered gun?

[Boomboy007]

Originally Posted by wayneco

Don't live in Clark County, NV. You are in the only county in NV that requires blue cards. Move to Pahrump!

I'm in Washoe County, fill out the 4473 and you're out the door up here.

I would totally move to Washoe county just because of "Reno 911"!

I think that Montana may have the right idea. No BATF on guns manufactured, sold, and used only in Montana.

[tattedupboy]

I suppose that the only people who bought their guns at gun shows or in private transfers (in states that don't require these transactions to be done through an FFL) won't have to worry.

[Ceicei]

Originally Posted by tattedupboy

I suppose that the only people who bought their guns at gun shows or in private transfers (in states that don't require these transactions to be done through an FFL) won't have to worry.

True. I saw a person buying a GSG MP5, cash only, no forms private sale at a recent gun show. Man, was I jealous! I didn't have enough money at the time to get it. Security at the door did have to verbally verify with the buyer and seller to make sure it was a legitimate sale before they would allow the buyer to leave with it.

- Ceicei

[chroode]

Talk to any elderly people you are familiar with. Most of the guns that have no record comes from people who bought them ages ago.

[Bohemian]

Yep, its pretty clear that the NFA, 1968 GCA, 1986 FOPA, Brady Bill(s) ad nauseam, NICS Improvement Act of 2007, 16th Amendment, IRS, BATFE, et. al. ...

Are all clear infringements of the preexisting, unalienable rights reaffirmed and protected by the U.S. Constitution and Second Amendments...

One of these days the 90 million plus known firearm owners of 270 million plus known firearms in this country are going to need to actually realize that "We The People" are the ones with the power, and not "We The Sheeple" are at the mercy and good graces of the Federal, State, County and other municipalities governments...

Yet we still have a unbelievable amount of sheeple (those that voted for and continue to support him) that actually believe in the tripe that the Usurper has a long history of spewing...

Such as this paraphrase of preposterous treasonous statements by the Usurper Obama...

"The U.S. suffers from a fundamentally flawed constitution" - The Usurper Obama:
Obama rips U.S. Constitution

"If we do nothing, we can only say we did nothing" - George Washington

IF "We The Sheeple" continue to allow Constitutional and Second Amendment Infringements to occur and allow existing ones to continue, (such as the IRS, BATFE, etc.) then just like the LDS has digitized centuries of genealogical data, the IRS and BATFE most certainly will if they have not already digitize all available firearm transaction data since the 1934 NFA, a mere 75 years...
and or since the 1968 GCA, a minuscule 40 years...

It does not take a individual with a degree in Computer Science to figure out how simple an effort it would be to find that machine gun grandpa brought home from WW1 or WWII, or other firearm obtained in any other manner that the serial number had a tax stamp associated with it, and or NICS (BATFE Form 4473) check was done on purchaser, gun registration, ccw permit, etc., and gave to one of his children, grandchildren, etc.,...

Zip Plus Four... The Address To Your Front Door...

AKA: Citizen Relocation Code... may not be just satire...
:-)

[iteclab]

Yeah, I think a few 'effective' ones will be necessary. No paper trail. We know the enemy is coming. We just don't know from which direction. Don't let your guard down.

[Red Hat]

Originally Posted by Bohemian

IF that is the case how come the BATFE routinely fines dealers for typo's, missing info, abbreviations, etc., on Form 4473?

I can tell you from personal experience, a FFL who is a friend of mine told me about 6 months ago he was fined 250 bucks for a missing check box entry on a 4473 that I filled out...

Red's Trading Post is in a major lawsuit against the BATFE for clerical errors on form 4473's... that the BATFE is trying to shut them down over...

Red's is one of the oldest FFL's in the country...

Bought Any Guns Lately?

They do a dealer inspection a couple times a year. They inspect the forms to make sure that they have been filled out correctly. They do not take any of the forms. They remain with the dealer.

[Bohemian]

Originally Posted by Red Hat

They do a dealer inspection a couple times a year. They inspect the forms to make sure that they have been filled out correctly. They do not take any of the forms. They remain with the dealer.

its a lot more then a couple times a year, more like a couple of random times a month at minimum...

And you should re-read the following if you still think they don't know what firearms are at your zip+4
NRA-ILA :: In Border States, BATFE Asks: "May We See Your Guns?"

[Red Hat]

Originally Posted by Bohemian

its a lot more then a couple times a year, more like a couple of random times a month at minimum...

And you should re-read the following if you still think they don't know what firearms are at your zip+4
NRA-ILA :: In Border States, BATFE Asks: "May We See Your Guns?"

There's no way the ATF could randomly check a dealer a couple times a month unless they have been violation of record keeping and they are doing follow ups. There's not enough ATF agents to go around to do that many checks on dealers.

This tells it all, from the article you posted.

For example, when BATFE traces a gun seized after use in a crime, manufacturers' and dealers' records will normally lead to the first retail buyer of that gun, and investigators will have to interview the buyer to find out how the gun ended up in criminal hands. But in other cases, the questioning may simply be based on information in dealers' records, with agents trying to "profile" potentially suspicious purchases.

[Bohemian]

Originally Posted by Red Hat

There's no way the ATF could randomly check a dealer a couple times a month unless they have been violation of record keeping and they are doing follow ups. There's not enough ATF agents to go around to do that many checks on dealers.

This tells it all, from the article you posted.

you are making a lot of uninformed assumptions...

Thanks to the BATFE and the Brady Bunch there are more employees of the BATFE then there are current FFL holders in the U.S... and that was two years ago...

BATFE firearms trace database...

To execute its mission of enforcing federal firearms laws,
ATF conducts firearms traces for federal, state, local,
and tribal law enforcement agencies. 18 U.S.C. sect. 923.
See also Library of Congress, Congressional Research Service,
Gun Control: Statutory Disclosure Limitations on ATF Firearms
Trace Data and Multiple Handgun Sales Reports, No. RS22458 (July 20, 2007), at 2.
ATF maintains a Firearms Trace System database...

Additionally, they frequently photocopy, video tape, and transcribe form 4473 information...

Moreover FFL dealers around the country are reporting unusual amounts of random BATFE form 4473 inspections and requests...

Bloomberg Under Fire From Gun Groups - HUMAN EVENTS
GOF: When The BATF Pays A Visit
GunCite - Gun Control: gun registration;firearm registration
When Must the Government* Disclose Gun Owners' Names and Addresses?
U.S. GAO - B-309704, Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives--Words of Futurity in Fiscal Year 2006 Appropriations Act, August 28, 2007
10/08 BATFE Adds Theft To Its Crimes
Rein in BATFE abuses; stop their firearms registration database | Red Pills
ATF abuse
More ATF abuse
The BATFE is creating a firearms ownership registry; this is blatantly illegal! | Red Pills
GOA Comments on the BATF
The BATFE is creating a firearms ownership registry; this is blatantly illegal! | Red Pills
Louisiana Sportsman-Registration not a fact of gun purchase
BATF Conducts House by House Gun Searches | DarkGovernment
NRA-ILA :: The "Tiahrt Amendment" on Firearms Traces: Protecting Gun Owners' Privacy and Law Enforcement Safety