What if from Hell...

[gdcleanfun]

I was once asked a similar question: what would I do if I was shopping near the back of the store (Wally World) and I heard gun shots up front? The gals questioning me thought she'd trip me up, thinking my answer would be that I'd to go to the front of the store to help. Nope, I told her. Providing that my better half is not in the front of the store, I'd be out the back door and on the phone to 911 so fast that I'd leave her spinning around in place! lol I'm not a cop, not a vigilante. I'm only trying to defend myself and my loved ones. That's where my responsibility lies (lays?) Yes, in an ideal world I'd like to keep everyone safe, but I'm not trained for that. Leave that to the LEOs.

Just my .02cents worth, other opinions may vary.

[gestu1]

Unfortunately I think we're all animals. I'd love to be able to help, but our society is so litigious that i'd either end up in criminal court, or civil court (likely both).

Self defense is a personal responsibility. I embrace that as it is my duty to protect myself, and my family from harm. Unfortunately, actions taken by me not acting in an official capacity are actions that I will have to deal with personally- IE: I'm paying the legal fees, and if I lose I'm going to prison.

It would haunt me for life if I were to see the situation occurring,have the means to stop it, and due to my inaction someone be hurt or killed. However, Unless/until the law stops favoring the criminals then I have no choice but to be a witness..

The government and the liberal politicians forced my hand in the matter. If I act I'm a vigilante, if I don't I'm a coward. At least this coward won't be a bankrupt (legal fees) prisoner.

WELL SAID. I would hope level headed thinking would protect me from making the wrong decision. But if the BG starts shooting and I can stop him, I'll be emptying my mag. Maybe not the best thing but I think life is more valuable then anything else.

[kengrubb]

ClearSight, I hope you aren't the only one around when my family or me need help. I guess I will be a bankrupt prisoner, because I will NOT stand there and let an innocent person be hurt (family or stranger).

When donning White Knight attire, be damned sure of who is innocent.

Self defense is a personal responsibility??? Everybody does not have the means to be armed, or the ability to fight off a "bad guy".

So that means their misfortune has to become my own? The three branches of government are what made things untenable for someone coming to the aid of another. I didn't make the mess and me wading neck deep into a poop river doesn't seem like a good choice for me, particularly when nothing in the aftermath will change.

As long as it appears to be robbery only, hey, it's only money. But, if it goes beyond that, then I will do whatever I can to help an innocent person. So, you go ahead with your plan, I will stick with mine.

This scenario began as a simple robbery. Most robbers just want the money. If I open up on them for mere robbery, I'm instigating the gunfight. Even if I drop the BGs, one of the BGs could still hurt or kill an innocent person. I'm not saying robbery is a crime to be taken lightly or punished minimally. However, I am saying that I won't rush into a firefight over a robbery.

[SteveB]

When donning White Knight attire, be damned sure of who is innocent.


So that means their misfortune has to become my own? The three branches of government are what made things untenable for someone coming to the aid of another. I didn't make the mess and me wading neck deep into a poop river doesn't seem like a good choice for me, particularly when nothing in the aftermath will change.


This scenario began as a simple robbery. Most robbers just want the money. If I open up on them for mere robbery, I'm instigating the gunfight. Even if I drop the BGs, one of the BGs could still hurt or kill an innocent person. I'm not saying robbery is a crime to be taken lightly or punished minimally. However, I am saying that I won't rush into a firefight over a robbery.

Pay attention. I said if it goes beyond robbery. Some bg's want no witnesses.
Not trying to convince you that YOU should help, just that I would. Just the way I was brought up.

[6shootercarry]

Ok. slight change-up: The store clerk who is on the receiving end of the BG's gun barrel is your spouse or kid. NOW, what do you do?

"WHAT IF" From JJFlash...

Any member of my family and I shoot the guy where he stands... I know that type of emotional reaction could get me in trouble. If it were my child / wife the focus would be so intense I'd have to.

Now, The chaos factor... I get into fight mode and cause the BG to change his game plan. BG makes a mistake and someone gets hurt or killed. If I had just let him do his thing and he made off with the money maybe no one would be hurt?

Perhaps I cause an injury to a bystander, or worse while in fight mode... Now I'm the BG...

Yikes... How to do this...

I'll have to go with the "No shots, No Action" rule... 911 call and as I have typed before, be a good witness

If the barrel started coming in my direction, I'd be shooting first. No question. I'd have my weapon drawn and ready...

[kelcarry]

As much as I agree with CST and JJ I know that I am not an LEO, I am not trained to respond like an LEO, I am probably not armed like an LEO, I do not have communications like an LEO and I am not going to act like an LEO UNLESS it is my family or myself that is in the middle of this "hell". In SC, we have the alter ego doctrine in the law that allows me to defend this storekeeper etal as if it is me in their shoes--this gets into a dangerous situation when you come across a situation w/o all the facts and, really fellow forum members, not fully trained to act like an LEO. Easy to say the words on this forum--difficult to say how you would really react in "hell".

[gdcleanfun]

Easy to say the words on this forum--difficult to say how you would really react in "hell".

Oh so true!!! I froze. I was witness to first hubby's beating and I froze. That was more than 25 years ago and after Army training. That night I vowed to be better trained so I'd never freeze again. I've kept that vow. After stomping our local LEO Captain on the head with my shoes and screaming my fool head off in rage at him when he took me down in a recent class of women's self defense training, I don't believe I'll have trouble freezing ever again.

[Conservative Wife & Mom]

Oh so true!!! I froze. I was witness to first hubby's beating and I froze. That was more than 25 years ago and after Army training. That night I vowed to be better trained so I'd never freeze again. I've kept that vow. After stomping our local LEO Captain on the head with my shoes and screaming my fool head off in rage at him when he took me down in a recent class of women's self defense training, I don't believe I'll have trouble freezing ever again.

I'm truly impressed, gdcleanfun! The BG had better NOT mess with you! Can I be your friend?

[ClearSightTactical]

ClearSight, I hope you aren't the only one around when my family or me need help. I guess I will be a bankrupt prisoner, because I will NOT stand there and let an innocent person be hurt (family or stranger). Self defense is a personal responsibility??? Everybody does not have the means to be armed, or the ability to fight off a "bad guy". As long as it appears to be robbery only, hey, it's only money. But, if it goes beyond that, then I will do whatever I can to help an innocent person.So, you go ahead with your plan, I will stick with mine.

Sorry, I didn't see this post until now. :-D

I have no duty nor responsibility, nor expectation to protect you or anyone else for that matter.

If you feel that you should risk your freedom and financial future for a stranger - more power to you. Expect to be labeled a vigilante, a cowboy, quick draw (insert your name), etc. Expect a public outcry for your punishment (as well as release..)

Self defense is indeed a personal responsibility. It is not the duty of the Police to protect you. See Warren v. District of Columbia it is a "fundamental principle of American law that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any individual citizen."

I will go ahead with my plan Cowboy (see it started already). When you get arrested & charged i'll be sure to write to the jurisdiction demanding your release- and donate to your legal fund. (I'm not being sarcastic).

As far as not having the means to be armed or fight off a bad guy they should demand the Castle doctrine, and immunity from criminal and civil prosecution for an armed citizen stopping a bad guy to their legislators...that is how they can help fight back. Again, until the law stops favoring the criminal we have no choice but to be a witness.

[ClearSightTactical]

When donning White Knight attire, be damned sure of who is innocent.

Quote of the year..