Lightfield Less Lethal 12 Gauge Rubber Slugs

[Deserteagle]

Ok I agree a slug will go through more then the bird shot will? You premise is still very flawed as what difference does that make to the person on the other side of the wall?

There is nothing to agree or disagree about. A slug will go through more walls than a bird shot pellet will. Whether you like it or not, that is how it is. What difference does it make? You tell me. Would you rather get hit by something with more energy that is much harder to stop, or something smaller with less energy that stops faster?

Penetration a hollow point from a handgun will likely go as deep in most cases deeper then a shotgun slug from that same range into tissue!

Where is your info to back up this statement? I am no expert but common sense tells me a shotgun slug will not only penetrate deeper than a hollow point from a handgun, but it will go through you.

Also in the home your dealing with very close ranges and even the smallest bird shot will stay in one mass and penetrate like it was a slug.

No, it will not. Once again, look at the research I posted. Not one of the tested bird shot pellets penetrated "like a slug".

Penetration is not what kills the wound channel and the dissipation of energy is.

Penetration is very important for killing. But we are talking about what rounds are safer to use in an apartment building. Buckshot and slugs will penetrate more walls and have more energy than a bird shot pellet.

View the pictures on the link you posted.

I already have. It is evident you did not.

Again if your are so concerned about over or unwanted perpetration use the round that was developed to prevent that from occurring FRANGIBLE.

I am not concerned about over penetration. I dont live in an apartment, so my shotgun has buckshot in it. The whole point of this discussion was to offer ideas on loads for guns for people that live in apartment buildings where a stray round might go through several apartments.

[Treo]

Am I the only one that noticed the OP pooped this out and never came back?

[Caribou]

If you point a gun at someone it is considered lethal force, even more so if you pull the trigger. The only reason to pull a weapon is to protect your life from imminent attack. If you use rubber bullets you obviously didn't think you were in threat of life or limb. Do not pass GO do not collect $200. The DA is not on your side, do not expect reason especially your own. If you need to defend yourself then do so. These halfway games will get you sued, jailed, or dead. Don't think for one minute that the bad guy will wait for you to put real ammo in your firearm. Yes, some criminals will be impressed but I will not bet my life on this roll of the dice. As far as over penetration goes I recommend regular trips to the range. Even better would be competition. Something like IDPA will add stress to the range time and better prepare you for the real thing, plus it is fun.

[EKO]

If you point a gun at someone it is considered lethal force,.

Not in Texas, just Force.......

[maine04619]

There is nothing to agree or disagree about. A slug will go through more walls than a bird shot pellet will. Whether you like it or not, that is how it is. What difference does it make? You tell me. Would you rather get hit by something with more energy that is much harder to stop, or something smaller with less energy that stops faster? Where is your info to back up this statement? I am no expert but common sense tells me a shotgun slug will not only penetrate deeper than a hollow point from a handgun, but it will go through you. No, it will not. Once again, look at the research I posted. Not one of the tested bird shot pellets penetrated "like a slug". Penetration is very important for killing. But we are talking about what rounds are safer to use in an apartment building. Buckshot and slugs will penetrate more walls and have more energy than a bird shot pellet. I already have. It is evident you did not. I am not concerned about over penetration. I dont live in an apartment, so my shotgun has buckshot in it. The whole point of this discussion was to offer ideas on loads for guns for people that live in apartment buildings where a stray round might go through several apartments.

Wholly crap. I have already stated what I know to be true through both what I have personally seen and done. You can go to all the websites and texts you wish but I know. Go take a Massad Ayob class and watch what he does in the shotgun course. Watch what he does with 20 gauge slugs. Hell try it for yourself. I do not care where you live if the BG comes in shoot them with the biggest thing you can propel at them accurately. If that happens to be a shotgun slug then so be it.

[Mobuck]

I really don't care how many sheets of drywall set 2" apart a load of birdshot penetrate. That's not how houses are built. Try it through 2 layers and see what the pellets do a few feet beyond. With the drywall set so close together, it holds the shot together in a ball creating MORE penetration. I assume this is a way to further what you're teaching or whatever your "training agenda" is.
Hell, a few days ago, I was told positively that birdshot was not even a lethal option on an internet forum. I've been around a while and I've seen what a shotgun can and can't do.