Ordered to ground at gunpoint for open carrying by cleveland heights ohio police

[.45acp]

Hello folks,

First post on this forum.

It always surprises and disappoints me to see how many gunners don't support the 2nd amendment or only support the 2nd as it pertains to their particular firearms or thoughts. I have a CCW and OC frequently, in my opinion OC is just as viable carry option as CC, and is a better crime deterrent, can you imagine if 50 % of our citizens that are legally able to carry OC’ed. I believe crime would take significant drop.

I am trying to figure out why the CC proponents are determined to prove that OC is wrong and some seem to think that OC should not be condoned by “responsible gunners”; I do not see the reverse taking place (ie OC'ers trashing CC).

People, the second amendment does not address OC or CC nor does the 2nd care. It gives all of us the right to keep and bear arms. We should not denigrate nor split our forces and waste energy arguing with each other about our individually selected mode of carry.

We shall all hang together defending the 2nd amendment or rest assured, we will all lose it. It disappoints me greatly to see some of the arguments regarding OC vs CC on this and other forums in cyberspace.

Just my nickels worth.


Steve

[Red Hat]

Welcome to the forum, .45acp. I agree 100% on you comments!

[HootmonSccy]

Welcome from Floriduh (a non-OC state)

I would not speak against Open Carry. I probably would not OC in general myself (I would while hunting and some other activities, but not generally), but would not restrict others rights to OC because of my preference.

I think those that choose to Open Carry need to think about where they are going, and choose accordingly.. I am not saying they should be restricted from OC, but common since should prevail! They should not in general OC to seek reactions from others. After pre-thought, If reactions happen anyways, so be it.

For me, CC provides me with a tactical advantage that OC may not, so that is my preference, although OC is not an option for me at this time anywayz..

[Boomboy007]

Originally Posted by .45acp

Hello folks,

First post on this forum.

It always surprises and disappoints me to see how many gunners don't support the 2nd amendment or only support the 2nd as it pertains to their particular firearms or thoughts. I have a CCW and OC frequently, in my opinion OC is just as viable carry option as CC, and is a better crime deterrent, can you imagine if 50 % of our citizens that are legally able to carry OC’ed. I believe crime would take significant drop.

I am trying to figure out why the CC proponents are determined to prove that OC is wrong and some seem to think that OC should not be condoned by “responsible gunners”; I do not see the reverse taking place (ie OC'ers trashing CC).

People, the second amendment does not address OC or CC nor does the 2nd care. It gives all of us the right to keep and bear arms. We should not denigrate nor split our forces and waste energy arguing with each other about our individually selected mode of carry.

We shall all hang together defending the 2nd amendment or rest assured, we will all lose it. It disappoints me greatly to see some of the arguments regarding OC vs CC on this and other forums in cyberspace.

Just my nickels worth.


Steve

Great first post, Steve. You are absolutely correct. I look forward to more contributions!

[Lonewolf2810]

Well first of all the LEO have the right to detain you if they have just cause and they said they were called by one or more citizens that alone is (going in terror to the public) This alone is enough for them to stop you, as for putting you face down on the ground is for their own protection is what they will say. Now for them not knowing the laws this is the same for a lot of the LEO's out there as they are not able and neither are you to know every law on the books. You and I are only interested in a particular law, they have much more to deal with than just open carry laws. I for one would not want the job. After they figured out you were clear of any wrong doing and they let you go with your gun they were up on the law. Just put yourself in their position and what would you do. If you open carry you are asking to be stopped and ask what and why. I am in agreement with open carry but I have a ccw so that is my preferred way to carry. Just my opinion and I have one just like we all do.

And I agree with what Steve said, Great 1st post.

[S&WM&P40]

Originally Posted by Lonewolf2810

Well first of all the LEO have the right to detain you if they have just cause and they said they were called by one or more citizens that alone is (going in terror to the public) This alone is enough for them to stop you, as for putting you face down on the ground is for their own protection is what they will say. Now for them not knowing the laws this is the same for a lot of the LEO's out there as they are not able and neither are you to know every law on the books. You and I are only interested in a particular law, they have much more to deal with than just open carry laws. I for one would not want the job. After they figured out you were clear of any wrong doing and they let you go with your gun they were up on the law. Just put yourself in their position and what would you do. If you open carry you are asking to be stopped and ask what and why. I am in agreement with open carry but I have a ccw so that is my preferred way to carry. Just my opinion and I have one just like we all do.

And I agree with what Steve said, Great 1st post.

LOL you must have not read the last two pages of posts. You can not be stopped for open carrying alone. They can respond to a call of a person with a gun. Come up and ask you what your doing. You have every right not to say anything. Open carrying alone is not reasonable suspicion of wrong doing to justify a stop. Case after case after case has shown this. Do cops still do it? Yes they do. Are they with in the law when doing so? NO they are not. File a suit on the town then file on on the department then file on on the officer him/her self. As for not knowing the laws that's a load of crap. Most departments carry the state Criminal code in the patrol car. I know i have My state Criminal code saved to my computer any and everything i can be arrested for is in it. I want to know why I'm being arrested ( If and when the time comes Never been arrested in my whole life and don't plan on starting now). But some times cops don't follow the full letter of the law. This is my way of calling what they are saying BS and knowing that I'm right. I would hope that all of you would have a copy of your states criminal code.

[Lonewolf2810]

My friend you can be stopped for walking on the grass if they want. This just seems to be a case of entrapment if this was to go to court. This was planned out to make a YouTube video and the judge would see it as such. This is not the way to help our cause and if you say it is you are wrong. And for your info I read all post before I comment. If the LOE was told he was in terror to the public they have all the right in the world to stop him so read your laws before you say they had no right to stop him.

enough said.

[S&WM&P40]

Originally Posted by Lonewolf2810

My friend you can be stopped for walking on the grass if they want. This just seems to be a case of entrapment if this was to go to court. This was planned out to make a YouTube video and the judge would see it as such. This is not the way to help our cause and if you say it is you are wrong. And for your info I read all post before I comment. If the LOE was told he was in terror to the public they have all the right in the world to stop him so read your laws before you say they had no right to stop him.

enough said.

I do know all of my laws. That's why i live in a FREE STATE and you do not. In NH stopped someone on the grounds that he was just open carrying is not put up with. IF your stopped for it they can not hold you and you are free to go. So you Enjoy your Nazi state with your SS storm troopers of police officers. While i will enjoy the free life. You hid in your house while we fight the good fight. Just a FYI there is not such thing as terror to the public. All the officer would get from Dispatch would be a report of a man with a gun at such a location. "The officers need reasonable, articulable suspicion of a crime being committed or about to be committed in order to stop" So tell me if OC is legal in his state then what was the suspicion of a crime? Yes the officers have a duty to respond to every call that much is true. But stopping and harassing a tax payer at gun point makes them no better then the thugs out running our streets with guns. Old saying "Cops are nothing more then THUGS WITH GUNS" You really want to start talking about Entrapment??

[PascalFleischman]

Originally Posted by 2beararms

Personally I have ZERO respect for anyone who thinks they are important enough to troll and taunt the police into wasting their time, and my tax money, to make a video of their stupidity. How long did you walk back and forth on that street until someone made a complaint call, illiciting the response that you so desired ??

I for one think you were handled with great restraint and respect. YES, police DO have the right to stop, inquire, and detain individuals until they are satisfied that no law is being broken. If they are not satisfied, they have a period of time to detain you in holding until they must either file charges or let you go. This "you are breaking the law" by detaining me is not correct.

Our community works very hard to keep an image of sane, trained and responsible individuals being armed for their own REAL self protection and intentionally taunting the police to get You-Tube video does not help the cause with lawmakers.

Remember, the "founding fathers" were nothing more than law makers, they were not Gods of some kind and the constitution and the rights that we so want to protect are simply laws on paper. Laws that new law makers CAN change today if desired. The second amendment COULD be repealed with enought support, and the first move to attempt that is always the same ... to show that 2nd amendment supporters are simply nut cases with guns ...

don't give them any more to work with than they already have!

I thought the same thing.....this whole deal is too convenient. The video starts about 10 seconds before a cop shows up.

"I'm walking up to a cop car now....."

Out there just pushing buttons.....what a waste of time and manpower.

[Rick O'Shay]

Originally Posted by knighted4

seems to me that alot of open carry people try to bait the police...why else would you carry a video camera? Yes you were right and they were wrong but in thier response they have to detain you and check you out in the course of a radio call, think of the liability if they had not...of course you probably already knew that. Carrying a video camera and taping the police and carring the law with you. And your probably the type to try to sue over it and waste more taxpayers money. Jmho

knighted4

+1911