A caveman could understand this:

[FN1910]

Now, back to the thread, wooddoctor!

IMO, privatization of retirement benefits would be the BEST case scenario for those 55 and younger. It makes perfect sense to faze out social security and let the individual be responsible for their own retirement through payroll deductions into IRA-type accounts. Of course, those who are under the current system would still receive their SS checks as long as they live.

Having said all of that, there ARE those who receive SSI, due to physical or mental handicaps that prevent them from working and contributing to individual retirement accounts. Does anyone have any idea as to how that scenario should be/could be handled?

That is pretty much the reason that SS was put into place to start with, that people were supposed to be responsible for their own retirement but so few did. The privatization of SS is on the surface a good idea but would have to be with mandatory contrubutions and without the loophole of IRA's where you can draw it out at any time (with penalties of course). The idea works well for those who work up until retirement but SS has become a puesdo insurance policy system where it is used to provide for too many that are injured or become disabled. Now before jumping on me too much know that my Father started drawing SS at the age of 40 and drew it for the next 35+ years. Now should he have drawn SS or should it have been called welfare or insurance. That is a good question but it came out of the same pot that my mother and I kept paying into for those 35+ years.

There is no doubt, and anyone that disputes it is crazy, that for a person who works for 45 years, pays into the system at a normal rate, retires, draws at the normal rate for the rest of their life gets shafted on the amount that they could be getting if they had been allowed to invest at almost any reasonable rate. This is the problem that SS is now an insurance policy that it was never intended to be. Suppose you are allowed to opt out of SS and make your own investment but after 5 years of work you become totally disabled. You then become dependent on welfare and we are right back to where we were.

On the other hand, although a lot of it has been changed, a Federal worker could work until the age of 58 in the Federal system and never pay a dime into the SS system. Once they retired and started to draw their Federal retirement they would find a job in the private sector for the next 7 years. At the end of that 7 years they would then be 65 and be able to draw full SS benefits the same as the person who had paid into the SS system for 42 years.

There are lots of proposals but none of them as simple as they sound at first. Any major changes are going to make a lot of people mad. I had a friend that if ever you wanted to get him riled up just start talking about SS. He was with the railroad for many years and finally retired very soon after the railroad retirement system was integrated into the SS system. He could not understand why he could only get either RR retirement or SS but not the full benefits from both. If you look at the history of SS you maybe start to ask the same question.

[FN1910]

Yep...both are ponzi schemes. One (Madoff's) was an individual crime against many. The other (Social Security) is a governmental crime against ALL. Sickening...

Actually I don't think that anyone can deny that both are technically Ponzi schemes. The difference so far is that as long as Madoff's scheme was working and people were being paid back whne they requested everyone was happy. If the Feds or whoever had moved in while it was still going strong those same people that lost so much would have been in court all over the prosecution for derailing their gravy train. Only the limit was reached and he couldn't make payments was anyone upset. So far the SS checks are still rolling out so little action will be taken.

This is the way things work. A few of you may remember Rep. John Jeanrette from SC and his wife Rita. He was supposedly involved in a scheme to sell condos on lots that were unbderwater and defrauding people out of their hard-earned money. The truth was that every person that lost money in that deal knew exactly what they were getting into and the only fraud was that Rep, Jeanrette was unable to get the permits to drain the wetlands to build the condos. Everything was going fine until the EPA decided that he didn't have enough pull in Washington to deserve that kind of a break. The whole deal fell apart and he was accused of swindling people out of their money. They couldn't convict him of that so they found some other stuff to take care of him.

Five years ago if you had told Madoff's investors that he was running a Ponzi scheme and tried to make accusations you would have found yourself in court defending yourself for defamation of character. As long as the checks keep rolling in, the books say that I am making a profit and the person in charge says everything is fine everyone is happy. That is the American Way and is how corporations are built.

[38+Pgal]

ORANGE COUNTY, Fla. -- An Osceola County man thought he’d paid off a parking ticket, so he was surprised to find out Monday that the Orange County Clerk’s office had issued a warrant for his arrest.

Luis Gomez owed exactly one cent on a speeding ticket he received one year ago. Gomez tried to call the court to resolve the problem, and then tried to pay online, but had no luck.

“They won’t take a payment of a penny online,” said Gomez. Man Almost Jailed Over A Penny - News Story - WFTV Orlando Click the link to read the rest.

Point being government is going to screw up Heath care, just like3 they did with the SS and Medicad.


FN you make some good points about SS. Check out this Link boortz.com/nuze/200410/10182004.html