Tax stamp requirement question?
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  1. Tax stamp requirement question?

    If I were to purchase a SBR that had a suppresser or silencer etc would I have to pay two tax stamps or one? What if it was integrally suppressed? If thats tha right word....

    Sent from my GT-P5113 using USA Carry mobile app

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  3. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by krimsingoste View Post
    If I were to purchase a SBR that had a suppresser or silencer etc would I have to pay two tax stamps or one? What if it was integrally suppressed? If thats tha right word....

    Sent from my GT-P5113 using USA Carry mobile app
    A suppressor is regulated completely independently of what firearm it is attached too. You can buy one 9mm suppressor and put it on whatever pistol or rifle you want. Therefore you would need two stamps, one for the rifle and one for the suppressor. If it was integrally suppressed, the barrel is treated as the suppressor for NFA purposes. You would then need one stamp to posses the integrally suppressed barrel/upper and one to put that upper on a "rifle" or stocked lower.

  4. One thing to consider - If you have an integral suppressor on a barrel which results in a total length of 16 inches or more (both free barrel and suppressor combined) then that would not require registration as an SBR on a rifle. If you have a similar integrally suppressed barrel (total 16 inches or longer) on a handgun - I would contact the BATFE to ensure that attaching a buttstock would be legal or not.

    In the past - before the Thompson case - the BATF always required you to register he pistol as a rifle when attaching a longer barrel and buttstock to a pistol. After the Thompson case they have allowed conversion back and forth (examples : Thompson Contender or AR handgun-to-rifle conversions) as long as the buttstock is removed before the shorter barrel is attached. The outcome of this case is what allowed production of the Glock, Hi-Point, and 1911 carbine conversions which were never available before.

    I believe you could legally attach a buttstock to a handgun AFTER attaching a barrel/suppressor combintation which is 16+ inches in length but I am only saying this from what I have seen and read about. I wouldn't do it without a letter from the BATFE in hand, approving the exact conversion I intend to make.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by Spartan View Post
    One thing to consider - If you have an integral suppressor on a barrel which results in a total length of 16 inches or more (both free barrel and suppressor combined) then that would not require registration as an SBR on a rifle. If you have a similar integrally suppressed barrel (total 16 inches or longer) on a handgun - I would contact the BATFE to ensure that attaching a buttstock would be legal or not.
    Not true the barrel must be 16+ inches with the PERMANENTLY attached suppressor part can be the tube or the monocore. Attaching a butt stock to a handgun with a barrel of 16+ inches is and has been legal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan View Post
    In the past - before the Thompson case - the BATF always required you to register he pistol as a rifle when attaching a longer barrel and buttstock to a pistol. After the Thompson case they have allowed conversion back and forth (examples : Thompson Contender or AR handgun-to-rifle conversions) as long as the buttstock is removed before the shorter barrel is attached. The outcome of this case is what allowed production of the Glock, Hi-Point, and 1911 carbine conversions which were never available before.
    COMPLETELY FALSE. It was always legal to do the swap. The issue with Thompson selling the "KIT" was that in the eyes of the ATF selling the parts as a KIT WITH the handgun was a defacto SBR. The case is cited below you may want to READ it before giving further advice on the subject. ( United States v. Thompson/Center Arms Co., 504 U.S. 505 (1992). )

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan View Post
    I believe you could legally attach a buttstock to a handgun AFTER attaching a barrel/suppressor combintation which is 16+ inches in length but I am only saying this from what I have seen and read about. I wouldn't do it without a letter from the BATFE in hand, approving the exact conversion I intend to make.
    Yes you can the barrel/ suppressor must me PERMANENTLY combined into ONE piece with a length of at least 16"..

    NOTE the order you do the swap is VERY important as doing it in the wrong order will make you a felon. To change a handgun into a long gun you must FIRST install a barrel of at least 16" in length then and only then can you attach the butt stock. When converting the long gun back to a pistol you must FIRST remove the butt stock then and only then the barrel. Doing it in reverse is making a NFA weapon and a felony. This warning is made clear on most modern handgun to long gun kits..

  6. Maine04619,

    I suppose you may not have been around firearms building as long as I have so for your information - here is a link showing a letter from the BATFE dated Oct 13, 2009 :
    .
    ATF opinion letter on stripped lowers for pistol builds and rubber cane tips on the extension/tube - AR15.COM
    .
    They clearly state that the legal issue is the assembly of a "weapon made from a rifle" - which could be an SBR, an AOW, or some other firearm (ie: no buttstock but overall length over 26" - therefore neither handgun nor AOW). This issue went away with the Thompson ruling. Before that people were advised to, when filling out the old 4473 form, to check the "handgun" box when purchasing an AR lower which they intended to build into a handgun.
    .
    Also, in my reply above I am refering to an "integral suppressor" which I clearly state needs to be a total length of 16 inches or more. Integral means it is either permanently attached or built onto the forward part of the barrel which is at least 16 inches long.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by Spartan View Post
    Maine04619,

    I suppose you may not have been around firearms building as long as I have so for your information
    I have been around and own all the aforementioned NFA weapons. Been collecting NFA for 20+ years.


    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan View Post
    - here is a link showing a letter from the BATFE dated Oct 13, 2009 :
    . ATF opinion letter on stripped lowers for pistol builds and rubber cane tips on the extension/tube - AR15.COM .
    They clearly state that the legal issue is the assembly of a "weapon made from a rifle" - which could be an SBR, an AOW, or some other firearm (ie: no buttstock but overall length over 26" - therefore neither handgun nor AOW). This issue went away with the Thompson ruling. Before that people were advised to, when filling out the old 4473 form, to check the "handgun" box when purchasing an AR lower which they intended to build into a handgun.
    As you yourself just stated the old way of doing it is If the stripped VIRGIN ar lower was listed as a HANDGUN then it was and thus could be made into a rifle and back again. If it was listed as a LONGGUN it was always such and could not converted to a HANDGUN without a stamp. When the 4473 changed in 2008 to include "OTHER FIREARM" this was made moot as now the status of the lower was nothing UNTIL the buyer built it into a complete firearm. Not sure what a cane tip has to do with the subject at hand. As to you're 26" this is the measurement that when gone UNDER a long gun can become a SBR. However there is NO ZERO NADA law saying a handgun can not be longer then ( insert # here). IE you can have a handgun with a OAL of 35 inches as long it is meant to be fired with one hand. The "loophole" you are pointing out the under 26" but not a handgun, long gun, SBR or AOW is a exception that was first used by the Thompson 1927-a5 non stocked weapon that had a OAL of over 26" with no stock and less then 16" barrel but DID have a forward grip. In recent years Franklin Armory used this to get there XO-26 into he market stamp free.
    .

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan View Post
    Also, in my reply above I am refering to an "integral suppressor" which I clearly state needs to be a total length of 16 inches or more. Integral means it is either permanently attached or built onto the forward part of the barrel which is at least 16 inches long.
    Again not always the case. Integral suppressors can be removed depending on the design. For example my Integral MKIII has the monocore and the tube as detachable parts. As it is a handgun the length is not a issue as it would be with my integral 10/22 where the barrel and the tube are one piece and the monocore can be removed without altering the barrel length. This is done to remove having to get a second stamp.

    Class over..








  8. #7
    You must have been the gunsmith for Bonnie and Clyde looking at your handiwork. Nice clean work.

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