is .380 enough gun? - Page 25
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Thread: is .380 enough gun?

  1. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flanmedic51 View Post
    . If the BG has armor on, it doesn't matter if the round has demonstrated 12" penetration through jello........
    If the BG has armor on, you need a rifle.

  2.   
  3. Why is this thread still going? .380 is enough gun. If you feel it's not then get something else.


  4. #243
    Quote Originally Posted by tricolordad View Post


    Too late. I already did.
    Congratulations.



    Who said that an assailant has to leave cover to do you harm? If he's got a gun, he doesn't need to leave cover to fire it at you.
    He does if you're aware of your surroundings and get off the X in situations where people are shooting at you. Why was he ambushing? There's no reason for an average citizen to be ambushed, except for if he is an..........ASSASSIN!

    And what is with this, "He's got to leave it to chase you..." crap?

    You said target behind cover, so I'm assuming that assassins are after you. Don't you run? Or do you stand there like life is a John Wayne movie?

    What kind of fool would leave cover to chase someone who is holed up and defending themselves with a firearm? Are you anticipating bayonet charges where you live?

    Again, you said he was a target behind cover. This is an ambush scenario, they're out to get you. Don't assassins have knives too?

    So now you are advocating that we carry a .22LR for SD/CCW?

    That's not at all what I was doing, but since you brought it up, WHY NOT? There's plenty of readily available information proving the adequate performance of .22lr, NOTHING to prove otherwise. You want proof? .22lr has been proven to perform adequately, if somebody is comfortable in their ability to hit the target repeatedly in vital areas with CCI Stingers from a 2.4" barrel (1.6 expansion factor, 8 inches of penetration vs. 10% ordnance gel... Source: Handgun Stopping Power, American Rifleman September 2012) and does so, who are you or I to say they shouldn't carry said weapon?! You can carry however you like, and everybody else can carry the way they like. Your opinion is not, and should not be offered in place of fact, if that's where you were going with that comment.


    Thank you, Captain Obvious!


    You're very welcome, Deputy Fife.
    It is hard to take seriously a post so full of nonsequitur. First you say that you weren't advocating the use of a .22 for SD

    Quote Originally Posted by tricolordad View Post
    So now you are advocating that we carry a .22LR for SD/CCW?

    That's not at all what I was doing
    then you say-

    Quote Originally Posted by tricolordad View Post
    ...but since you brought it up, WHY NOT? There's plenty of readily available information proving the adequate performance of .22lr, NOTHING to prove otherwise. You want proof? .22lr has been proven to perform adequately, if somebody is comfortable in their ability to hit the target repeatedly in vital areas with CCI Stingers from a 2.4" barrel (1.6 expansion factor, 8 inches of penetration vs. 10% ordnance gel... Source: Handgun Stopping Power, American Rifleman September 2012) and does so, who are you or I to say they shouldn't carry said weapon?! You can carry however you like, and everybody else can carry the way they like.
    The gelatin used in your source article was never calibrated (try finding where he says it is or a picture of the gelatin with the calibration BB) and Mann (the author) cites Marshall & Sanow (two of the most fraudulent buffoons in the business) as sources. Bad source, slugger. Try again.

    Quote Originally Posted by tricolordad View Post
    Your opinion is not, and should not be offered in place of fact, if that's where you were going with that comment.
    The very same could be said for your opinion, especially after it just fell flat based upon your source's inadequacies. It is the epitome of EPIC FAIL.
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  5. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by schadenfreude View Post
    It is hard to take seriously a post so full of nonsequitur. First you say that you weren't advocating the use of a .22 for SD

    That's because I wasn't. Anybody who read the actual post unemotionally can see that..
    then you say-

    yes, I did. And I'm certainly not wrong there. There's actual facts behind what I say, regardless of how you feel about it,

    The gelatin used in your source article was never calibrated (try finding where he says it is or a picture of the gelatin with the calibration BB) and Mann (the author) cites Marshall & Sanow (two of the most fraudulent buffoons in the business) as sources. Bad source, slugger. Try again.

    Again, your opinion.

    The very same could be said for your opinion, especially after it just fell flat based upon your source's inadequacies. It is the epitome of EPIC FAIL.
    Before you post about the legitimacy of somebody's sources, consider this: You haven't proven anything nor have you provided a source to back up your claims. Claiming that there's inadequacies without providing documentation in support of it is asinine. You must be one of those weirdos who sit in front of the computer and never leaves the house because those are the ONLY people who say "EPIC FAIL". You've all gotten way off topic by arguing the legitimacy of .22lr as a SD round when I said that if 22 was enough, then 380 is enough, even when I posted my sources, WHICH NONE OF YOU HAVE DONE. Until I see something other than speculation, opinion, or bravado, I am not going to reply. You can argue with yourselves.

  6. #245
    Quote Originally Posted by tricolordad View Post
    Before you post about the legitimacy of somebody's sources, consider this: You haven't proven anything nor have you provided a source to back up your claims. Claiming that there's inadequacies without providing documentation in support of it is asinine. You must be one of those weirdos who sit in front of the computer and never leaves the house because those are the ONLY people who say "EPIC FAIL". You've all gotten way off topic by arguing the legitimacy of .22lr as a SD round when I said that if 22 was enough, then 380 is enough, even when I posted my sources, WHICH NONE OF YOU HAVE DONE. Until I see something other than speculation, opinion, or bravado, I am not going to reply. You can argue with yourselves.
    Yes, please take your ball and go home. This game is for big boys only.

    If you post stupid crap like advocating the use of a .22 for SD or cite a source that relies upon fraudulent "research" conducted by a couple of hucksters, expect to be called on it.

    If you want to know why this-

    Quote Originally Posted by tricolordad View Post
    when I said that if 22 was enough, then 380 is enough, even when I posted my sources...
    is one of the most ridiculous statements ever posted on the 'net, all you need to do is check out what serious researchers like Dr Martin Fackler, Dr Gary Roberts, Charles Schwartz, Duncan MacPherson, et. al. have said on the subject instead of quoting poorly researched articles supported by disreputable sources like M&S.

    I've given you the names to research.

    Now, surprise us all by lifting your head out of the puddle of drool that it is presently lying in, read what legitimate professional researchers have to say on the subject and report back with a more informed perspective than you've demonstrated this far.
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  7. #246
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    Spoken like a true police officer, not used to being AVERAGE once the shift is over. Careful with that mouth, without your uniform on you might be mistaken for a punching bag.

  8. #247
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    More proof of the effectiveness of .22lr, which will then validate the more powerful .380acp round for SD
    Walther P22:
    Kauhajoki school shooting - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Virginia Tech massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Sawed off Ruger 10/22 & Ruger Mk II:
    Kip Kinkel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Rohm RG-14:
    Reagan assassination attempt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Quotes: "The Israeli military used a suppressed .22 LR rifle in the 1990s for riot control and to "eliminate disturbing dogs prior to operations", though it is now used less often as it has been shown to be more lethal than previously suspected.[14] "
    " Suppressed Ruger MK II pistols were used by the US Navy SEALs in the 1990s.[15]"
    Source of the quote: .22 Long Rifle - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Kids kills mom and sister with .22 revolver:
    Jake Evans tells 911 he shot and killed mother, sister - New York Daily News

  9. #248
    Quote Originally Posted by tricolordad View Post
    Spoken like a true police officer, not used to being AVERAGE once the shift is over. Careful with that mouth, without your uniform on you might be mistaken for a punching bag.
    Ah, there it is. It's always nice when I can "out" a "cop-hater" with so little effort.

    Citing Wikipedia in support of your ridiculous contention that .380 = .22 = "adequate for SD" is about as pathetic as pathetic gets. I didn't think that you could do any worse than your citation of M&S in support of your claim, but you proved that you could. Nice! Keep on digging- that shovel's getting shinier.
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  10. #249
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    I was never very accurate when I fired the old .45. I now carry a .380 or 9mm. I contend that a miss with a .45 is somewhat less effective than a .380 in the right eye socket. YMMV.

  11. #250
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    Quote Originally Posted by schadenfreude View Post
    Ah, there it is. It's always nice when I can "out" a "cop-hater"
    I don't hate cops, just pigs. Theres a difference between actual police officers and pigs. A police officer is respectful, courteous and professional and conveys himself in a professional manner and is quick to apologize when he was wrong...Ive met a few who are just as described. However, a pig is easy to spot because he's self absorbed, angry, foul mouthed and will try to convey his opinion or personal beliefs as law (or fact, in this case.). When proven wrong, a pig hurls insults and rehashes the same regurgitated garbage that got him into trouble in the first place. You are a pig. Anybody can get a pell grant and go to tech school for criminal justice. That's the problem.

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