Common Sense, reasonable regulation, etc... - Page 9
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Thread: Common Sense, reasonable regulation, etc...

  1. #81
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    NavyLT - Treo - Midnight; Are you all part of a treo (sic!) that troll the various forums for a juicey thread to attack? Me thinks yes! If you three want unconditional Constitutional Carry that allows the likes of mentally deranged individuals like Jared Laughner and Major Hasan, or the three kids in the Columbine High incident, then neither one of you three should be carrying either! I for one don't want Constitutional Carry with some kind of safe guards in place. In my 25 years of Military service and two wars, I've seen my share permissive carry results, and the results weren't pretty. You three need to tone down your retoric considerably...
    MSgt, USAF (ret), Life Member - NRA, Life Member - NAHC,
    Life Member - NCOA, Member - USCCA, Member - NCGR,
    Member - Oathkeepers

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  3. Quote Originally Posted by Treo View Post
    Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, California, Georgia, Indiana, Mississippi, Pennsylvania, South Dakota, Vermont, Washington, Wyoming And others I am sure Require no training what so ever before issuing a permit.

    No blood in the streets that I am aware of
    I can't vouch for the others, but, California requires a minimum 8 hour class which includes firing range qualification.

  4. Quote Originally Posted by Ed Hamberger View Post
    NavyLT - Treo - Midnight; Are you all part of a treo (sic!) that troll the various forums for a juicey thread to attack? Me thinks yes! If you three want unconditional Constitutional Carry that allows the likes of mentally deranged individuals like Jared Laughner and Major Hasan, or the three kids in the Columbine High incident, then neither one of you three should be carrying either! I for one don't want Constitutional Carry with some kind of safe guards in place. In my 25 years of Military service and two wars, I've seen my share permissive carry results, and the results weren't pretty. You three need to tone down your retoric considerably...
    Eric and Dylan of Columbine were 17 when that shooting happened. They couldn't legally buy guns in the first place. Schools were and still are "gun-free zones." Gun control laws didn't stop them, obviously. It isn't trolling if you're right :)

  5. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    If the 3/4 majority of states in this country repeal the 2nd Amendment, will I seek residence in another country? Definitely.
    What a hoot! You're so full of yourself you're about to pop. Put up or shut up. If it were true then you would have bailed on this country a long time ago. We're nowhere near your precious unrestricted, "constitutional carry" and we never have been, at least not in your lifetime. You've been complying just like the rest of us so give everybody here a break and stop your holier-than-thou pontificating. Oh, and save me the claptrap you're about to spew about how SCOTUS is getting us closer and closer to constitutional carry. That only happens in your grasping-at-straws fantasy.
    (Insert random tough-guy quote here)
    "See my gun?? Aren't you impressed?" - Anonymous sheepdog
    The hardware is the same, but the software is vastly different.

  6. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lakeland Man View Post
    Treo, if you haven't served, then you don't understand. If you HAVE, the we shouldn't be having this discussion.
    I have served and here we are having this discussion. Certain things are wrong in and of themselves and asking me (as a soldier) to do them relieves my of any obligation I have to follow my orders (think Mai Lai or Abu Graihb).

    In 1991 I was tasked (along w/ the rest of my unit A 3/11 FA) as part of a "reaction force" that was supposed to assist the Tacoma PD if a planned anti war protest in the town of Tillicum became a riot.

    I have often said the bravest thing I ever did in the Army was telling my Platoon SGT that I couldn't, in good conscience, raise my hand against American Citizens and that I wouldn't be doing so regardless of the consequences.

    Luckily the riot never happened, we were never called and my resolve was never tested.

    But , yes I do know whereof I speak
    Last edited by Treo; 03-18-2011 at 04:51 PM. Reason: TYPO
    See, it's mumbo jumbo like that and skinny little lizards like you thinking they the last dragon that gives Kung Fu a bad name.
    http://www.gunrightsmedia.com/ Internet forum dedicated to second amendment

  7. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Hamberger View Post
    NavyLT - Treo - Midnight; Are you all part of a treo (sic!) that troll the various forums for a juicey thread to attack? Me thinks yes! If you three want unconditional Constitutional Carry that allows the likes of mentally deranged individuals like Jared Laughner and Major Hasan, or the three kids in the Columbine High incident, then neither one of you three should be carrying either! I for one don't want Constitutional Carry with some kind of safe guards in place. In my 25 years of Military service and two wars, I've seen my share permissive carry results, and the results weren't pretty. You three need to tone down your retoric considerably...
    So you wish to restrict their first amendment right to free speech? Is that what your getting at? The world is changing for the better, more and more states and ditching the permit system and moving over to Constitutional carry.

    I find it amazing how people say this person only cares about this part of the Constitution and I care about the whole thing. Then that vary same person/people tell other people to tone down what they are saying. They are not saying anything that is against forum rules, they are speaking from the heart about HOW THEY feel about a topic/topic's.

    THEY MAY TAKE OUR LIVES BUT THEY'LL NEVER TAKE OUR FREEDOM!!!!!

  8. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Hamberger View Post
    NavyLT - Treo - Midnight; Are you all part of a treo (sic!) that troll the various forums for a juicey thread to attack? Me thinks yes! If you three want unconditional Constitutional Carry that allows the likes of mentally deranged individuals like Jared Laughner and Major Hasan, or the three kids in the Columbine High incident, then neither one of you three should be carrying either! I for one don't want Constitutional Carry with some kind of safe guards in place. In my 25 years of Military service and two wars, I've seen my share permissive carry results, and the results weren't pretty. You three need to tone down your retoric considerably...
    The Straw Man cometh

    A straw man is a component of an argument and is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position.[1] To "attack a straw man" is to create the illusion of having refuted a proposition by substituting it with a superficially similar yet unequivalent proposition (the "straw man"), and refuting it, without ever having actually refuted the original position.
    Jared Loughner was carrying his gun legally in Tucson. Hassan was not.

    4 states now have Constitutional Carry, several more have bills in their state legislatures as we speak.

    None
    of them make it legal for criminals or other prohibited persons to carry guns.

    Laws against carrying handguns never stopped me when I was carrying illegally they certainly don't stop criminals now.

    What, exactly does 25 years in the Airforce have to do w/ permissive carry?

    Got any other Straw men you'd like to trot out?
    See, it's mumbo jumbo like that and skinny little lizards like you thinking they the last dragon that gives Kung Fu a bad name.
    http://www.gunrightsmedia.com/ Internet forum dedicated to second amendment

  9. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Treo View Post
    I have served and here we are having this discussion. Certain things are wrong in and of themselves and asking me (as a soldier) to do them relieves my of any obligation I have to follow my orders (think Mai Lai or Abu Graihb).

    In 1991 I was tasked (along w/ the rest of my unit A 3/11 FA) as part of a "reaction force" that was supposed to assist the Tacoma PD if a planned anti war protest in the town of Tillicum became a riot.

    I have often said the bravest thing I ever did in the Army was telling my Platoon SGT that I couldn't, in good conscience, raise my hand against American Citizens and that I wouldn't be doing so regardless of the consequences.

    Luckily the rioy never happened, we were never called and my resolve was never tested.

    But , yes I do know whereof I speak
    Treo, not trying to hijack the thread, or even start an argument here, but I did not serve, so I am curious about your response. As a civilian, I could morally raise my hand against rioters in my town who were destroying my city, business, etc. I am guessing you are answering that way because of posse commitatus? (I know, I spelled it wrong)

  10. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by Treo View Post
    In 1991 I was tasked (along w/ the rest of my unit A 3/11 FA) as part of a "reaction force" that was supposed to assist the Tacoma PD if a planned anti war protest in the town of Tillicum became a riot.

    I have often said the bravest thing I ever did in the Army was telling my Platoon SGT that I couldn't, in good conscience, raise my hand against American Citizens and that I wouldn't be doing so regardless of the consequences.

    Luckily the rioy never happened, we were never called and my resolve was never tested.

    But , yes I do know whereof I speak
    So what you are saying is that you would "support and defend the constitution against all enemies, foreign or domestic" unless they were citizens? I won't throw hypotheticals at you as they are pointless unless they actually happen. However, I can think of a number of scenarios where, as a soldier, you would be honor bound by your oath to "raise your hand" against a citizen.

    IMHO, I took my oath a lot more seriously than you did. No offense intended.

  11. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Lakeland Man View Post
    So what you are saying is that you would "support and defend the constitution against all enemies, foreign or domestic" unless they were citizens? I won't throw hypotheticals at you as they are pointless unless they actually happen. However, I can think of a number of scenarios where, as a soldier, you would be honor bound by your oath to "raise your hand" against a citizen.

    IMHO, I took my oath a lot more seriously than you did. No offense intended.
    People such as your self. Who are willing to attack fellow citzens make me SICK! Solders who are willing to attack and murder US citizens because they where told to do so is a COPOUT!

    If I saw our own military doing such a thing I would no longer concider them our military. I would look at them and treat them like a foreign military. As such no quarter would be given!!

    This whole "I was only following orders" Is as I said COPOUT that people hide behind. Coming from a huge military family, mostly officers I can tell you they would not have been able to give such a order.

    THEY MAY TAKE OUR LIVES BUT THEY'LL NEVER TAKE OUR FREEDOM!!!!!

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