Ignoring Gun Buster signage. - Page 5
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Thread: Ignoring Gun Buster signage.

  1. #41
    Here in Texas, I abide by the Texas Concealed Handgun Laws. If a businsess wants to bar CHL holders from their premises, the state says they must do it with a compliant state approved sign. I follow the rules, so can they.
    "How a politician stands on the Second Amendment tells you how he or she views you as an individual... as a trustworthy and productive citizen, or as part of an unruly crowd that needs to be lorded, controlled, supervised, and taken care of." -- Rep. Suzanna Gratia Hupp (TX)

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  3. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruger357SP101 View Post
    Frankly anyone who ignores GB signs has no honor, no decency and no respect for the rights of others.

    Dont let these nut extremists speak for YOU !
    You're just some kind of special, aren't you.

    And no sir, read the following and realize you started out from the get go way beyond what you want to claim now.

    Have a LOVELY day funny man.

  4. #43
    "How a politician stands on the Second Amendment tells you how he or she views you as an individual... as a trustworthy and productive citizen, or as part of an unruly crowd that needs to be lorded, controlled, supervised, and taken care of." -- Rep. Suzanna Gratia Hupp (TX)
    I like your signature.

    I feel that if we gun owners set the bar high for ourselves, go out of our way to obey the law and follow even the rules we dont want to, that we leave no room for anyone to bring accusations against us.
    If we follow the rules and laws and present ourselves as honorable, then the voting public who doesnt own guns who arent in the Brady pack already can see that the crap that Brady pushes out is all lies.

    If we behave unruly...if we disgregard the rights of others just because we can...what does that say about us?
    If we seem to be 'unruly' then arent we giving the Brady campaign exactly what it wants to see ?

  5. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruger357SP101 View Post
    If we seem to be 'unruly' then arent we giving the Brady campaign exactly what it wants to see ?
    Then let's hope they never read what you consider to be rational and polite discussion.

    They might think we are all condescending and arrogant a-holes.

  6. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by doublebarr View Post
    You're just some kind of special, aren't you.

    And no sir, read the following and realize you started out from the get go way beyond what you want to claim now.

    Have a LOVELY day funny man.
    Well, heres what I know.
    I spent years disregarding the rights of others and being an general pain in the ass.
    One day I grew up.

    I dont speed.
    I dont litter.
    I wear a seatbelt every time.

    Why?
    To follow the rules.
    Not because I fear anyone, but to set an example..to show my children and grandchildren that there is a thing called honor....integrity....and it is more valuable than gold and silver or any material thing.

    I cant control what happens to me in this lifetime.
    But I CAN be someone who good people will respect.
    And I certainly can make sure not to give my enemies evidence against me.

    If that makes me funny or special, as you claim, then so be it.
    I just think it means I made a decision one day to do the RIGHT thing and stop being a child.
    Take that for what you will.

  7. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by PaxMentis View Post
    Then let's hope they never read what you consider to be rational and polite discussion.

    They might think we are all condescending and arrogant a-holes.
    Yeah....grasping at every straw we can to justify disregarding someone elses rights, I see ;-)

    I am condescending where it is called for.

  8. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by mg1cigar View Post
    I agree and disagree with you Ruger, and I completely understand your point.
    HUBS, makes a good point, define signage. I think the only legal NGA signs I've seen are on G'vmt and ABC stores. I discount static signage with a gun in a circle with a slash through it.
    Yes, we should obey the laws to keep our privilege to carry a concealed weapon, which I might add is unfortunate, the unfortunate word is "privilege". But, what about OUR rights, the right to bear arms, OUR Second Amendment Right as US citizens? Who gives the right to a store owner to privately take OUR RIGHT away from us? I want as many educated people carrying as possible. Go yell at the idiot CCW who drinks and carries.
    I want to know who gives that store owner that right!
    Listen, I've held two CCW's, one in NYS, and now in NC, and I will nit do anything that will jeopardize my right to carry, yes I listen to those dopey signs. As much as I hate it I will not carry where itis not permitted.
    In saying all this, we have to protect our rights as educated by law to carry a concealed weapon
    privileges requires a granting of by authority.

    rights requires you to do nothing to excercise it.

    ccw permit/license is to keep from being arrested as you exercise your right to carry

    SCOTUS:

    Murdock v. Pennsylvania, 319 US 105
    No state shall convert a liberty into a privilege, license it, and attach
    a fee to it.
    "A state may not impose a charge for the enjoyment of a right granted by
    Federal constitution. at 113, (1943).

    Shuttlesworth v. Birmingham, 373 US 262
    If a state converts a liberty into a privilege the citizen can engage in
    the right with impunity.

    Miranda v. Arizona, 384 US 436
    "Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be NO
    rule making or legislation which
    would abrogate them."

    Boyd v U.S., 116 US 635. "...constitutional provisions for the
    security of person and property should be liberally construed ... It is
    the duty of the courts to be watchful for the constitutional rights of
    citizens, and against any stealthy encroachment thereon."


    U.S. v. Morris. 125 F 322, 325. "Every citizen and freeman is endowed
    with certain rights and privileges to enjoy which no written law or statute is
    required. These are the fundamental or natural rights, recognized among
    all free people."

    Fuentes v. Shevin, 107 US 67 (1983).
    "A waiver of constitutional rights in any context must, at the very
    least, be clear; contractual language relied upon must on its face amount
    to a waiver."

    Mugler v. Kansas 123 U.S. 623, 659-60.
    "Our system of government, based upon the individuality and intelligence
    of the Citizen, the state does not claim to control him, except as his
    conduct to others, leaving him the sole judge as to all that only affects
    himself."

    Supreme Law School : E-mail : Box 036 : Msg 03678

    The above is common law.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by Ruger357SP101 View Post
    HAHAHAHA. Ah, thats good.
    Sorry gent but a couple posters here dont really mean much...and a few havent exactly take the extremist view you have...so please...
    Yeah, I am real extremist. I cover my gun up, go about my business, business owner is happy, I'm happy, nobody cares. Real extremist on my part.

    Paul Helmke could be standing right next to me reading the Rules of Conduct Sign at the entrance to the mall and my concealed firearm would be giving him no "ammunition" at all for anything because it is concealed!

    Why? Because I'm not screaming and foaming at the mouth and jumping up and down about anybody's rights or making a big deal out of something that is nothing.

    And, instead of making references to adultery, which is within the bounds of what a husband and wife vow to each other, and stealing which is against the law, and "keep off the grass".... why don't you just stick with the topic you brought up.

    And this whole argument you have about us fighting for our rights but carrying past a no firearms sign.... there is a huge difference between a shop owner expressing their desire in regards to firearms, and the government legislating the right to carry firearms away from everybody.

    BTW, I obey keep off the grass signs, because to not do so has the potential to damage the property of another. The only way my concealed handgun is going to damage anything of anybody else's is if I have to use it in self defense. And, if I am fighting a criminal, I would probably not be too concerned about keeping off the grass either...
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  10. #49
    Join Date
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    I'm going to take exception to everything you've said here, Ruger. By your mantra, I'm a rule breaker. Absolutely. Here's the reason why. I also live in a state where no gun signs have no force of law. I carry everywhere I'm legally allowed. I know the law, and where my state legislature has codified are legally off limits.

    There is no way in HECK I'm going to allow some spineless business owner to believe that a felon is going to turn around and not do some nefarious deed to their business because of some sign. Why? Because that same business owner has now attempted to disarm everyone. However, they don't see the alternative, which is to provide security for their patrons. Are they paying for private armed security? Are they screening everyone that comes in the door? NO. The furthest they go, because it doesn't cost them more than the paper it's printed on, is to post a meaningless sign saying no one can carry. I value my life more than I value some BS feel-good sign. My LIFE (notice I didn't say my right to carry) is MORE important that some policy or rule.

    Reason number two that I'll carry is because the ONLY enforceable property right the owner/lease holder has is for me to "pay now", "leave" and/or "don't return". Property rights must show a duty to comply that is enforceable. Sorry, but your "rule" isn't a right. Property rights are defined as the free possession and use of property without interference. By carrying my sidearm into a business, I am not denying them the possession or use, nor am I interfering with other customers being there. However, by attempting to request that I not bring a sidearm in (and it is a request), they are interfering with my property rights.

    Now, I freely admit that there are states that have defined and codified the fact that signage is legal and must be obeyed. These are enforceable and punishable by law. In those states, where one must follow legally, I personally agree that I would not be, as a law abiding citizen, carrying into those establishments. I would probably not carry because I wouldn't spend money there. However, because I carry my sidearm in my state more often than anywhere else, I will follow the laws of my state.

    I also don't give a flying fornication what the Brady bunch says, or does, or cares about. Nor do I care what any other group of their ilk thinks. If you believe that people will fall all over themselves in panic and terror because some mouthpiece stands and denounces carry, then the best option is to stand up and be a mouthpiece for the truth and the rights of your fellow gun owners. They stand up against us. I do my part by carrying my sidearm (OC, 95% of the time) and educating the public one interaction, one encounter, one business at a time. I don't have the resources the antis might have. But I'm a voice nonetheless. Why can't you be? Why do you need to bust our chops for what you perceive as wrongs being done to the public, especially when every circumstance is different and may not apply to every carrier?

    And as a final note, just in case you wonder about one voice. I personally found a business I shop at, and carried into on numerous occasions, that had posted "gun buster" signs. I cringed, and read the wording on the signs. Not only did the words they use make absolutely no sense, they couldn't even be bothered to look up the state laws they were posting them under. This was because the store was a chain, with it's corporate HQ in another state. I ignored their sign (although I politely went back to my car and retrieved a sweatshirt to cover up) and carried anyway. I attempted to discuss the matter with the local management. They shrugged and said "it's a corporate decision." So, I politely and strongly e-mailed the corporate offices and informed them not only of the lack of law that they were trying to lay their signage on, but the lack of sense it made to keep those willing to abide by such requests out of their stores when criminals wouldn't listen. I also stated that I'd be notifying a lot of other gun carriers to avoid their stores, and that I wouldn't be in either until the signs were gone.

    They responded that they hadn't thought about the fact that the law (even in their own state) didn't do as described in their signs, they expressed their unwillingness to upset law abiding citizens (and paying customers) and immediately removed all the signs from all their stores. Granted, I wasn't the only one who contacted them, but I was the first, and I was the one to get the first response. One voice can change the rules. Imagine what all our voices together can do?

  11. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    Yeah, I am real extremist. I cover my gun up, go about my business, business owner is happy, I'm happy, nobody cares. Real extremist on my part.
    You willingly and knowingly disgregard the rights of others who dont want your gun on THEIR PRIVATE property.

    Paul Helmke could be standing right next to me reading the Rules of Conduct Sign at the entrance to the mall and my concealed firearm would be giving him no "ammunition" at all for anything because it is concealed!
    irrelevant.
    If you cheat on your wife and no evidence exists that she'll ever find, did you do anything wrong or not?

    Why? Because I'm not screaming and foaming at the mouth and jumping up and down about anybody's rights or making a big deal out of something that is nothing.
    Well thats pretty stupid...and obvious. You dont CARE about anyone elses rights, so why would YOU make a big deal out of YOUR trampling on them?

    And, instead of making references to adultery, which is within the bounds of what a husband and wife vow to each other, and stealing which is against the law, and "keep off the grass".... why don't you just stick with the topic you brought up.
    Ahhh.
    So do you trample a mans yard who has a 'Keep off Grass' sign posted?

    And it is the same type of issue.
    Either a man DOES have honor and integrity...or he DOESNT.
    Either he goes out of his way to follow rules and respect others..or he DOESNT.
    clearly you dont.

    And this whole argument you have about us fighting for our rights but carrying past a no firearms sign.... there is a huge difference between a shop owner expressing their desire in regards to firearms, and the government legislating the right to carry firearms away from everybody.
    Wrong.
    In one case you get to go to jail possibly.
    In the other your just trampling on someone elses rights....something YOU dont seem to see any problem with.

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