The reality of Carrying Concealed - Page 2
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Thread: The reality of Carrying Concealed

  1. Quote Originally Posted by Grognard Gunny View Post
    Round and round and round we go! If we stop....... Nav LCDR wouldn't have anything to post! LOL!

    GG
    That's not true! There is always, "Do you carry with a round in the chamber?" and "Do you keep your magazines fully loaded, won't that wear out the springs?" and "If I sell a gun to my mother's ex-husband's neice in the state next to mine, I can just meet them at the border and hand it to them since they are 'family' right?"
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

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  3. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deserteagle:224562
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    Believe whatever you want to believe Deserteagle. History, statistics and research simply present FACTUAL information which proves that open carry will deter the majority of criminals. No where did I say it would deter all crime. But why would I choose to NOT engage in a behavior that was more likely to deter a criminal than not? Especially based on a "you'll be shot first" argument which has no basis in factual history, research or statistics?


    Comparing Joe Citizen carrying a firearm to a uniformed police officer carrying a gun is completely ludicrous.
    Lets take a look at your "factual" information from history, statistics, and research. Where is it?
    Oh an by the way, finding a couple stories written by journalists on the news is not research or factual.
    Go back and check out the other 5 OC vs cc threads. Read them all. There are facts and statistics from navy in those. There is absolutely no factual information against it.

    You say we will be targeted first, no real world examples though. We say we won't be targeted first, give actual examples that have happened in reality, that you write off as stories from journalist.

    If you don't want to use examples, evidence, fact, stories, statistics, etc...and want us to just believe your word, you are the narrow minded. Not us.

    The op article describes becoming aggressive as fast as possible as surprise. In that case OC can surprise the attacker as well. If it even gets to that stage of an attack, which is statistically low considering the criminal preys on the submissive. Which is also started in op article.

  4. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefighterchen View Post
    Go back and check out the other 5 OC vs cc threads. Read them all. There are facts and statistics from navy in those. There is absolutely no factual information against it.

    You say we will be targeted first, no real world examples though. We say we won't be targeted first, give actual examples that have happened in reality, that you write off as stories from journalist.

    If you don't want to use examples, evidence, fact, stories, statistics, etc...and want us to just believe your word, you are the narrow minded. Not us.

    The op article describes becoming aggressive as fast as possible as surprise. In that case OC can surprise the attacker as well. If it even gets to that stage of an attack, which is statistically low considering the criminal preys on the submissive. Which is also started in op article.

    I already proved to you guys what is wrong with the few things of 'evidence" you have presented here.
    I have also never said you will be targeted first so stop putting words in my mouth.

  5. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    That's not true! There is always, "Do you carry with a round in the chamber?" and "Do you keep your magazines fully loaded, won't that wear out the springs?" and "If I sell a gun to my mother's ex-husband's neice in the state next to mine, I can just meet them at the border and hand it to them since they are 'family' right?"
    Which should I mention first, CCW Badges or sheepdogs?

  6. #15
    Wow. I'm new on this site. Real new. But I'm not new to carrying, and have sixteen years of LEO experience. But in the short time I have been browsing the discussion threads here I have learned this: there are absolutely NO new arguments about concealed vs. open carry.

    If any if you long-time members catch me posting on a concealed vs. open debate thread, please deliver the old verbal double tap to the thorassic cavity, huh? Thanks.

  7. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    Yet none of those articles can actually cite a reference to where those incidents have actually occurred in reality. Amazing, eh? We've got the one gun-grab incident by the lunatic in the bar that is mention in the articles of this forum, BTW the carrier of the gun was illegally carrying his gun at the time. That's it.... one example where's it's actually happened. One incident in serveral decades. Yet some people like to theorize that it's going to happen to every open carrier.
    1) Was just my .02, as I mentioned. Also mentioned "to each his own".
    2) Not one time did I use the word "every" in the post you critiqued.
    3) You state "...that is mention (mentioned?) in the articles of this forum..." Sorry, but the articles I read were not on this forum or any other that I know of, "...other than postings on a forum", as I recall from my post. They were articles written by various LEO's, tactics trainers along with interviews from violent criminals in two different prisons. Yes, of course I am not at home so no, I don't have the articles in front of me. Soooooo...

    I think I will provide author names, publication and dates from this point on when refering to "articles I've read", it may not only help edjookate but might also prevent misunderstandings. It may delay a post, of which I know my fans will frown about. Relax, that was a joke and I do not have proof that I or anyone here has "fans". Anyway, if footnoted and verifiable information from the criminals mouth (as in one article on the subject of OC vs CC) is desired then that's what we'll bring, rather than merely eluding to them as I did. My bad.
    1)"When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty." -Thomas Jefferson.
    2)"Imagine how gun control might be stomped if GOA or SAF had the (compromising) NRA's 4 million members!" -Me. http://jpfo.org/filegen-n-z/nraletter.htm

  8. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by tuts40 View Post
    They were articles written by various LEO's...
    Because if it was said by a LEO, it must be true.

  9. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    That's not true! There is always, "Do you carry with a round in the chamber?" and "Do you keep your magazines fully loaded, won't that wear out the springs?" and "If I sell a gun to my mother's ex-husband's neice in the state next to mine, I can just meet them at the border and hand it to them since they are 'family' right?"
    Legit point! I believe I even got into the last "mag spring" discussion, now that I think on it.

    You DID neglect to mention the plethora of "What is the BEST......... (Insert favorite "topic" here, from Philosophy to mag holders.)" threads. At least one can examine a multitude of ideas..... Well.... At least what BEST works for that individual.

    Ain't it FUN, though? LOL!

    GG
    Fanatics of any sort are dangerous! -GG-
    Which part of "... shall NOT be infringed..." confuses you?
    Well now, aren't WE a pair, Raggedy Man? (Thunderdome)

  10. #19
    Just to "stir up the pot":

    The "deterrance" angle (usually proposed by Open Carriers as right and proper) has "proof" of it's effectiveness. (We are told.) This is true! However....

    1) The "deterrance" effect is logical, to logical persons. I use the example of "The Samurai's Dilemma" (which I have posted a couple of times in these forums) as logical examination of the deterrance effect.

    2) The most often "cited" proof has been those "studies", generally conducted with incarcerated persons as those being "surveyed".... In which it has been shown, repeatedly, by those surveyed, that from 60-80% of surveyed "cons" would prefer not to confront an armed citizen in the plying of their trade. (This, of course, leaves 20-40% who either plead the "fifth" or would NOT refrain from armed confrontation. Giving the indication that there are some BGs that either have no common sence or are rather secure in their weapons proficiency. Given that there is a paucity of socially acceptable "common sence" in BGs anyway........)

    I have often wondered, while reading the surveys mentioned above, how the answering of that survey would differed in results if, for instance, the "Surveyer" were to gain access to a BG gang HQ somewhere and propose the same questions to the assembled "soldiers". Would the "atmosphere" have the effect of drastically changing the resultant answers?

    Well.... ALL conjecture! I simply don't envision a "Surveyer" ever attaining said "other side of the coin" situational access.

    Just sayin'.

    GG
    Fanatics of any sort are dangerous! -GG-
    Which part of "... shall NOT be infringed..." confuses you?
    Well now, aren't WE a pair, Raggedy Man? (Thunderdome)

  11. #20
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    Think I said this already carry how you wish, horse is dead, no matter how much you beat him he will not rise up, take saddle and move on to NEW HORSE.

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