The reality of Carrying Concealed - Page 3
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Thread: The reality of Carrying Concealed

  1. Quote Originally Posted by Grognard Gunny View Post
    Just to "stir up the pot":I have often wondered, while reading the surveys mentioned above, how the answering of that survey would differed in results if, for instance, the "Surveyer" were to gain access to a BG gang HQ somewhere and propose the same questions to the assembled "soldiers". Would the "atmosphere" have the effect of drastically changing the resultant answers?

    Well.... ALL conjecture! I simply don't envision a "Surveyer" ever attaining said "other side of the coin" situational access.

    Just sayin'.

    GG
    Here's my conjecture on the survey results. I think the actual percentage of criminals who would be deterred by a visibly armed citizen is actually higher than the 55-60% that admit they would. Here's why. What reason would a criminal have for lying and saying that they would be deterred by the gun, when in reality they would not? Only one reason that I can theorize. They WANT people to carry guns. It makes sense that the more criminals who say that guns deter crimes, there will be more citizens who believe them and will arm themselves. Now, I don't believe this to be a valid reason for a criminal to lie, because crime statistics show that the more you disarm a society with laws, the higher the crime rate is. So from history, it is proven that criminals prefer victims who are disarmed. So why would they lie in a manner that would tend to cause Joe Citizen to go out and buy and carry a gun?

    Now, what are the theoretical reason that a criminal would lie in the other direction and say that a gun would not deter them when, in reality, it would? I suspect the reason is bravado, machoism and intimidation. It does nothing to enhance the fear and intimadation factor for a criminal to admit that they are deterred by anything. Fear and intimadation are huge tools that criminals use to get what they want. Why would they lie and say a gun will deter them, when all that would do is lessen their fear and intimadation factor? It would seem that lying and saying a gun won't deter them is more advantageous to the criminal. It also causes Joe Citizen to not arm themselves (at least visibly) with guns, if Joe Citizen thinks it isn't going to make any difference at all anyway.

    So, I believe that if a criminal is going to lie about deterrence, it is to their greater advantage to lie and say the gun won't deter them, than it is to lie and say the gun will deter them. That's why, I theorize (with no supporting evidence) that more criminals will be deterred knowing their intended victim has a gun than are willing to honestly admit the same.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

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  3. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare45 View Post
    Think I said this already carry how you wish, horse is dead, no matter how much you beat him he will not rise up, take saddle and move on to NEW HORSE.
    But..... HE SAID *insert pet peeve here* !!!!!!!

  4. #23
    I wonder if I can get 2 or 3 more posts here with this question.

    OC'ers say that the sight of them carrying openly will cause a criminal to go down the street and find another person upon which to commit their crime or will wait till the offending weapon has left the scene. CC'ers say that carrying concealed removes the possibility of the thug grabbing their gun or targeting them. If both are true then it stands to reason that OC does not prevent crime, only delays it. CC may cause the thug to re-think their plan to commit the crime because they do not KNOW if someone is carrying. Do they want to take that chance. The criminal may decide its not worth the risk and choose not to commit the crime.

    Yeah, I kn ow...its a stretch.

    For the record, I CC. Florida does not allow OC, but if they did, I would probably still CC. I prefer not to let people know I'm armed anyway. I have no issue with OC'ers though. If its their legal right to do so, then go for it. Personal choice.

    I don't care whether you CC or OC as long as you carry.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by Lakeland Man View Post
    CC may cause the thug to re-think their plan to commit the crime because they do not KNOW if someone is carrying. Do they want to take that chance. The criminal may decide its not worth the risk and choose not to commit the crime.

    Yeah, I kn ow...its a stretch.
    So, it sounds like the CCW badge is the best answer, then. It reminds the criminal that the potential victim MIGHT be armed and also maintains the omnipotent "element of surprise". After all, the badge might just be a nifty piece of bling-bling and the person really is not armed at all.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  6. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by G50AE View Post
    Because if it was said by a LEO, it must be true.
    I know. But there are some LEO's who have been around the block a few times, who have spoken at length with "thugs", who aren't in it for the excellent tax payer funded retirement package. Hell, some might be a downright great source of information about criminal behavior.

    I'd like to think your quip above was a quick and light-hearted LEO jab. If not, I'd like to mention that you forgot the other groups of authors mentioned... However, if some of the authors are LEO's and someone feels the information written should be ignored and is meaningless because the authors are LEO's, well who are we to think our own opinions rise above it? Why should YOUR written post OR MINE be worth any consideration? (If anyone takes a quote and wants to jab please quote this entire post and not one sentence. Credibility would be greatly enhanced)

    We ALL post our opinions i suppose, me included. Most of these posts (notice the word "most")are simply opinions. Funny thing tho that I've noticed is that a person could quote something in any given forum, this one included, that was written by a person who designs "widgits" and someone will find something to poo-poo about regarding the designers thoughts about widgits. After all, most poo-poo'ers are experts themselves, right? Yeah, widgits have little to do with tactical thinking (I am not an expert in either) but hopefully the idea behind the analogy will not be lost. ...I typed it very slowly.

    And yes, it's true in my original post on this thread I did not provide quotes, let alone author names, publication and dates as I already mentioned in this thread. I apologized for refering to the writings without doing such, and will not elude to writings in the future without author names, etc.

    I hope all of you, even the orificer, has a great day!
    1)"When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty." -Thomas Jefferson.
    2)"Imagine how gun control might be stomped if GOA or SAF had the (compromising) NRA's 4 million members!" -Me. http://jpfo.org/filegen-n-z/nraletter.htm

  7. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lakeland Man View Post
    I wonder if I can get 2 or 3 more posts here with this question.

    OC'ers say that the sight of them carrying openly will cause a criminal to go down the street and find another person upon which to commit their crime or will wait till the offending weapon has left the scene. CC'ers say that carrying concealed removes the possibility of the thug grabbing their gun or targeting them. If both are true then it stands to reason that OC does not prevent crime, only delays it. CC may cause the thug to re-think their plan to commit the crime because they do not KNOW if someone is carrying. Do they want to take that chance. The criminal may decide its not worth the risk and choose not to commit the crime.
    We must remember that even the death penalty has been found to not deter murderers.
    GOD, GUNS and GUITARS

  8. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by BC1 View Post
    We must remember that even the death penalty has been found to not deter murderers.
    How so? There has never been a case where someone who has been executed has committed a murder.

  9. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lakeland Man View Post
    I wonder if I can get 2 or 3 more posts here with this question.

    OC'ers say that the sight of them carrying openly will cause a criminal to go down the street and find another person upon which to commit their crime or will wait till the offending weapon has left the scene. CC'ers say that carrying concealed removes the possibility of the thug grabbing their gun or targeting them. If both are true then it stands to reason that OC does not prevent crime, only delays it. CC may cause the thug to re-think their plan to commit the crime because they do not KNOW if someone is carrying. Do they want to take that chance. The criminal may decide its not worth the risk and choose not to commit the crime.

    Yeah, I kn ow...its a stretch.

    For the record, I CC. Florida does not allow OC, but if they did, I would probably still CC. I prefer not to let people know I'm armed anyway. I have no issue with OC'ers though. If its their legal right to do so, then go for it. Personal choice.

    I don't care whether you CC or OC as long as you carry.
    If the criminal is intent on committing the crime, then yes it will only delay that criminal, and I am sorry for whoever he/she decides is an easier target than me. CC can't change intent either. CC might cause the criminal to have doubt when he is pursuing a victim, but so could a person who doesn't carry at all. The OC will cause a lot of doubt for the average criminal, or even if its only the slightest for those "hardened gangstas", and that doubt could very well send the criminal home to rethink life. The best practice to deter criminals is situational awareness. Stand up straight, keep your awareness up, stay confident. CC or OC should be practicing SA, because that will help you avoid most confrontations. I OC because I believe that will help me avoid most of the rest possible confrontations. Either case, CC or OC will end the confrontation if you use proper SA, drawing, aiming, and firing, if the crime still takes place. I do not believe in the element of surprise for this reason mainly (there are other reasons, but this is my top reason); how long should it take for you to pull your gun and fire the first 2 shots? Will the criminal have enough time to be surprised before they are dead (assuming you have good shot placement)? I practice to get 5-6 rounds off within 2 seconds at 5 yards, center mass hits.

    Answer yourself this, on here or in your head. Be truthful to yourself, immerse yourself in this fantasy day dream. If you were to commit a robbery, and you had a plan to rob the local bank inside the local grocery store. If you pulled into your parking spot, that you chose as the best grab and go get away spot, and you see a customer walk into the store with a handgun on their side. They are walking with confidence and intent, and seems to be in tune with their surroundings. The OC may even glance over at your vehicle that just pulled in. What would you do at that point?

    Grogard is right, there are people on each side that will not be changed. Some think I'm an idiot for how I think, I think others are idiots for how they think. So be it. You seem humble in your response, and so take my response humbly as well. I wish safe traveling for all my carrying brothers and sisters out there, even the idiots deserve to be safe :).

    Quote Originally Posted by G50AE View Post
    How so? There has never been a case where someone who has been executed has committed a murder.
    That was good!

  10. #29
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    Not going to throw fuel on the fire. My view is simple, if you are in an open carry state carry open if you like. The biggest thing for me is, I will back you up if needed, hoping you will do the same. Us against them and they suck, let them suck our lead as we (both open and cc) take back control.

  11. #30
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    It sure does! Well at least for that criminal which was convicted and the death penalty carried out! This is in reference to the death penalty not deterring murderers.
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