How many of you work at a job at says no weapons on it's grounds? - Page 2
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Thread: How many of you work at a job at says no weapons on it's grounds?

  1. #11
    Second, when you clocked out you are still on their property until you drive off.You may be on your own time but you are still in their parking lot and the rules still apply. Whether the rules are legal or not and whether they can search is a different question but having clocked out doesn't mean a lot.
    Like i said in the last post it's not posted and it's not a gun free zone. If I'm off the clock they can not tell me what to do. I'm just another customer paying for goods. If i was to carry when i was off the clock all they could do was ask me to leave. They would have no grounds to fire me for things i do off the clock.

    THEY MAY TAKE OUR LIVES BUT THEY'LL NEVER TAKE OUR FREEDOM!!!!!

  2.   
  3. #12

    carry in prohibited workplace

    First I am not a lawyer, am not an expert in NH law, and have not read the McD employee handbook.

    Having said that here are some thoughts.

    #1 You may be fired by your employer for any reason. The validity of the reason only matters as to whether you qualify for unemployment compensation. Unless the reason for your firing was related to an EEOC protected status you are out of luck.

    #2 If your employer states that employees are not allowed to carry weapons on company property (unless it specifically states while at work or while on the clock) and you carry "as a customer" the company can fire you and probably not have to pay unemployment.

    #3 An employer can include in the company handbook a clause forcing you to submit to a search of your person and vehicle on company property or face termination (I don't know if McD's does)

    With those thoughts in mind, if you are still willing to risk your job and carry then I would suggest the following:

    #A Do not tell anyone, ever, that you are armed. Not the guy who you think is your new best friend, not your mother, not anybody. Even someone hearing that you might be armed could be reason for your supervision to single you out.

    #B Make sure everything is legal. This means permits, ID, firearms, ammo, knives, and other weapons. If your work does catch on that you might be armed they will likely call the cops before confronting you. The police will do the search (for the officers protection of course) and then that knife that is just over the legal length or considered just a little too spring assisted turns losing your job into a criminal offense.

    I would also reconsider how you plan to re-arm after work. Unless it is very common for people to bring stuff from their car and then change (not to mention the privacy to arm where no co-worker will ever possibly see) then you will single yourself out. As for arming in the parking lot I am not a fan of that idea since if anyone does see they will either tell your work, or steal your stuff while you are at work.

    I work at a place that does not by policy allow employees to bring fire arms on-site and there is no possibility of parking off site. Access is controlled and employees and vehicles are subject to search. This is not a big issue for me most of the time but occasionally I have to head downtown right after work and would not be able to stop by home. Personally I keep my fire arm secured in a very well hidden and secured lock box in the passenger compartment of my car. If I feel the need to arm or disarm then I stop at a random location away from work where I can be reasonably sure no one will notice or comment.

  4. #13
    1 You may be fired by your employer for any reason. The validity of the reason only matters as to whether you qualify for unemployment compensation. Unless the reason for your firing was related to an EEOC protected status you are out of luck.
    That is true but at the same time i have read a few suits that on the grounds they are off the clock and at such time they become just another consumer paying for goods and services. I will look up the cases see if i can find them. Also while we are on the topic in some states your car considered a extension of your home.

    [An employer can include in the company handbook a clause forcing you to submit to a search of your person and vehicle on company property or face termination (I don't know if McD's does/QUOTE] Most companys who have something like that are companys that have stuff that employee's would still and could resell or get enouhg parts to make one of their own ( like ruger). Again even with that most also say if they have grounds to think you are stealing company goods. Ruger's factory in the next town over does not even have such a policy giving them the right o search cars. MCD has no such policy nor did i sign such paper work giving them the right to search my person and or car at any time with out a court ordered search warrant.

    If your work does catch on that you might be armed they will likely call the cops before confronting you. The police will do the search (for the officers protection of course) and then that knife that is just over the legal length or considered just a little too spring assisted turns losing your job into a criminal offense.
    They could call the cops all they want again i signed no such paper work letting them search me or my persons. The cops would show up and ask to search me or my car ( They would have no grounds for such a search and it would turn into herassment and would open then up to suits by me) So with out a court order to search my car with a list of what they are looking for and taking from me or my car no search would take place. Even if they jumped the hoops got the warrent and found a gun what then? They found a legal gun in side my car and i have a permit to carry ( even if i don;t have a permit it's still legal) If they did take away my permit i would then just open carry. As for the knife the legal length in NH last time i checked was around 7'' or something i show a guy carrying a hunting knife on his side the other day at pizza hut. I have no need for a knife that big. As for it being considered just a little too spring assisted i don't see that happing seeing as how Walmart sells them. Look up Terry VS Ohio the police must have grounds to think a crime has been commited or is about to take place. A person just having a gun is not enough grounds for a search..

    The Court assessed the reasonableness of the police activity here by comparing it to activity that would ordinarily require a warrant. “... in justifying the particular intrusion the police officer must be able to point to specific and articulable facts which, taken together with rational inferences from those facts, reasonably warrant the intrusion.” In a situation where the police obtained a warrant, they would have brought these facts and inferences to the attention of a judicial officer before embarking on the actions in question. Post hoc judicial review of police activity is equally facilitated by these facts and inferences.

    The Court also emphasized that the standard courts should employ is an objective one. “Would the facts available to the officer at the moment of the seizure or the search warrant a man of reasonable caution in the belief that the action taken was appropriate?” Lesser evidence would mean that the Court would tolerate invasions on the privacy of citizens supported by mere hunches—a result the Court would not tolerate. Moreover,

    And simple “ ‘good faith on the part of the arresting officer is not enough.’ ... If subjective good faith alone were the test, the protections of the Fourth Amendment would evaporate, and the people would be ‘secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects,’ only in the discretion of the police.” — quoting Beck v. Ohio, 379 U.S. 89 (1964)
    The reasonableness inquiry takes into account the “nature and extent of the governmental interests involved,” including the general interest in crime prevention, the officer’s specific concern for his own safety, the citizen’s interest in his own privacy and dignity, and the extent to which the particular search in question intruded upon those interests. “Our evaluation of the proper balance that has to be struck in this type of case leads us to conclude that there must be a narrowly drawn authority to permit a reasonable search for weapons for the protection of the police officer, where he has reason to believe that he is dealing with an armed and dangerous individual, regardless of whether he has probable cause to arrest the individual for a crime.”

    Even searches that start out as reasonable may “violate the Fourth Amendment by virtue of their intolerable intensity and scope.” Thus, the scope of the search must be justified by the circumstances that led the police to undertake it in the first place.
    [quoteJustice White joined the opinion of the Court but suggested that

    “There is nothing in the Constitution which prevents a policeman from addressing questions to anyone on the streets. Absent special circumstances, the person approached may not be detained or frisked but may refuse to cooperate and go on his way. However, given the proper circumstances, such as those in this case, it seems to me the person may be briefly detained against his will while pertinent questions are directed to him. Of course, the person stopped is not obliged to answer, answers may not be compelled, and refusal to answer furnishes no basis for an arrest, although it may alert the officer to the need for continued observation.” (392 U.S. 1, at 34).
    With regard to the lack of obligation to respond when detained under circumstances of Terry, this opinion came to be regarded as persuasive authority in some jurisdictions, and the Court cited these remarks in dicta in Berkemer v. McCarty, 468 U.S. 420 (1984), at 439. However, in Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial District Court of Nevada, 542 U.S. 177 (2004), the Court held that neither of these remarks was controlling in a situation where a state law required a detained person to identify himself.
    ]
    [quoteJustice Douglas strongly disagreed with permitting a stop and search absent probable cause:

    “We hold today that the police have greater authority to make a ‘seizure’ and conduct a ‘search’ than a judge has to authorize such action. We have said precisely the opposite over and over again.” (392 U.S. 1, at 37).
    “To give the police greater power than a magistrate is to take a long step down the totalitarian path. Perhaps such a step is desirable to cope with modern forms of lawlessness. But if it is taken, it should be the deliberate choice of the people through a constitutional amendment.” (392 U.S. 1, at 38). ][/quote

    THEY MAY TAKE OUR LIVES BUT THEY'LL NEVER TAKE OUR FREEDOM!!!!!

  5. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Indianapolis
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    Quote Originally Posted by S&WM&P40 View Post
    You did what for 12 years?
    US Military, Hospital Corpsman
    M1 Garand, Kimber Custom Carry II, Ruger P-95, Mossberg Persuader 12ga., Charles Daly 12ga(My gobbler gobbler)
    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/10/311.html

  6. #15
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Panhandle, Idaho
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    Employees can't carry at my work, I work graveyard from 9pm to 8am. I work for a large sporting goods chain which sells guns, but no employee is allowed to be armed. Just the way it is. Most of the guys have ccws and leave their weapons in the car but I just don't bring mine, I live only ten minutes away and it's light out when I drive home.

    On the other hand we are allowed to carry knives, because we use them at work (either knives or box cutters) so I always have a folder plus my pocket knife with me.

    I don't even carry when in the store on my off days, not worth the hassle. In those cases I will have my gun but I leave it in the car.

    I have to say I lived in California for 48 years and never carried there, so not carrying at work now is no big deal to me. California (LA) was a whole lot more dangerous than Idaho.

  7. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
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    Nevada
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    As the article said, can you say, "McStupid?" lol

  8. #17
    wolfhunter Guest
    Company policy says, "No weapons on company property." FL state law says, "CWL holders may keep their weapon in a locked vehicle." To those who ask, I reply, "I don't carry at work." (Work is inside a limited access, fenced compound)

  9. #18
    I work in a non-posted, but company policy "Gun Free Zone". We are owned by an out-of-state company that does work for the petrochemical industry, so they made a blanket policy to cover all employees. They do not have much to do with day-to-day operations.

    That being said, we are locally run, and my direct management has about 95% of the authority when it comes to personnel issues. Officially, we are to be fired on the spot if we get caught carrying. Unofficially, "Concealed means concealed".
    Victory rewards not the army that fires the most rounds, but who is the more accurate shot. ---Unknown

  10. #19
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Cedar Hill, TN
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    31
    I am very thankful that I work for a small private owned business.. I open carry everyday in the office. In Tn we can OC or CC with our HCP.
    Since there are 13 women and only 1 guy (do not feel sorry for him) - everyone says they are thankful that I carry daily. Our office is not in the best area of East Nashville.....
    I wish there was a cut and dried answer to you question/situation. I would have to agree with most of the posts..... CC and tell no one. Hopefully, you will never get into a situation where you will have to use it, and expose yourself.

  11. #20
    Besides, if you work at McDonalds, it's not like they have a strict "Tuck in your shirt" policy. An IWB holster and an untucked shirt go a LOOONNNNGGG way towards personal safety. You're always inside, so wind gusts won't give you away. You're rarely finding yourself in such a position that high reaches would drag your shirt above your waist. And if it comes down to it, you have an untreatable condition where tight-fitting clothes cause you severe claustrophobia. That's not made-up crap, either. It's a truly diagnosable condition. If they make a fuss about it, get a doctor's note saying you must keep your shirt untucked to prevent a panic attack.
    Victory rewards not the army that fires the most rounds, but who is the more accurate shot. ---Unknown

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