Inform the officer or not when concealed carry? - Page 21
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Thread: Inform the officer or not when concealed carry?

  1. #201
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    South Carolina/Charleston
    Posts
    2,388
    Hey r4fthrs: Your comments about the Indiana LEO who did not even ask to see your CCW is probably the 99.9% reaction from LEOs. I'm sure there are some "very strange" LEOs out there who do not belong in LE but, from some of the posts on this thread, you would think it is rampant. I know in SC you are required to show CCWP IF you are CC, but it just makes sense to me to show my CCWP along with my driver's license---I guess to each his own. Bottom line---obey traffic laws and you won't get stopped in the first place. In over 50 years of driving I can recall 3 cases of being stopped, so odds are that I will never be in a position to worry about this situation.

  2.   
  3. cpl

    Quote Originally Posted by Jamez View Post
    This is correct. You don't tell him you have a good chance that you will lose your CPL.
    And also take your gun.

  4. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by joelevi View Post
    I am not a lawyer. The following is my opinion.

    If you are in a state that requires a permit to carry a firearm, when the officer asks you for your license and registration also pass him/her your carry permit. If they then ask you if you are carrying a firearm you can reply that you have a permit and are legally allowed to do so. It's not answering their question per se, but it is notifying them that you are legally allowed to do so.

    If they ask again, you can either respond by asking "am I legally required to answer that?" or answer specifically in a manner such as "my sidearm is on my right hip". - JoeLevi.com, Sitting Duck Policy | Are you a Sitting Duck?
    Handling the situation in this manner is clearly setting up an adversarial situation. You are setting yourself up to get pulled out of the car and to get any potential ticket they might have stopped you for in the first place. "Yes, sir. No, sir" is the only way to go to avoid ****** from the officer and his/her partner. No one, especially LEO, likes a wiseguy.

  5. #204
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Eastern North Carolina
    Posts
    268
    Quote Originally Posted by kelcarry View Post
    ---obey traffic laws and you won't get stopped in the first place. In over 50 years of driving I can recall 3 cases of being stopped, so odds are that I will never be in a position to worry about this situation.
    Here in NC, "license checks" (actually sobriety checks) are common. Both the State Troopers and the County Deputies do them regularly.

    I haven't been stopped for a traffic violation in over 20 years, but I get stopped at license checks about once month.

    bill

  6. #205
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    South Carolina/Charleston
    Posts
    2,388
    Hey jrice862: Your reply to joelevi was right on. For heavens sake if you are an LEO and stop a car at night and get a pile of legalese gobblygook from a smarta__, you are going to be VERY suspicious and are going to deal with this motorist in an extemely aggressive and suspicious manner that only makes things worse for the driver. I hate to do this on this forum in somewhat denigrating a fellow forum member, but his comments make me think that either he is one of those posters who like to "tongue in cheek/pull our leg" with exaggerated ridiculous comments or, since he is from MA, the home of Kerry and Kennedy, he can't help himself. PS: Hey joelevi--I apologize now if I have insulted you in a manner that has you upset with my comments.

  7. #206
    Quote Originally Posted by joelevi View Post
    If you are in a state that requires a permit to carry a firearm, when the officer asks you for your license and registration also pass him/her your carry permit. If they then ask you if you are carrying a firearm you can reply that you have a permit and are legally allowed to do so. It's not answering their question per se, but it is notifying them that you are legally allowed to do so.

    If they ask again, you can either respond by asking "am I legally required to answer that?" or answer specifically in a manner such as "my sidearm is on my right hip".

    Remember, when you answer, you are required to answer truthfully; HOWEVER, LEOs are under no such requirement to be truthful to you. Furthermore, anything you say WILL be used against you. So unless you're asked specifically, it's best not to answer; in other words, don't volunteer information.

    - JoeLevi.com, Sitting Duck Policy | Are you a Sitting Duck?
    Over the course of these 200+ posts, it is no secret that my preference is to NOT inform, at least in the beginning of the stop. But I'll agree with the others that your suggestion here is downright foolish. You end your post with "don't volunteer information." But isn't that exactly what you are doing by handing over your permit? If you are going to hand him your permit, then be prepared and willing to tell him if you are carrying, and where it is. Otherwise, keep your permit in your pocket. Don't send mixed messages. Don't try to lure the LEO into some sort of civil rights trap. Basically, don't be an *******.
    The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the Constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first. - Thomas Jefferson

  8. Ultimmer makes a very good point

    It does seem pretty inconsistent to give up the CCW, then play smart aleck when the obvious next question is asked. If you're trying to get the stop off to a good start, you just shot yourself in the foot (pun intended).

    In my opinion, (which is given freely and therefore worth every penny) there shouldn't be any question who is in charge of the traffic stop. Obviously, it is the LEO. I think providing the CCW, and advising the officer where my gun is located when he/she asks and asking them how they want tpo proceed (don't use the word gun - weapon, sidearm, or "it" are all better - see the prior post regarding Massad Ayoob's advice re: rookie cops hearing the word gun), is sensible and logical. It tells the LEO that you are law-abiding, cooperative, that you are letting them control the encounter, and that you are not a threat to them. Since i carry a pistol nearly all the time, this is just my solution to avoiding all the negatives that could develop if the officer sees my pistol accidentally (very bad, unless you like the taste of asphalt or lead), or (bad, but not as bad) runs my DL and learns about the CCW i didn't mention to them.

    No, in CT advising the officer is not required. No, they really don't "need" to know. No, i am no threat to them. However, i also realize how nasty their job can be; nearly everyone has read of a LEO being shot and killed during a traffic stop. Every time they approach a car, the question is running somewhere in their mind - is this the guy who's going to blow me away? - so i feel that advising can help take the edge off that. From a practical perspective, it may save me a ticket or maybe not. But from a logical perspective, and from posts made by current and former LEOs, it is reasonable to expect that a potential cop-killer will conceal and not advise, where a law-abiding citizen who advises is likely not a cop-killer. If you can remove that concern from the LEO's head up front, why not do so?

    That's my .02. Others raise good points about staying concealed, which i respect. I just don't happen to agree with them.
    "Laws that forbid the carrying of arms ... make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants ... for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." - Thomas Jefferson

  9. Quote Originally Posted by kelcarry View Post
    Hey r4fthrs: Your comments about the Indiana LEO who did not even ask to see your CCW is probably the 99.9% reaction from LEOs. I'm sure there are some "very strange" LEOs out there who do not belong in LE but, from some of the posts on this thread, you would think it is rampant. I know in SC you are required to show CCWP IF you are CC, but it just makes sense to me to show my CCWP along with my driver's license---I guess to each his own. Bottom line---obey traffic laws and you won't get stopped in the first place. In over 50 years of driving I can recall 3 cases of being stopped, so odds are that I will never be in a position to worry about this situation.
    More and more states are passing laws that DO permit random stopping of vehicles to check for alcohol consumption, our #1 killer on the roads. And having said that, I have to agree with you that in some 40 years of driving I can only recall being stopped perhaps 2 or 3 times for sobriety inspection and once when they appeared to be looking for someone. Still, when stopped for any reason it is my policy to hand over my driver's license, registration and insurance AND my CCW permit if I have a firearm in the car. At the border (I cross back and forth into Canada regularly) I always present my passport and firearms papers up front (the declaration is required by law in both directions) and have never been inspected to date. The most they have asked is "where?" and I tell them in a safe in the back of the van ($49 Harbour Freight). Once, mind you, they did look to see if I really did have a safe but never asked me to open it.

    Be safe.

  10. #209
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Posts
    6
    I am from Oklahoma City, Oklahoma.
    I was taught that you must inform the officer as soon as you are approached.
    I don't know of any reason why I would want to break the law and risk losing it.
    They probably know you carry before they approach your car.
    Chuck

  11. joelevi made a few good points. Giving the government something that you are not required to do will only diminish ones constitutional rights in the long run.



    "Today the primary threat to the liberties of the American people comes not from communism, foreign tyrants or dictators. It comes from the tendency on our own shores to centralize power, to trust bureaucracies rather than people."
    –George H. Allen

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