Inform the officer or not when concealed carry? - Page 32
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Thread: Inform the officer or not when concealed carry?

  1. Quote Originally Posted by Glock Fan View Post
    First of all, welcome to the forum. If you haven't done so already, I strongly recommend that you check out this video: Donít Talk To The Police! Video by Professor James Duane : Constitutionals

    Though I'm all for cooperating with the police to the best of my ability, I won't do so if it's gonna mean that I have to give up my Civil Rights. I've worked too long and too hard to get to where I am today. Past experience has taught me that if my freedom is at stake, I should have an attorney present to ensure that I preserve my rights.

    Rock on as you wish, I strongly recommend that others seriously consider the consequences of taking your advice
    I've seen the video and understand exactly where he is coming from. However, there is a big difference between a traffic stop and a direct criminal investigation that you may or may not be linked with.

    In a traffic stop, the officer IS looking for violations of the law, let there be no doubt. Fortunately, it is a completely different mindset and unless you run into a LEO that is willing to create fake charges or you really do have something to hide ... well, then you have nothing to hide. On the off-chance that you do meet such a horrid LEO, then 'evidence' can be planted and your refusal to do more than the minimum required of you (refusal of searching the car, refusal of a simple explanation of where you were and where you are going, etc.) is just going to add credence to his case against you.

    Quote Originally Posted by G50AE View Post
    In general one should never talk to a law enforcement officer unless in the presence of an attorney. This rule of thumb applies to all types of law enforcement contact, be it with the BATFE, DEA, local police or the dog catcher.
    Which sounds like a difficult way of living your life to me. I'm just curious, but what if everyone felt the need to exercise their rights on every occasion they were in contact with a LEO? How many murders would be solved? Think of it like this:

    LEO=""Excuse me sir, there was a shooting next door and a 12 year old girls body was found brutally raped and murdered. We are going door to door trying to find out if anyone heard or saw anything ...""
    YOU=""I have nothing to say unless I have an attorney present. Am I free to go or do I need to call my attorney?""

    Just because you have a right and it can protect you in many cases, does not mean that common sense should not be applied.

    What about a less extreme scenario? Think of it like this:

    A LEO pulls you over and as far as you know, you have done nothing illegal. The cop slowly walks up to your window.
    YOU=""May I ask why you pulled me over, officer?""
    LEO=""We received a call that the local bakery (five blocks away) was robbed at gunpoint and the robber fled in a vehicle that matches the one you are driving. May I ask where you are coming from and where you are headed?
    YOU=""I have nothing to say unless I have an attorney present. Am I free to go or do I need to call my attorney?""

    The same applies to a traffic stop. In my experience, 99% of the time, the officer doesn't want to search your vehicle ... he is looking for a panicked reaction. He is trying to discern if you have anything to hide ... you know, to try and keep people with illegal guns and drugs from doing all the bad things that they do.

    Quote Originally Posted by kelcarry View Post
    Personally, being stopped in a car because I did something wrong (in my 68 years I have been stopped 5 times and I was wrong in every one of them) does not rise to the need for an attorney--only a need to be civil and respectful of an LEO who does not know who the heck you are except for the fact that you committed a traffic violation.
    Well said and I couldn't agree with you more. :)

    Quote Originally Posted by G50AE View Post
    <snip> but it won't cut it in the People's Republic of South Carolina. You never know what you might say that will set off a police officer and then you end up dealing with a roid-raging overgrown schoolyard bully. <snip>
    I stayed in SC (Beaufort and Columbia) for around two-three months and I was fortunate to never have run into that. Every cop that pulled me over was polite and professional ... and add to that I never got a ticket while there. I'm not sure if I was extremely lucky or if you have been extremely unlucky. Regardless, I hope your experiences change for the better!

    Quote Originally Posted by maybejim View Post
    <snip> but everything to do with 1. irritating leftists, and 2. reminding people of the socialistic/communistic direction Kalifornia is headed in. <snip>
    Just wanted to thank you for doing anything to stand in the way of the extremely progressive mindset in Ca.

    Quote Originally Posted by osmosis View Post
    I think you've painted a pretty good picture as to why you were being searched in the first place AND most likely why you dont hold a license to carry as a result.
    Great way to draw conclusions! I STATED why I was searched and it was the only time in all the times I've been pulled over. And the reason I don't have a license is because when I was 19 (14-ish years ago) I broke a very serious law. Did I know better? Of course I did. The problem was, I didn't truly understand the consequences. That is why I don't have a license to carry and I am getting that fixed now. I could have done so for years and years now, but I have a baby on the way and my wife and I want a firearm both in the house and on our person.

    I completely explained those things, so unless you are saying that I'm a 'bad' person ... I don't see the point to your post.

    ConstitutionComeHome

  2.   
  3. #312

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by osmosis View Post
    I think you've painted a pretty good picture as to why you were being searched in the first place AND most likely why you dont hold a license to carry as a result.
    Couldn't have said it better, Osmosis!

  4. #313
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    Quote Originally Posted by ConstitutionComeHome View Post
    I've seen the video and understand exactly where he is coming from. However, there is a big difference between a traffic stop and a direct criminal investigation that you may or may not be linked with.
    From a legal standpoint, there isn't much difference. If a cop approaches you, it IS a criminal investigation. His job is to find anything you've done that is against the law, and arrest you or cite you for it.

    Have you ever gone through a DUI checkpoint? Have you ever noticed how, even after it is well understood that you haven't been drinking, the cop asks you questions like "where are you coming from?" and "where are you going?"? The reason why is so he can detain you further if you seem nervous, or tell him that you've come or are going to a high-crime or high-drug area.

    During a traffic stop, I've been asked if I had any guns, knives, flamethrowers or bombs in the car. This was before I ever owned a gun. I answered no, but remembered later that I had a pocket knife with me. Guess what - if he found that, I lied to a cop and that's a crime, even if it was completely unintentional.

    So that's why you never talk to the police unless you are directed to by either your attorney or by a judge in a courtroom.

    When the red and blue lights come on, it doesn't mean they're coming up to you for some friendly banter.

  5. #314
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    Hey Y'all: This is a really big merry go round. I do not carry my CCWP with me all the time (obviously when I am not CC). In the same vein, if I have it on me and am not CC there is no reason to show it. In SC, as stated, you must show your CCWP, if CC, when you show your drivers license--plain and simple--black and white--no excuses. Odds are if you are CC and you show the CCWP, the LEO will thank you and continue with your driving infraction or whatever. If he should ask to see firearm, I do not believe it is a requirement but, to me, it makes sense not to be negative or argumentative (ie I want to see your supervisor first). Just that much longer you sit in your car when you have better things to do. If it tweaks your legal ego, have at it.

  6. #315
    Quote Originally Posted by kelcarry View Post
    Hey Y'all: This is a really big merry go round. I do not carry my CCWP with me all the time (obviously when I am not CC). In the same vein, if I have it on me and am not CC there is no reason to show it. In SC, as stated, you must show your CCWP, if CC, when you show your drivers license--plain and simple--black and white--no excuses. Odds are if you are CC and you show the CCWP, the LEO will thank you and continue with your driving infraction or whatever. If he should ask to see firearm, I do not believe it is a requirement but, to me, it makes sense not to be negative or argumentative (ie I want to see your supervisor first). Just that much longer you sit in your car when you have better things to do. If it tweaks your legal ego, have at it.

    but...isn't it safer all around if nobody handles the firearm? When you hand a firearm to a friend to see it, you empty it first right? Handing a loaded firearm to somebody who may be unfamiliar with it just doesn't seem like a good idea...and I doubt LEO will allow you to handle it enough to unload it for safety. "I'd rather keep it holstered for everybody's safety" doesn't sound negative or argumentative.

  7. #316
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    Hey mrjam2jab: Sorry if my post was misunderstood. My main point is to just do whatever the LEO wants me to do. If, for some reason he wants to actually handle my firearm, I would ask him if he wants me to unload the firearm. Basically, whatever he wants, I will do. I'm just not going to get into a discussion of 2A, state laws, asking for a supervisor, etc etc. He is in charge, I do not feel my liberties are at stake, and if I have been stopped, more than likely I violated traffic laws so who in the heck am I to be crying about legalities.

  8. #317
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelcarry View Post
    Hey mrjam2jab: Sorry if my post was misunderstood. My main point is to just do whatever the LEO wants me to do. If, for some reason he wants to actually handle my firearm, I would ask him if he wants me to unload the firearm. Basically, whatever he wants, I will do. I'm just not going to get into a discussion of 2A, state laws, asking for a supervisor, etc etc. He is in charge, I do not feel my liberties are at stake, and if I have been stopped, more than likely I violated traffic laws so who in the heck am I to be crying about legalities.
    Kelcarry A+++
    mrjam2jab A+++

    So, I live in Calif and I am not required to notify LEO I am CCW if stopped or approached. This is according to info given out in this fourm. It may or may not be true. However, the county that issued my CCW Permit requires you to notify. So I will.

    First of all I am not afraid to talk to LEO's of any jurisdiction. I would perfer not to deal with LA City or Sheriff, San Francisco or Sacramento City/Sheriff. But that does not mean I am afraid of what they might do.

    These folks have a very tough job to do. I'm sure not going to do something that makes it harder. I am not concerned that any LEO in Calif would trump up a charge just because I CCW. If I felt that way I would not have requested the permit in the first place.

    At night the interior lights come on, the tinted windows (all 4 of them) come down. Hands are on the steering wheel. This is not because I am afraid of them. This is because I know that if I do these things their job is a bit easier. If you would just put yourself in their shoes once in a while I really think most of this 'never talk to the cops' stuff would go away. Just my opinion. Your mileage may vary.

  9. #318
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    Here in Nevada, your plates and CCW permit link up when he runs them. I think it's a good idea.

    I have only been stopped once (random DUI check) in Florida (where I have a second home and resident CCW permit). I that instance, I placed both hands on the top of the steering wheel and informed the Highway Patrolman that I had a concealed firearm in my center console.

    He asked me to step out of the car, where he checked my CCW and driver's license...also noting that I was not DUI. He didn't ask for my car registration, but thanked me for telling him about the firearm. I was on my way in five minutes.

  10. #319
    Quote Originally Posted by rayven View Post
    So that's why you never talk to the police unless you are directed to by either your attorney or by a judge in a courtroom.

    When the red and blue lights come on, it doesn't mean they're coming up to you for some friendly banter.
    Well said.

  11. #320
    Quote Originally Posted by barlitt8 View Post
    Yes, tell the officer you are carring,Do you have to be sensitive too? both hand on the wheel, they appreciate that plus if they find out by accident it can get ugly, as far as the dmv flaging tags to identify us makes us prone to theft and puts us at risk to the bad guys!
    Handgunlaw.us

    Someone has already answered this question, and the answer depends on your State. Missouri requires no notification. Don't even mention it! When the officer comes up to your window he has already run your plates, and knows that you have a CCW. Put your hands on the top of the steering wheel where he can see them. Don't even, while the officer is approaching the vehicle, reach, lean, make sudden movement for your license, registration or insurance cards. When instructed by the officer to produce documentation, then tell him the location of the documents, not the gun. "Officer, my DL is in my back pocket; I am going to reach for my wallet." "The insurance papers are in the middle console." In Arkansas, you are required to notify, but only IF you are carrying. Again, hands on the wheel, "Officer, I am carrying; would you like to see my permit and DL?" I have read Massad Ayoob extensively, and one should never say "gun" to an officer during a stop. You may not be able to be an expert on every State's laws regarding CC, but you damn well better be an expert on the States you traverse, and periodically re-scan the handgunlaw.us information periodically to check for updates.

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