How Long Before You CC With a Bullet In the Chamber? - Page 4
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Thread: How Long Before You CC With a Bullet In the Chamber?

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Northern Indiana
    Posts
    103
    I too was nervous about one in the pipe but now i would'nt carry it any other way. I took the advice from the folks on this site and got more training and a good understanding of how the weapon's safety system works. I carry a Smith M&P 45 in a Galco combat master holster. I almost forgot, practice practice practice.

    Long Live The Fighters!

  2.   
  3. The bottom line is be safe, not casually, but in a learned manner. Carrying with one in the chamber, after plenty of research on my part, is a must... an absolute must. You simply don't have time to rack a round nor the motor skills to do same in a tense situation and what we want to do is reduce the mechanical actions needed to get that first shot away accurately and rapidly, followed by as many shots as it takes to neutralize the threat. Some will be happy simply keeping their finger off the trigger and unfortunately I am not one of them unless that trigger happens to be a little heavier (at least on the first shot) than a target trigger. I have no trouble carrying my Sigs or Glocks or my HK P7M8/P7PSP's concealed as I am comfortable that they are all about as safe as they need to be. In fact, I will even carry them in my pocket in a suitable pocket holster (in fact, I love pocket carry as I can put my hand on the gun without anyone knowing).

    I think what you are seeing here is a suggestion that training and practice are a big key in carrying, whether or not you have one in the chamber. I have been disarmed from 20 feet, with one presumed to be in the chamber, from a holster, after BEING TOLD that I am going to be disarmed! Incredible? But true. It was my first force on force class and it was truly an eye opener. I essentially wound up with my gun in the attackers hands and with a trigger finger hanging by the skin. And what difference does it make if you have one in the chamber or not if you have no clue as to what to do when someone 'gets the drop' on you? YOU are at gunpoint. What do YOU need to do assuming that the assailant doesn't know you are carrying? Well, I can tell you that drawing your gun is NOT the first thing you want to do - that will get you and likely those with you DEAD real fast. My point? Train to survive. Train to avoid gunfights. And practice continuously. As I have said before, the decision to carry is a big one - it is not simply a decision to pay up and strap on a gun. It comes with BIG power and with big power comes big responsibility. Do it right.

    Oh. And one in the chamber is the right thing to do IMHO. Just be comfortably safe about it, or wait until after you have kids to appendix carry that .45, huh?

  4. #33
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Austin, TEXAS
    Posts
    8
    I'm definitely a big fan of keeping a round in the chamber. I also prefer guns without any manual safety and are DAO (that's why I love Glock). This way all I have to do is pull the handgun from its holster, aim and shoot. No safety to fumble with or racking the slide ... seconds count.

  5. #34
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    South Carolina/Charleston
    Posts
    2,388
    Hey y'all: Keeping a cartridge in the chamber can also be a function of your trigger pull. I have a kel tec P3AT with a very long trigger pull that would take an almost inconceivable effort to fire other than by using my trigger finger--with the gun in its holster, it is an almost a certainty that the only firing will be by me and not any other external effort. Nothing is certain in this world so I do not say 100% but if I feel the need to carry I am going to have a cartridge in the chamber and not waste the second or two for racking.

  6. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Glock513 View Post
    I carried my Glock for a month without any ammo at all in the chamber or clip because it was new to me and I initally felt "wrong" doing it. Then I loaded it completely, including 1 in the chamber. I have been doing it ever since. My NRA instructor and his partner, a LEO, told us at the CCW classes that you should always carry a full clip and the gun should be chambered. Their point was that if you ever need to draw it is ready to fire. Statistically (they rattled off some stats that I now don't recall) there is no time to think about chambering a round in a deadly situation and you put your life in danger. Remember the bad guy has his gun chambered already and pointed at you!
    Hopefully you only carried it unloaded around the house. In MA, if you carry concealed, your weapon must be loaded.

  7. #36

    How Long Before You CC With a Bullet In the Chamber?

    I have 3 handguns that I normally use for CC. My Springfield 1911 A-1 .45 auto, Ruger LCP .380 auto or Ruger SP 101 in .357 mag. When I carry concealed I always carry one in the chamber regardless of which handgun I use. It doesn't matter so much with my Ruger SP 101 since it's a revolver. My 1911 is always in condition 1, round in the chamber and safety on. The LCP has no safety per say except for it's loooong trigger pull but I still have one in the pipe. With the time it takes to react to a potential shooting situation seconds count and racking the slide on my 1911 or LCP are seconds that could be used to get my shot off first. I have been carrying a firearm most of my adult life, military and civilian, so I am comfortable carrying with a round in the chamber. If one feels the least bit uncomfortable carrying concealed with a round in the chamber then that's the way he or she should carry until they are comfortable with their handgun.
    SI VIS PACEM, PARABELLUM
    "If you seek peace, prepare for war"

  8. #37
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Paw Paw, MI
    Posts
    126
    Several good points here, dipping into different aspects of carry: chambered? DAO? Safety machanisms? Experience? All these aspects play their part.

    I agree that you shouldn't carry chambered until you feel you're ready. On the other hand, in the event that you need to USE your gun, these chances of having time to chamber a round are minimal to none. You need to get yourself to where you're comfortable carrying chambered, ASAP!!

    Then there are the other things to consider. Someone mentioned that they don't like manual safeties and rely on the DAO trigger, in that case, a Glock. Glocks only have a 5.5-pound trigger pull and I personally like more safety than that. I like that my XD at least has a grip safety. It's also got the USA trigger "safety" but I don't consider those to be an actual "safety" since you still put your finger on it, pull it, and it goes ((bang)).

    As far as no manual safety, I have a Kel-Tec P11 than has no manual safety. That gun has a very long DAO trigger pull at about 8 pounds. Same with my Taurus 851 CIA, DOA set at about 8 pounds. THOSE I feel confortable with, without a manual safety. But not something with a short, soft, 5.5 pound pull as the only "safety" feature.

    Then there's also my Taurus PT140 Pro, which has a thumb safety. It's very easy with practice to train your thumb to flip the safety off either during your draw or at the end of the draw, without slowing down your draw at all.

    Hopefully this will at least provide some food for thought. What works best for the next Joe may not work well for you at all. Guns and the carriage of are very personal and individual, you need to find your own way. But lastly, yes, you need to do what you need to do to be comfortable carrying chambered. Just hoping that you'll have time to chamber a round is as effective as hoping for rain.
    Don't do anything you wouldn't want to explain to the paramedics...

  9. We are starting to go around in circles. To reiterate, if you are carrying a concealed pistol it absolutely should have a round in the chamber. Glocks are not truly double action only regardless of what anyone says; once you have put a round in the chamber by racking the slide you are carrying a cocked and loaded weapon as far as I am concerned with a 4.5-5.5 trigger pull at best, which may be great for many folks but it is just a week bit light for my liking for concealed carry... for duty carry in an OWB holster aimed at the ground, no problem. IWB concealed aimed at the family jewels, I would go with the NY1 trigger with a slighter heavier pull. 1911's that have not been 'sanded' to reduce trigger pull weight? NO problem! Cocked and locked, especially with that wonderful thumb safety and grip safety which absolutely, positively do not reduce speed to first accurate shot (a thousand IPSC competitors will attest to that including myself). And the revolvers? NO problem. That cylinder has got to turn, line up and lock into place before you get the bang. Pretty tought to do in a snug holster concealed. The guns that I have a problem with are those with trigger pulls under, say, 7 or 8 pounds and short.

    Glocks are truly reliable and you can bet your life on them. I own several and carry at least two whenever legal to do so. I love them and my G30 is a tackdriver. I also have the HK P7M8 which is a tackdriver but heavier to carry; a squeeze cocker with a fixed barrel. Love it. And I own two Sigs; a P229 and P239. The P239 is going and I am going to get a P239 in .357 sig to match my P239 in 9mm. for carry. Rather than confuse myself, the P7M8's are going as are some of the others I have been playing with. And when you play IPSC/IDPA/PPC - play with what you are carrying and play from a holster whenever you can.

    I could go on and on but it would simply be reiterating. I do not carry my 1911's although I like them. They are simply too bulky, heavy, etc. And although I have lots of other pistols that would fit the concealed carry bill just fine, one needs to take a stand with one or at most two favourites that operate in a similar manner. And Glock and Sig both get my vote. Aim and pull trigger.

    Keep safe out there.

  10. #39
    I know where you are coming from. I was uncomfortable carrying with a loaded chamber at first but everything I heard and read convinced me it was the right thing to do. I'd rather not deal with too many complications should I need to use a handgun in a hurry. You'll soon learn to accept the loaded chamber too.

  11. Chambered and Safed

    Sorry about this long post!

    My favorite carry is a Beretta cougar in 9mm, essentially a slightly smaller Model 92. Chambered and safed. The thumb safety pops off easily as the gun comes up, leaving a long heavy double action trigger pull to fire the first round. i carry it this way for several reasons. I can't be as expressive as some of the prior posts, and i'm not as well trained or knowledgeable about such things, but let me try to explain my thinking.

    First, the chambered round. I hope i never need to draw on a human being. Ever. But if i do, the gun needs to be ready. Racking the slide takes too much time, too much movement, and makes too much noise. With a steep ramp and a short 9mm round, if you try to baby the slide (as in, let me very quietly chamber a round so the BG won't hear it), the round can easily jam halfway out of the mag. Not happening.

    Second, the safety. On the Beretta, the safety rotates the firing pin (or striker, whatever it's called) 90 degrees and de-cocks the hammer. The gun is out of battery. ADs are essentially impossible unless the safety comes off or malfunctions. Yet it takes only a little effort and no extra time to flip it off with my thumb as the gun comes up and away from my body. Also, if the gun is ever taken away from me - as Toronto explains, yes it can happen - the extra split second the BG needs to figure out the safety is a margin i want. Also also, if the BG tries to rack the slide at that point, likelyhood of a jam is increased as it has to first eject a live round. If he closes the slide by hand (like you see on TV all the time) rather than lets the return spring do it, likelihood of a jam is increased yet again. Another potential margin for me.

    Third, the holster. I carry IWB. Until i pickup a micro pistol like the LCP, pocket or ankle carry is out. I have an Uncle Mikes IWB, reversible for either side carry. The trigger housing is completely covered. The butt stays right on my belt - never prints but is very accessible. I'm left handed, so i carry at 8:30 or 9:00.

    Fourth - i practice the draw/flip safety off move regularly. I completely unload the gun. I insert an empty magazine, and one snap cap in the chamber. I check it again. Then in the privacy of my office or my garage, pointed in a safe direction, i'll practice the draw. Slowly. Why slowly? because when you need to be fast, first you have to be smooth. Once you're smooth, you can go faster. One other move i practice - I turn some to my left, reaching for my wallet (like i'm complying with a mugger) but instead making the draw. Most times i don't pull the trigger, just draw, unsafe and present. I do not want to ingrain that in my memory so that i end up shooting instinctively when i might not have to. Other times i do. It depends on the scenario i am drilling myself for. But considering that handguns are used to stop crimes millions of times every year without a shot being fired, i practice that way most of the time and trust myself to know when the situation calls for immediate fire.

    Personally, i carried unchambered for a couple of months. Then i got better informed, more comfortable with my carry gun, and after a lot of practice, decided that the chamber needed to be occupied. If nothing else, it adds to the magazine capacity. You never know if that one extra round might determine whether you or someone you care about lives or dies. Isn't that why we carry?
    "Laws that forbid the carrying of arms ... make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants ... for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." - Thomas Jefferson

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