Deadly Home Invasion in Prichard, AL. (Hoods announce as "ATF" then kill homeowner) - Page 3
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Thread: Deadly Home Invasion in Prichard, AL. (Hoods announce as "ATF" then kill homeowner)

  1. #21
    This thread is one of the scarist that I have read of late. Our local LEO's (So. Cal) are fond of using a couple of flash bangs and then the come through the wall. Doors are strengthened, but wall are much easier to get through. If there is a knock on the door, you might have time to call 911 and find out the truth or get help. We need to come up with a 'real world' way of preventing this sort of thing. If the LEO's have the wrong house, yes we need to allow them access and file a lawsuit later. But telling the real from the fake is a real challange. What really makes it hard is that if the LEO's fear a armed result they use as much supprise as possible. My 12 gage or my carbine would be in use asap.

  2.   
  3. #22
    I have to agree with most of the replies I have already read if you kick in my door be prepared to be shot first and if I am wrong I will accept the consequences but if I am right myself and my family will have been protected or God Forbid I went down Fighting.

  4. #23
    I expect everybody to treat me like they want to be treated. You kick in my door unannounced you stand a good chance of dying, I'll do my best to kill you, there are no exceptions to this. This is not a Football game this is serious business. A mistake is unacceptable. Also you had better be real careful who's Dog you kill. Maybe because I grew up shooting a single shot and know the importance of placing one shot correctly, I do hit what I shoot at, maybe I've gust been lucky. Another thing that I think is wrong is the over use of Tasers/stun guns by the Police. I'd hate to say what I'd do if someone shot my wife or girlfriend with a taser. The Police that use them on defenseless women should lose their jobs.

  5. Always, always, always, get visual identification of that ID before opening that door.

  6. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Santa Fe Area, New Mexico
    Posts
    3,487
    What ifs abound. If they, LEO's local or Federal, BG's, anyone kicks my door down at 0300 in the morning. Doesn't matter what the hell their shouting, I be pumping rounds off at the DOOR before my feet hit the ground coming out of bed. This I'm sure will lead to my death, but "What if". If there's a knock at the DOOR at 0300 and someone stating their LEO's. I'll take a defense position and ask a few pertinent questions prior getting close to the DOOR let alone opening it. All the while, my wife's calling 911 to confirm or ask for immediate emergency dispatch. "My Husband has a gun and he WILL use it" "I'm also armed and will shoot the ones he misses" This will lead to the dispatcher giving your call priority. At least where we live.
    "The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." --author and philosopher Ayn Rand (1905-1982)

  7. #26
    You know I was in a pretty good mood till I read this thread. But damn! Total mood killer. Do you know what a pain in the ass it's gonna be to load everything up every night then unload and lock everything back up when leaving for work!

  8. #27
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Lowcountry, SC
    Posts
    457
    Realistically most people will not have time to react if these guys come in in true SWAT style. You will simply be overwhelmed. On the bright side, any team of guys doing this will likely be caught quickly, as this (1) requires multiple people and (2) instill tremendous public concern, which translates to public official action.

    Possibly this could lead to "homeowner's bill of rights" type legislation that will make it unlawful for authorities to crash into a house unless there is a hostage situation or threat of serious bodily harm.

    I don't think there is anything I could do except hold up in my safe place, armed. Hopefully could determine if the intruders were bad guys or good guys. Bad guys aren't likely to be wearing vests, so if you shoot the torso there is less chance of killing a good guy, but you'll probably be killed if you are wrong.

  9. #28
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    TN, the patron state of shootin stuff
    Posts
    1,399
    Quote Originally Posted by tionico View Post
    This thing is a natural follow on to the practice of late where LEO have to go and play Special Ops guys... no-knock warrants, roll the SWAT team, armed to the teeth, bust down the doors attempting total surprise.... and all too often find they are at the wrong house, or their infomation is wrong.

    Courts need to be VERY cautious in issuing such warrants, and hear more than the one set of information. Reminds me of a case in Mdeford, Oregon, last year where LEO got bogus, exaggerated information about a "disgruntled employee" from a troublesome supervisor, rolled the SWAT guys, dawn raid on the guy's house... took him in for psych evaluation ("protective custody" excuse)... turned out the guy was normal. Overkill?

    But, when such raids are normal, bad guys can mimic the whole style and then what? We have dead guys and criminals on the loose. Used to be, when a cop came round to serve an arrest or search warrant, they knocked, identified themselves fully, demanded entrance under the warrant..... sure, some creeps in the back room would make a dash for the bathroom to flush the weed..... so what? They lost that stash, are on notice they are discovered, no one dies for a dime bag of junk.....

    The more the cops play heavy duty, the more distrustful citizens will get. It is compounded in that LEO almost NEVER face any consequences for their excessive usage of force. Like the cop who shot a drunk up north of Seattle a couple years back... the guy was no threat, merely was too drunk to comply with orders. The cop got bent outta shape, and fired seven shots, killing him. and got off. Far too often, cops come onto a situation guns drawn..... as last summer whan a friend of mine was travelling with her children in Central California. Stopping to nurse her infant, her older daughters got out to run around a bit... playing with a purple nerf bat. Some idiot called 911 "some kids beating each other up". Imagine their concern when two CHP pull up behind the car and get out, both guns drawn and aimed AT THEM...... what if they'd been the "nervous" type, and "imagined" some "wrong move"? My friend and/or her children might be dead. Why? Overactive cops.

    They forget THEY are OUR servatns, they've got that wrong way round. They think it is WE who must comply with THEIR demands.... NOW, and in the precise way they demand. Like the guy puilled over on his Harley, black leathers and all, cop on his right, gun drawn...... the guy makes some move to park the bike, the cop's twitchy finger pulls the trigger.... hits the guy in the neck. Paraplegic. For what? A nervous cop. Of course, no consequences to the cop. But the guy on the bike? Oh my.

    Set a pattern that makes housebreaking under force seem "normal", and guess what? Unscrupulous types will mimic the MO but use ot for wrong reasons. Time to reel back in LEO.
    I remember the incident with the Harley that happened in Ohio. The cop was charged and convicted in court and is now serving a prison sentence. Normally they are given a slap on the wrist. It seems that violating department policy carry's more weight than violating your civil rights.
    Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress;
    but I repeat myself.
    Mark Twain

  10. #29

    Start Shooting

    There is absolutely no reason for the ATF or anybody else to be knocking my door down. If someone gets in my house, regardless of the circumstances, It is not likely that I will play 20 questions with them. They will probably get a load of 00 buck shot for thier troubles. If it was really law enforcement and they were at the wrong house then they will pay the price for that mistake. My family comes first.

  11. Welcome to the 21st century American Police State, marlenus. They don't need a reason. Just a "suspicion." All those murdered at Mount Carmel were attacked because of a suspicion that a $200 tax on a full outo firearm might not have been paid -- despite the fact the #2 man there held a Class III license. They can always accuse you of having suspected terrorist connections. The word of a lying druggie looking for a way out of his charges, or a pissed off ex-wife or girlfriend, is plenty to get a warrant and execute a "maximum shock & awe" SWAT raid.

    This will only stop when they start losing officers.


    ..."And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things
    have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling in terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand....The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin's thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt!"

    --Alexandr Solzhenitsyn, “The Gulag Archipelago”
    “The police of a State should never be stronger or better armed than the citizenry. An armed citizenry, willing to fight is the foundation of civil freedom.” Heinlein

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