Colorado Defense Law
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  1. #1

    Colorado Defense Law

    A totally gray area for me in specific what is allowable legally in terms of warning someone you feel is a potential attacker that you are carrying a firearm and that they need to disengage and stay away?

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  3. a double tap to center-chest

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by cougar98332 View Post
    a double tap to center-chest
    Heh heh I mean where you see a situation escalating and you fear it may go that direction or if nothing else you want to let them know you're carrying to avoid being assaulted or mugged.

  5. #4
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    Dbl tap center mass = All other avenues are exhausted, Had to act to save own life.

  6. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smidgeon View Post
    Heh heh I mean where you see a situation escalating and you fear it may go that direction or if nothing else you want to let them know you're carrying to avoid being assaulted or mugged.
    Too many variables you left unstated. Why do you fear it may go the wrong way? Does he look mean? Is he squaring up to you? Has he already attacked someone else? Is he carrying? Is he brandishing?

    Depending on the circumstances will depend on how you react. If you can and have time to do so, make sure you say very loudly you do not wish to have this confrontation and to leave you alone. If there are witnesses they will hear this. In other words try to de-escalate any situation. Using your firearm should be your last way out. However, if there is a life-or-death moment you have got to know in your mind you will act. The question comes down to, can you convince a jury that your life was on the line? If you can't, then you don't pull your firearm.

    Your question literally stated what is legal... Legally, you must be able to convince a jury of your need for self-defense to shoot your attacker.
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote."
    ~ Benjamin Franklin (maybe)

  7. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smidgeon View Post
    A totally gray area for me in specific what is allowable legally in terms of warning someone you feel is a potential attacker that you are carrying a firearm and that they need to disengage and stay away?
    Colorado Felony Menacing

    Menacing can be charged as a Class Three Misdemeanor (M3), or as a Class Five Felony (F5) in Colorado. It becomes a felony when it involves the use of a Deadly Weapon. It does not matter if the weapon is real. You can commit menacing with a toy gun, if you handle it in such a way that you make the person believe it is real. You do not have to point the weapon (real or not) at someone to be found guilty, simply holding it "in a manner that causes the other person to fear for his safety" will suffice. You can also be charged with Menacing with a Deadly Weapon even if you do not have a weapon! Simply telling someone that you are armed may result in a Menacing charge.
    Here is a story from the local paper

    August 4, 2008 - 11:53PM

    A former El Paso County sheriff's deputy appeared in court last week on a felony charge alleging he threatened someone with a gun.

    Shawn Moncalieri, 33, was fired from the Sheriff's Office last year after two internal affairs investigations in seven months: one related to a questionable officer-involved shooting and the other involving possible wrongful arrests.

    Colorado Springs police officers allege Moncalieri flashed his .40-caliber Glock (please note said Glock never came out of the holstrer) at business owner Larry Salas in April. Moncalieri faces a felony menacing charge, which carries a maximum three-year prison sentence.

    Moncalieri, who works as a private investigator, went to Salas' Prince of Battle silk-screening business at 513 W. Colorado Ave. with disgruntled customer Ricardo Wong, according to an arrest affidavit. Wong and Salas exchanged words after Wong was ordered to leave the store. Salas called police when Moncalieri "placed his right hand on his right hip, indicating the presence of a firearm under his coat," the affidavit states. When a police sergeant arrived, he saw "suspect flop the right side of his coat backward to reveal a handgun in a holster." The sergeant took the loaded gun as evidence. Moncalieri told officers Salas threatened him with a knife.

    Moncalieri declined comment Monday.

    A 4th Judicial District Court judge ruled this year that the El Paso County Sheriff's Office had to hand over the two internal affairs investigations on Moncalieri to The Gazette. A Gazette reporter asked in February and March 2007 to review the files, but was refused. El Paso County Sheriff's officials have appealed the judge's ruling, saying internal affairs reports are not subject to disclosure as criminal justice records.

    One report deals with an incident in which Moncalieri shot at a fleeing burglary suspect who allegedly tried to run him over. The 4th Judicial District Attorney's Office, which investigated the August 2006 incident, determined the shooting was questionable, although not criminal.

    The second incident involves a possible wrongful arrest involving two Fountain men that resulted in the county secretly paying each $20,000. The Colorado Court of Appeals has not ruled on the sheriff's appeal.

    Moncalieri is scheduled to stand trial on the menacing charge Oct. 27. He has pleaded not guilty and remains free on bond.
    See, it's mumbo jumbo like that and skinny little lizards like you thinking they the last dragon that gives Kung Fu a bad name.
    http://www.gunrightsmedia.com/ Internet forum dedicated to second amendment

  8. #7
    Brandishing = Menacing.

    You could always try announcing: "Stop! I have a gun!"

    Good luck with that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smidgeon View Post
    A totally gray area for me in specific what is allowable legally in terms of warning someone you feel is a potential attacker that you are carrying a firearm and that they need to disengage and stay away?
    I do not know what you or any repliers were told when they took their CCWP class, but I was told that you try and disengage, run away, back off--call these actions whatever you want but they are the actions you should take before you actually are in imminent danger and find it necessary to present your firearm and discharge same. You do any of these things while yelling that you do not want this confrontation--this is called finding witnesses; it also provides you with those moments of thought concerning what you are about to do and even gives you an opportunity to place your firearm in a more advantageous position that is not as constrained as your holster--not brandishing but just relocating--say in the front of your pants and not all the way to the side in your the indent of your waist. IMO and it is ONLY my opinion, stand your ground does not, from a common sense point of view, mean you stand there in the face of imminent danger just because you can when there are options that may be more advantageous to your defense, as I stated above. The biggest problem in the Zim case was the fact that Zim did not listen to the 911 advice--he made the call but did not back off and wait for police--my take was that this ended up in his confrontation with the "little boy" that our whitehouse garbage loves like a son. The little boy then attacked him and thus we have the rest of the story. There was no evidence of a direct assault by Zim and, therefore, he was not guilty. If Zim had followed my take on stand your ground, he would have backed off and police may or may not have caught that little wonderful cheerful boy--even then--this poor little boy did nothing wrong at that time and this would have been a non-story.

  10. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelcarry View Post
    I do not know what you or any repliers were told when they took their CCWP class, but I was told that you try and disengage, run away, back off--call these actions whatever you want but they are the actions you should take before you actually are in imminent danger and find it necessary to present your firearm and discharge same. You do any of these things while yelling that you do not want this confrontation--this is called finding witnesses; it also provides you with those moments of thought concerning what you are about to do and even gives you an opportunity to place your firearm in a more advantageous position that is not as constrained as your holster--not brandishing but just relocating--say in the front of your pants and not all the way to the side in your the indent of your waist. IMO and it is ONLY my opinion, stand your ground does not, from a common sense point of view, mean you stand there in the face of imminent danger just because you can when there are options that may be more advantageous to your defense, as I stated above. The biggest problem in the Zim case was the fact that Zim did not listen to the 911 advice--he made the call but did not back off and wait for police--my take was that this ended up in his confrontation with the "little boy" that our whitehouse garbage loves like a son. The little boy then attacked him and thus we have the rest of the story. There was no evidence of a direct assault by Zim and, therefore, he was not guilty. If Zim had followed my take on stand your ground, he would have backed off and police may or may not have caught that little wonderful cheerful boy--even then--this poor little boy did nothing wrong at that time and this would have been a non-story.
    Yes, when I took my CCWP class I was taught the same thing. Just because you have a gun and are allowed to use it doesn't mean the gun is your only alternative. There are other means and only as a last resort you fire your weapon. I'm with you in the Zimmerman case, he pursued this kid without justification, his thinking that this kid "was" trouble. In his own words Zimmerman told the police dispatcher that "these a**holes always get away" and muttering "f***king punks". I'm only sorry Trayvon didn't kick the total sh** out of Zimmerman before he was so senselessly murdered.

  11. #10
    If you want to yell “Stop I have a gun” that is your choice, to me by doing this you give up the only reason I cc instead of open carry (the element of surprise) I think when you draw on them they will get the message. Under 21 feet + me feeling danger to my life You will not get a courtesy “please stop”.
    rmw66- "gun free zones = criminal empowerment zones "

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