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Thread: What would you do?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by SonoraRebel View Post
    I reckon that scenario would depend on what state you're in.

    I'd take as many aspects of the situation in as possible... given the element of surprise and act accordingly. That said... if at all possible I would shoot (or make the attempt) the BG if I had the opportunity. My wife is also armed... so that's another situation right there.

    If the two of you haven't trainied together for this type of situation, I'd strongly suggest you do so. Set up standard procedures and methods of communication and practice frequently. Failure to do so could result in SERIOUS consequences.



    gf
    "A few well placed shots with a .22LR is a lot better than a bunch of solid misses with a .44 mag!" Glock Armorer, NRA Chief RSO, Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, Muzzleloading Rifle, Muzzleloading Shotgun, and Home Firearm Safety Training Counselor

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  3. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldOwl View Post
    After reading the thread, I'm wondering how the shooter was determined as a BG? Lets say you take him down, and he turns out to be a detective, and the three who were shot were making a drug deal and reached for weapons which drew his fire? Now you're REALLY screwed.
    Good point. I'd make the shooter as a "BG" and not some type of LEO by their body language and other factors. A good give away that the shooter is LE would be the phrase "Police officer, freeze", or some other phrase that would ID them as LE.

    When hearing shots, I do my best to evaluate the situation BEFORE returning fire. Hence why I stated that unless the shooter is directly engaging me, I'd do my best to help others get away and otherwise be a "good witness". If the shooter opens fire on folks fleeing, it's highly unlikely that the shooter is LE.



    gf
    "A few well placed shots with a .22LR is a lot better than a bunch of solid misses with a .44 mag!" Glock Armorer, NRA Chief RSO, Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, Muzzleloading Rifle, Muzzleloading Shotgun, and Home Firearm Safety Training Counselor

  4. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by OldOwl View Post
    After reading the thread, I'm wondering how the shooter was determined as a BG? Lets say you take him down, and he turns out to be a detective, and the three who were shot were making a drug deal and reached for weapons which drew his fire? Now you're REALLY screwed.
    I doubt any LEO would engage a bunch of BGs in a crowded restaurant with a gun. That just ins't the way a drug bust goes down. Anybody shooting at anyone in a restaurant has total disregard for his safety and the safety of everyone else in the place.
    -= Piece Corps =-

  5. #24
    probably why most dont want to get envolved is the aftermath of the court system even if you are in the right,people have been sued befor for doing nothing when they could have but were afraid to,your damed if you do and damed if you dont now a days theres no happy medium.

  6. here in Florida, i would shoot the man. The castle doctrine actually works here. If I can save a live, I would not hesitate. How do I know that I or my family isn't next?

  7. I don't have a CCL but if I did, I would look (quickly) for a way to blind-side him from an angle where no people were in my line of fire. If that didn't look possible right away, I would look for safe egress trying to save myself and those with me and take a defensive stance while doing that. If the gun gets pointed in my direction , I'm firing regardless of what's behind him.
    Well, ok, If there is a pregnant woman by him I'll take the bullet.
    Last edited by alan93; 04-14-2009 at 07:57 PM. Reason: add last line

  8. #27
    every man for himself...I'd just tell myself they should have had a CCW..I'd just ge me and mine the hell out..if he got in my way he'd get a dose..

  9. Know your target and what’s behind it. AND Know if your target is the threat.

    Quote Originally Posted by OldOwl View Post
    After reading the thread, I'm wondering how the shooter was determined as a BG? Lets say you take him down, and he turns out to be a detective, and the three who were shot were making a drug deal and reached for weapons which drew his fire? Now you're REALLY screwed.
    Old Owl, thanks for your input. I also have concerns.

    I am catching up on my reading and just came into this thread. I am a Football referee. I watch for infractions. I am amazed when looking at replay how often we miss the first guy and penalize the reaction. Might cost a team 15 yards, not someone their life and me legal issues. No big deal.

    When I am sitting in a restaurant with my family, even in condition yellow, and hear a commotion and then hear shots fired, I expect that I will suffer a moment with, IS THIS REALLY HAPPENING? My tunnel vision will kick in. Did the people shot have weapons? Did they recognize an undercover Detective? I was visiting with an undercover drug agent a couple of weeks ago, that I would not have let my wife go near. He looked the part. Were they his wife and her boy friend? Did they start the confrontation? Too much that I just don’t know.

    I was shot by a couple LEOs earlier this month. I was a school teacher hiding behind a desk in an active shooting scenario. Fortunately it was with a “Red” gun. We all learned a lot.

    Too many variables to say that I am going to start shooting BGs. First and foremost I am going to seek cover for myself and whomever I am with. I will secure my sidearm. Then assess the threat and make a decision. I would make sure 911 is alerted if it did not interfere with getting to cover. I also carry a recorder that I would start when safe to do so.

    Know your target and what’s behind it. AND Know if your target is the threat.

  10. #29
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    I think after reading this thread, I'm more cognizant that other CCWers around me might be having to react to imminent threats that they perceive, so I shouldn't automaticly slap steel and start gunning at them myself. Slap steel and take cover, yes, but wait to see what else the shooter is about to do. Continuing to gun down restaurant patrons or shouting a demand for valuables makes it pretty clear, he's a BG and I have to end him, if I can. Holstering his gun and telling people to call 911, he's prolly a GG like me, and if I were to shoot him, I'd be committing a crime.

    First thing, after slapping steel and taking immediate cover because of shots fired in public would be to usher my compatriots out of the danger zone, bills be damned, the meal is over at that point. After that is aquiring targets and covering our escape. Anything that looks like it might be a shooter attempting to stop us from leaving, must be a BG of some kind, and he dies.

    After mine are out of the danger zone, I would stay behind if I saw any kind of imminent threat, but if everyone else was still apparently safe and healthy, I'd just assume that those people are lacking in the same self-preservation instinct me and mine possess or else, there really is no danger of imminent death by firearm.

    If, after mine were safely away and I was bringing up the rear, there was a commotion going on, I'd prolly be busy trying to (re)acquire a target, the source of the gun shots and ushering those closest to my (physicly, not emotionally) to flee as mine already had. If at any time someone pointed a gun at me, sorry to say, at that point, I'd prolly have to pull the trigger.

    Rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6, and if you knew how big I was, you'd sympathize with those 6.
    When they "Nudge. Shove. Shoot.",
    Don't retreat. Just reload.

  11. #30
    Moot point for me, in SC. If alcohol can be consumed on premises, I can't bring my weapon into the restaurant, even if I don't sit at the bar or order a drink.

    But if our state senate passes bill 347 in committee as we speak, then... he'd be dead. Mozambique-style. Of course, we all have to assume the chaos that would ensue after 3 shots are fired. Getting a clean shooting lane might be difficult.
    SC CWP
    NH non-res CWP
    NRA Member

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