1st gun, Home Defense, 12 Gauge or Handgun? - Page 3
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Thread: 1st gun, Home Defense, 12 Gauge or Handgun?

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio
    Posts
    181
    Quote Originally Posted by 901-Memphis View Post
    Well i would like to shoot for recreation at the local gun range, so if i want to do that would it be better to purchase a handgun?

    My thoughts are just that the shotgun are going to be more accurate when woke up out of your sleep and disoriented.

    I have been looking at 18.5 inch barrel length shotguns around $300 and also handguns around the 9 mm size.

    Anyone know what the minimum length is for a barrel on a shotgun? And would it be illegal to have a gun shop saw it off to the federal minimum for me? I am having all sorts of trouble finding these obscure laws for Kentucky.

    If anyone knows about deadly force laws in Kentucky or any court cases of late, let me know i was googling my ass off.

    My Other question.

    http://www.usacarry.com/forums/deadl...y-force-2.html




    EDIT: Btw i found this on the barrel length on my own search but its still not clear to me what the minimum length is when done by a skilled person

    United States

    Under the National Firearms Act (NFA) it is illegal for a private citizen to possess a sawed-off modern smokeless powder shotgun (a barrel length less than 18 in. or 46 cm and an overall length less than 26 inches) without a tax-stamped permit from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, which requires a background check and a $200.00 fee for every transfer. However, if the weapon was manufactured by a licensed builder, with a short barrel and no stock, the transfer fee is $5. [1] (Short-barreled muzzleloading blackpowder shotguns, in contrast, are not illegal by federal law and require no tax-stamped permit, although they may be illegal under state law.) As with all NFA regulated firearms, a new tax stamp must be purchased before every transfer. Inter-state transfers must be facilitated through a Class III Federal Firearms Licensed (FFL) dealer while intrastate transfers may be between two persons.[6]
    I think the length that you quoted looking at is the legal shortest length of a shot gun....Pretty sure...
    The Iceman, Akron, Oh
    Shoot straight and be safe...

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  3. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    699
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfling68 View Post
    on the .22 question, in most self defense situations, killing power isn't that important, stopping power is. You want a weapon that puts the BG on the ground fast. It doesn't help much if your assailant dies 10 min after he is finished removing your liver with a spoon........
    In ALL SD scenarios, marksmanship is paramount. Killing power is stopping power, the last I checked, someone that was dead.....stopped.

    No round, unless taken in the head or through the spinal column, thus producing neural shock, guarantees an immediate take down. You can shoot a guy pumped up on methamphetamines in the guts or lungs and they will keep coming. You can shoot them in the heart and there is still a chance they can pull a trigger, provided they don't go into immediate shock, which is less likely because of the amount of adrenaline that is pumping.

    Oxygen depletion IS NOT immediate, even if you stop someone's heart.

    Head shots will end the threat. Two in the chest and one in the head and that's only if you don't have a clean first shot at the head.

    Allow me to relate this REAL WORLD case of the large caliber not meaning JACK.

    Trooper Mark Hunter Coates, South Carolina Highway Patrol

    He murdured the officer with ONE shot from a .22

    Of course, all due respect to the downed LEO.

  4. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by matthewaynelson View Post
    I texted my buddy last night... he has the Sigma SW9VE. He said, "I've shot all my life and it shoots better than anything I have ever owned (including the Colt Commander that I owned). Shot one inch groups at 15 yards; my brother's Sig P226 shot a little over three inch groups! None of us could believe how smooth it was! No jams, even with hollow points. It’s the best Pistol I have ever owned! Let's go shooting!" :)



    And, I definitely agree with Hoot! 22's are fine for target practice at the range and saving money on ammo—but, probably not the first choice in self defense!

    Got my Big W2 in the mail , just waiting on one other job to get in the mail which should have already been mailed. Was getting ready to jump on the S&W .40VE and the price is back up to $340 and now its just the 10 round mag instead of the 15

    Smith & Wesson SW40VE .40SW Black/Stainless, 10 rd Calif LEGAL for Sale at Buds Gun Shop $339.00

  5. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by 901-Memphis View Post
    ... the S&W .40VE and the price is back up to $340 and now its just the 10 round clip instead of the 15.
    Maybe you will find some truth in the old adage, "what goes up, must come down!" :)
    Blessed be my God, my mountain, who trains me to fight fair and well! Psalm 144 (msg)
    ...follow me at twitter.com/matthewaynelson

  6. Check your local stores or gunbroker. I've seen them as low as $280 new

  7. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Unfettered Might View Post

    Head shots will end the threat. Two in the chest and one in the head and that's only if you don't have a clean first shot at the head.
    Don't get the wrong idea.. The First shot should Go for Center mass (the chest area).. It is much harder to miss for you, and much harder for the BG to move.. You are not a Sniper.. Go for the chest..

    Gulf Coast, Floriduh
    Sccy is the limit

  8. #27
    The targets for the CHL in Texas teaches shooting for center mass. You get less points for a head shot than center mass. Center mass is easier to hit and there are a number of vital organs there. Shoot for center mass and keep shooting until the threat is stopped.
    By faith Noah,being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear,prepared an ark to the saving of his house;by the which he condemned the world,and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith Heb.11:7

  9. Quote Originally Posted by Unfettered Might View Post
    In ALL SD scenarios, marksmanship is paramount. Killing power is stopping power, the last I checked, someone that was dead.....stopped.

    No round, unless taken in the head or through the spinal column, thus producing neural shock, guarantees an immediate take down. You can shoot a guy pumped up on methamphetamines in the guts or lungs and they will keep coming. You can shoot them in the heart and there is still a chance they can pull a trigger, provided they don't go into immediate shock, which is less likely because of the amount of adrenaline that is pumping.

    Oxygen depletion IS NOT immediate, even if you stop someone's heart.

    Head shots will end the threat. Two in the chest and one in the head and that's only if you don't have a clean first shot at the head.

    Allow me to relate this REAL WORLD case of the large caliber not meaning JACK.

    Trooper Mark Hunter Coates, South Carolina Highway Patrol

    He murdured the officer with ONE shot from a .22

    Of course, all due respect to the downed LEO.
    We are not talking about guarantees, we are talking probabilities. Which is more probable, you get killed by a mugger inside your gated community in the rich neighborhood in which you live, or you get killed while walking through the projects in the middle of the night with $20 haning out of your pockets while wearing Ralph Lauren? Probabilities. Which is more likely to stop someone in their tracks, a hit from a .22 or a hit from a .50? My money is on the .50 every time. I will lose the bet, once in a while, but I will win almost always.
    Yes, a hit from a .22 is better than a miss from a .50 (usually, again probabilites), but a hit from a .50 is better than a hit from a .22. As far as head shots go, the head is a MUCH smaller target than center of mass. If you have the skill, more power to you. But you had better hit right around the nose, as a forhead hit has the possibility of bouncing off.
    As a generality, bigger bullets stop more. We can have the 9mm vs 45 arguements all day, and all bullets are lethal, but bigger bullets stop faster.
    You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
    Robert A. Heinlein

  10. #29
    I kind of want the Glock 22 now, but i really do want a new gun. Would probably get a almost new used 22 if i could find one. My local pawn shop is about as expensive as budsgunshop with their used guns.

    How much do you get for a $500 Glock if you have to pawn it? Like $250?

  11. #30
    Join Date
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    Toronto, Ohio
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    22's will not bounce off

    But you had better hit right around the nose, as a forhead hit has the possibility of bouncing off.
    As a generality, bigger bullets stop more. We can have the 9mm vs 45 arguements all day, and all bullets are lethal, but bigger bullets stop faster.[/QUOTE]

    Good Morning Wolfling68

    I agree with just about everything except a bullet bouncing off a forhead.
    I have shot alot of animals in the forhead beef, hogs, sheep, and goats with both pistols and rifles using 22 LR and I never had anything but one shot kills and never one bounced off.
    I found a hollow point better than a solid because it will pass through the forhead and lodge in the brain and not on into the body area.
    My wife handles her 12 gauge better than a pistol and if thing get serious so do I. We both keep ours loaded with 00Buck.
    My everyday carry is a 9mm, but at home I go for the 12 ga.
    Last edited by Debray; 01-30-2010 at 06:15 AM. Reason: left out a word
    “Every step we take towards making the State our Caretaker of our lives, by that much we move toward making the State our Master.” – Dwight D. Eisenhower

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