Caliber vs. Protection - Page 3
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Thread: Caliber vs. Protection

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    The Heart of Dixie
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    1,225
    It's been said before and will be said again many times... "It's all about shot placement". When the chips are down and the pucker factor is a 10 (during an actual gunfight), great aim doesn't usually come naturally. This is why a LOT of training is a good thing. If you're a great shot under pressure, then any caliber will work. For me, my minimum is a .380 ACP and my maximum a 10mm Auto.

  2.   
  3. I recently watched a video online where a COP shot the bad guy 5 times center of mass with a .357 and he survived. The officer was shot twice with a NAA Mini-Revolver in .22 WMR (.22 Mag). 1 round hit his vest with no impact, the second round (fired after all shots in the bad guy) stuck under his left arm and hit his heart.
    Bad guy survived, Officer didn't.
    To me the lessons:
    1. cover beats concealment, caliber, shot placement ... etc.
    2. once lead starts flying luck (or divine intervention) matters more than we like to think/admit.
    3. just because the bad guy has gained a considerable amount of weight in lead, if they have a weapon and can move they are a threat.
    4. and lastly, unless your a soldier or cop: escape and evasion is more important than stopping the attacker.

    My plan -- Avoid / Flee, if not possible--seek cover, shoot, reload and keep shooting until I can escape.
    Last edited by stove; 03-25-2010 at 12:06 PM. Reason: typo

  4. #23
    JSDinTexas Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by stove View Post
    I recently watched a video online where a COP shot the bad guy 5 times center of mass with a .357 and he survived. The officer was shot twice with a NAA Mini-Revolver in .22 WMR (.22 Mag). 1 round hit his vest with no impact, the second round (fired after all shots in the bad guy) stuck under his left arm and hit his heart.
    Bad guy survived, Officer didn't.
    To me the lessons:
    1. cover beats concealment, caliber, shot placement ... etc.
    2. once lead starts flying luck (or divine intervention) matters more than we like to think/admit.
    3. just because the bad guy has gained a considerable amount of weight in lead, if they have a weapon and can move they are a threat.
    4. and lastly, unless your a soldier or cop: escape and evasion is more important than stopping the attacker.

    My plan -- Avoid / Flee, if not possible--seek cover, shoot, reload and keep shooting until I can escape.
    Yes - when all is considered, I do not want the confrontation, and that is my goal. But if it should escalate ...

  5. Whatever YOU CAN SHOOT accurately. A dead on .22 is deadlier than a .44 mag near-miss. In a real-world situation sometimes you just don't get that second shot.

  6. #25
    Like I said in my question, I know there would be lots of opinions, and no right or wrong answers. I have learned, through your help, that whatever make, model and caliber works for me is what I should buy and carry. Thanks everybody. I'm sure I'll be back with more questions. Stay safe.

    Larry

  7. #26
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Minnesota
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    1,429
    Quote Originally Posted by jsdinTexas View Post
    In defense of my post and being stepped on by iceman, I will add:

    1) I was coached by LEOs and this is why I go to a larger caliber
    2) You can't always count on the BG to be sane, sober (drugs), or not wearing 5 layers of clothes
    3) You will not always hit COM
    4) Head shots are on TV
    5) Finally, to stop the aggression requires stopping it, not hoping to wound or intimidate, if that were the case, we could all carry tasers or bull whips or some such nonsense.

    I never met an LEO that didn't go large, both as the duty weapon and the backup, and before you say that is their job, What is yours in this senario?
    I am always stepping in something on USA carry. No offense intended.
    LEO's don't have the market cornered when it comes to firearms, and self-defense knowledge. Most of us here are regular guys. Many of us have had some degree of training. Some are LEO's.
    Chances are, us regular guys will never have to pull our firearm out of its holster in self-defense. The odds of encountering someone with 5 layers, or messed up on mind altering substances is even less.
    When I train, I often practice the Mozambique drill. 2 shots, COM, 1 shot head.
    I will do what ever I have to do to stop the life ending threat short of brandishing, drawing down, and firing on another human being. Talking, dancing, singing, walking away come to mind. I sure don't wish to shoot anyone. I will only use deadly force if my life is in danger. I am not a LEO. I can't draw down on someone just because they are acting stupid.
    When I carried a weapon for a living it was a full sized handgun. You notice I used the word weapon. A weapon is something I carry when I know I may be going in harms way, and may have to defend myself.
    A firearm, is a something I may carry for sport, or in the extreme, protection. I carry a smaller firearm concealed because chances are, I will never have to use it.
    It's like the fire extinguisher in your kitchen. Comforting to have around, but you pray you don't have to use it.

  8. #27
    JSDinTexas Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by theicemanmpls View Post
    I am always stepping in something on USA carry. No offense intended.
    LEO's don't have the market cornered when it comes to firearms, and self-defense knowledge. Most of us here are regular guys. Many of us have had some degree of training. Some are LEO's.
    Chances are, us regular guys will never have to pull our firearm out of its holster in self-defense. The odds of encountering someone with 5 layers, or messed up on mind altering substances is even less.
    When I train, I often practice the Mozambique drill. 2 shots, COM, 1 shot head.
    I will do what ever I have to do to stop the life ending threat short of brandishing, drawing down, and firing on another human being. Talking, dancing, singing, walking away come to mind. I sure don't wish to shoot anyone. I will only use deadly force if my life is in danger. I am not a LEO. I can't draw down on someone just because they are acting stupid.
    When I carried a weapon for a living it was a full sized handgun. You notice I used the word weapon. A weapon is something I carry when I know I may be going in harms way, and may have to defend myself.
    A firearm, is a something I may carry for sport, or in the extreme, protection. I carry a smaller firearm concealed because chances are, I will never have to use it.
    It's like the fire extinguisher in your kitchen. Comforting to have around, but you pray you don't have to use it.
    I agree with you 100% and it is my goal to never take the firearm out of its holster except at the range, but if I do, I want it to take care of business

  9. #28
    I carry a sp101 357. It wont jam,and will go through a heavy coat or sweat shirt and, prolly knock the perp down. I dont trust a 22 or a 380 to do that. my 02.
    WOODY!
    Please Bless and Support our Troops.
    Dont Blink, 100 Years Goes Faster Than You Think...

  10. #29
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Yuma, AZ
    Posts
    71
    There was a time when I gave this topic a lot more thought but these days’ I simply keep it at .38 (9mm) or above and deal with it.
    “Monsters are real and so are ghosts. They live inside of us, and sometimes they win.”
    ~ Stephen King

  11. #30
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    SE Florida
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    1,880
    My primary carry is a 9mm. I also have a .380 pocket gun.

    While my Glock 36's .45 slug has a lot more stopping power, the lower recoil of the 9 or 380 means I can be more accurate with follow-up shots. Accuracy is paramount to me. I won't pretend that I've ever been in a situation where I've had to fire on another human being but I'm smart enough to know that it's nothing like firing at a paper target on a range. Stress, fear, adrenaline, and all the other effects that a life-or-death situation will have on a shooter's accuracy must be taken into account. Every gun becomes less accurate in such a situation because the shooter's aim will be affected, that's why I'd rather start with the more accurate gun to begin with.

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