Food For Thought - Page 3
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Thread: Food For Thought

  1. Shoot until they stop

    My CWW instructor said you shoot until they stop, use those exact words when talking to the police.
    I imagine that in most every state, if you get treated fairly, they won't count the number of shots, but did you shoot more than you needed to.

    It is not reasonable to expect someone to shoot 3 shots and stand there and look at someone still pointing a gun at them.

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  3. #22
    And let's not forget, we are assuming a single person threat. For multiple attackers, the law of averages becomes more relevant. Not exact science, but relevant nonetheless. If four guys are attacking you, the study says on average it will take 2.8x4=11.2 rounds to stop all of them. It can't hurt to consider data like this when deciding how many rounds you will carry on a normal basis. Logic tells us that if 11.2 is the average for four attackers, then 50% of the data will be lower than that, and 50% will be higher. Would any of us only carry three rounds, since that's the average you'll need for a single attacker? No, that would be ludicrous. Personally, I follow the Boy Scout motto: be prepared. Be prepared for the law of averages to be on vacation out of the country when trouble knocks your door down. Always carry as many spare rounds as you can possibly stand on a daily basis. And if you have a backup gun, do the same with that. To hell with the averages.

  4. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Providence Ranch View Post
    If four guys are attacking you, the study says on average it will take 2.8x4=11.2 rounds to stop all of them.
    Personally, I follow the Boy Scout motto: be prepared. Be prepared for the law of averages to be on vacation out of the country when trouble knocks your door down. Always carry as many spare rounds as you can possibly stand on a daily basis. And if you have a backup gun, do the same with that. To hell with the averages.
    Based on experience, my point is that IF, that is IF, you are attacked by multiple assailants, you said four.... whether they be armed with guns, knives, bats, or fists....... the actual clock time that it takes you to fire your weapon at multiple attackers = and hit them=..... YOU need to be prepared to die. Clock time will NOT allow you to shoot 4 attackers that are hell bent on destroying you.

    Practice this: Have a friend stand 8 feet away from you while pretending to have a knife in his hand. Shout GO as you pull your weapon and he simultaneously takes 2 strides towards you and lunges his knife into your guts. 8 feet disappears in approximately .6 of one second. Can you pull your weapon, shoot, and disable the assailant before he punctures you? Now consider, can you stop FOUR simultaneously? Unless you are dealing with wannabe gangstas, you are a dead man.

    18 rounds in your 9mm and 2 more mags might be impressive to you and your friends, but you will never be able to shoot more than 4-5 unless you are in a fire fight "at a distance".

    Think about it, please. This is the real world, not a movie. You don't get to get up later and appear in the next movie.

    edit: Another good practice scenerio is to draw your weapon while simultaneously falling down sideways and backwards WHILE SHOOTING UPWARDS towards your attacker. This does 2 things. 1) you are getting smaller and moving away so you are harder to hit/ as well as a moving target. 2) as you go down, your shooting trajectory is upwards which can avoid innocents who might be in the line of fire in case of a miss or an over penetration. Handy if you are confronted in a crowded area.

    This also makes it fun to piss off your karate instructor when he wants to show off how he can kick a gun out of your hand for the rest of the class. (After he "died" 5 times he stormed out of the room and did not come back. After the second drop shoot, I changed and dropped to the left instead of the right// By the way, practice point shooting from the hip not sticking your arm out.... he's only a few feet away= hard to miss.).

    Again, just my opinions. Hope it helps save your life.

  5. #24
    Ok sure. If the scenario is just as you say, four bad guys standing around me at eight feet away, and I have my weapon still holstered waiting for someone to yell "go", I will have already decided to die.

    My POINT, is that there is NO predicting how much time, how much ammo, or how many attackers (or about a billion other variables) in a self-defense situation. You may have a great relationship with your local palm reader. I don't.

    Being prepared to beat the general average based on REAL WORLD statistics is smart. Putting people down for doing so, using phony unrealistic simulations is...well, not.

    Peace out!

  6. #25
    Based on experience.........Again, just my opinions. Hope it helps save your life.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by Cotillion View Post
    Well since you're handing out some advice here's some for you!

    Unloading your clip is a sure fire way to get 2nd degree murder!
    http://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/the-...riggernometry/

    Screw it. Let 12 judge me instead of being carried by 6. You do whatever you want.

  8. #27
    It wasn't a shotgun--- Duh it was a revolver and he used 5 more shots. Yes the imenent danger was passed.

    He was a dumb ass. Oh yeah maybee it was 5.8 shots average. Duh.

    Point there is no average on parts of a bullet only whole bullets --- Duh averages only work on other things.
    Crime has no boundaries - Carry Safe!

  9. #28
    I have an offer to who ever want to try. I'll give you .8 bullets. That means I will cut off a piece of bullet and hand it to you.

    Now you stand in front of me with your .8 bullet and I will use a whole one, and shoo it at you.

    Averages don't work with bullets! only whole ones. I'm not stupid I understand averages.

    But they don't work when shooting at someone. Only whole bullets! Averages can bite my ass.
    Crime has no boundaries - Carry Safe!

  10. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnLM View Post
    Thats true in a sense. Even the sound of the gun going off is enough to have the BG running like a bat out of hell
    That is total BS. If you depend on this fantasy, you will, in all likelihood have a rude surprise coming.

    Statistical averages are just that, Statistical averages. So arguing about .8 bullet is disingenuous at best. If you shoot, you shoot until the threat ceases. You never shoot a certain number of rounds and stop to check how you are doing.
    War to the Knife, Knife to the hilt.
    If we don't want to live in a trashy area, we all have to be willing to help pick up the trash.

  11. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by retiredman View Post
    It wasn't a shotgun--- Duh it was a revolver and he used 5 more shots. Yes the imenent danger was passed.

    He was a dumb ass. Oh yeah maybee it was 5.8 shots average. Duh.

    Point there is no average on parts of a bullet only whole bullets --- Duh averages only work on other things.
    As you have stated, "He was a dumb ass".
    He has essentially received a "life sentence" for his "overkill". 59 + 38 parole = 97

    The pharmacist apparently put one shot into the perp's head, and then emptied that gun at the second man who had a gun. Then he went and got a second gun and shot the perp 5 more times.

    The pharmacist was WRONG to have fired the second volley of 5 shots after the perp was "down and out".

    The video report I watched said the second was a shotgun.
    OK, so it was a revolver.... a JUDGE .45/.410 actually...... and loaded with specialized fragmenting ammunition.

    Question: If only part of that specialized fragmentation hits the perp, wouldn't THAT be considered a fractional portion of a "bullet/load"? ?????????

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