do you believe Kleck's numbers?
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Thread: do you believe Kleck's numbers?

  1. do you believe Kleck's numbers?

    he says that over 1 million times per year, a gun in CIVILIAN hands prevents a crime. Nothing is said about animal attacks, either.

  2.   
  3. Those are hard numbers to get. First off, if someone displays a firearm and the bad guy runs off, there is usually no police report. Second, when people are polled with this question, they will tend to answer in the negative so as not to implicate themselves.

    CDC numbers put it between 800,000 and 1.2 million depending on the research methodology used. So I would think 1 million is not too far off.

    A good test of this number is do you know of anyone who falls into this category? My sister is one of them.

  4. #3
    Well, I think it could be pretty close to correct. I know two people that fit into this category.
    Stop, Drop, and Roll won't work in Hell.
    The truth about the former Republic of the United States of America:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6Ioz...ayer_embedded#

  5. #4
    Kleck conducted that study several years ago to counter the inconcievably poorly conducted study:


    Violent Death in the Home in Relation to Gun Ownership

    by Arthur Kellermann, M.D. at the National Center for Injury Prevention and Control in Atlanta.

    Kellerman looked at shootings in homes and concluded that "if someone has a gun in his or her home, the gun is 42 times more likely to be used to shoot a family member than an intruder."

    What Kellerman failed to consider is that the events that he "investigated" had a common thread: they involved families that contained people who were convicted felons, drug dealers, or those convicted of domestic violence, etc.
    Charlie

  6. Quote Originally Posted by CharlieK View Post
    Kleck conducted that study several years ago to counter the inconcievely poorly conducted study:


    Violent Death in the Home in Relation to Gun Ownership

    by Arthur Kellermann, M.D. at the National Center for Injury Prevention and Control in Atlanta.

    Kellerman looked at shootings in homes and concluded that "if someone has a gun in his or her home, the gun is 42 times more likely to be used to shoot a family member than an intruder."

    What Kellerman failed to consider is that the events that he "investigated" had a common thread: they involved families that contained people who were convicted felons, drug dealers, or those convicted of domestic violence, etc.
    Well that does make sense somewhat because studies have shown that you are much more likely to be killed by a family member than a total stranger.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by yuppor View Post
    he says that over 1 million times per year, a gun in CIVILIAN hands prevents a crime. Nothing is said about animal attacks, either.
    But think about it, that's only roughly 1 out of every 350 people every year. I don't find that hard to believe.

  8. #7
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    The number I believe is that 100% of criminals and tyrants (but then.... both are the same thing!) want their victims to be unarmed.

    Make no mistake... an anti gunner IS a wannabe tyrant that uses emotional touchy feely arguments to hide their desperate desire to control what other people are "allowed" to do.. and what other people are NOT "allowed" to do.

    After all, from petty criminal to tyrannical politician to just an ordinary egotistical turd jerk that thinks they are better than other people, the only thing that stops their agenda of being top dog and lording it over everyone.......... is a cat with a gun.

  9. there's 13 million ex felons "on the street", so it's highly likely that most families have a felon in their home, several times per year. Here's what's rich, guys. How many attackers get SHOT by civilians in justfiable self defense, hmm? The number is like 10,000 per year. So it's only necessary to hit somebody with a bullet about 1% of the time. :-) Which is a good thing, because most people, to include cops, are way too slow, inaccurate, not able to use tactics properly, etc. to actually handle a situation with minimal risk to themselves and other innocents, and maximum effectiveness vs the bad guy.

    even when

  10. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by yuppor View Post
    there's 13 million ex felons "on the street", so it's highly likely that most families have a felon in their home, several times per year. Here's what's rich, guys. How many attackers get SHOT by civilians in justfiable self defense, hmm? The number is like 10,000 per year. So it's only necessary to hit somebody with a bullet about 1% of the time. :-) Which is a good thing, because most people, to include cops, are way too slow, inaccurate, not able to use tactics properly, etc. to actually handle a situation with minimal risk to themselves and other innocents, and maximum effectiveness vs the bad guy.

    even when
    Ok... you just threw around a whole bunch of numbers... got cites and/or links to actual factual sources to support those numbers?

  11. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by AndeyHall View Post
    Well that does make sense somewhat because studies have shown that you are much more likely to be killed by a family member than a total stranger.

    Not in my house, I'm not.

    Edit: You just reiterated Kellerman's flawed conclusion. It is flawed because Kellerman looked ONLY at cases in which someone was shot in a home.
    Charlie

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