Gander Mountain the home of the idiots - Page 4
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Thread: Gander Mountain the home of the idiots

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
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    SE Florida
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    I stand corrected on the gift aspect between non-family members. I just asked by boss about it (FFL for 23 yrs) and he says that's just his policy concerning purchasers who say they're buying for non-family members. It saves him from any legal entanglements if the "gift" is really a straw purchase in disguise. I recall a conversation I had with an ATF agent at a gun show concerning this subject and he said ATF had no problem with family firearm gifts but that they didn't like such things between non-family members. Now that I think of it I don't recall him saying it was actually illegal....probably just my interpretation of his comments.
    (Insert random tough-guy quote here)
    "See my gun?? Aren't you impressed?" - Anonymous sheepdog
    The hardware is the same, but the software is vastly different.

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  3. #32
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
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    Living rent free in Bluesstringer's head apparently
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    I've walked into a gun shop with my wife who picked out the gun she wanted and I purchased it for her as a gift. Perfectly legal, and would have been legal if she was my girlfriend and not my wife (in my state) - although that probably would upset my wife.
    Who did they do the background check on?

    Thanks for the rest of the answers
    The finest Vodka is a razor Matthew, it leaves no ragged edges.

  4. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Cypher View Post
    Who did they do the background check on?

    Thanks for the rest of the answers
    I've bought two pistols for my girlfriend. One she picked out herself, they did the background check on her and I just gave her the cash, the other I bought as a surprise anniversary present and they did the background check on me. I just gifted it to her. Legal both ways.

  5. #34
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
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    Virginia
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    Really? How about if you stop ranting and raving and name calling and post the Federal Code that requires a dealer in ammunition that does not deal in firearms to have an FFL? An FFL is required to manufacture ammunition, not to be a dealer in ammunition. As long as a store does not sell firearms, they do not require an FFL, and it would be perfectly legal for them to sell handgun ammunition to an 18 year old. Not every Wal Mart in Virginia has an FFL and not every store in Virginia that sells ammunition has an FFL (unless they also sell firearms, then they would be required to have an FFL). Have a wonderful day, and try to be a better example for your daughter. Hopefully she doesn't suffer from the same rage problems that you do.

    BTW: I'll do your research for you:
    http://www.atf.gov/files/publication...f-p-5300-4.pdf

    Page 182:
    "(F11) Is a license required to engage
    in the business of selling
    small arms ammunition?

    No. A license is not required for a
    dealer in ammunition only, but a
    manufacturer or an importer of ammunition
    must be licensed.
    [18 U.S.C. 922 (a)(1)(B)]"
    Why don't you enlighten me on ammo dealers that do not sell firearms. Maybe you got a point...gas stations don't sell cars...you rest your point!

  6. Quote Originally Posted by JimTh View Post
    Why don't you enlighten me on ammo dealers that do not sell firearms. Maybe you got a point...gas stations don't sell cars...you rest your point!
    I have been in many Wal Marts in many states that sell ammunition but no firearms. There would be no reason for them to possess an FFL as all it does is create a reason for the ATF to investigate them that would not exist otherwise. In addition there are numerous mail order ammunition websites that do not sell firearms and do not have FFLs. Look at the different online sources for ammunition and see what their age requirments are, some will ship any ammo to anyone 18 years of age or over (unless otherwise known to be prohibited, of course). We have a local gun shop near my home town that in October is going to give up their FFL and stop selling firearms, but they are going to remain open selling firearm accessories and ammunition.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by Cypher View Post
    Who did they do the background check on?

    Thanks for the rest of the answers
    I filled out the form 4473 with my info. Presented my active duty military ID card as proof of identity and my orders as proof of residency. The background check was done on me. I charged the purchase to a joint credit card. Walked out, handed the box with the gun to the wife in the parking lot as a Valentine's Day Present. In my state it would have been completely legal to do the exact same thing with my next door neighbor who is not related to me and whom I have no reason to believe is not a resident of the same state I am and is not otherwise prohibited from possessing the firearm.

    Now. if that exact same next door neighbor (or my wife for that matter) who is not in any way prohibited from possessing or purchasing a firearm gives me THEIR money, and I go and buy a firearm with THEIR money from a dealer and come back with it and give them the gun and their change.... that is an illegal straw purchase.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  8. #37
    ezkl2230 Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by Cypher View Post
    I might be wrong but I thought a straw sale was one where I'm trying to circumvent the system in order to obtain a gun for someone who can't legally own one.

    Why couldn't a pruchase a gun as a gift for my girlfriend as long as I'm straight up about the fact that it's a gift and she isn't prohibited from owning a firearm?
    You can.

  9. #38
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Virginia
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    The most common definition of a strawman in Virginia was one that would come to a Virginia Gun Store and purchase a mess of firearms to resale on the streets in Washington. The strawman had to be a Virginia resident so most of the DC dudes couldn't show Virginia residency thus the "strawman".

    The strawman for gun purcahses was invented by Virginia gun runners after the 1968 FCA

  10. Quote Originally Posted by JimTh View Post
    The most common definition of a strawman in Virginia was one that would come to a Virginia Gun Store and purchase a mess of firearms to resale on the streets in Washington. The strawman had to be a Virginia resident so most of the DC dudes couldn't show Virginia residency thus the "strawman".
    We also have that problem in the other 49 states, but with Bloomberg and his thugs :-). And let's not forget Eric Holder and his department providing guns to Mexico.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  11. #40
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
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    SE FL and SE OH
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    5,602
    Quote Originally Posted by B2Tall View Post
    Your example doesn't seem to back up your assertaion. It clearly states that the dealer cannot transfer the firearm to you if you are buying it for another person. ATF's website clearly states that family members are exempt from this provided they are not prohibited from owning a firearm.

    ATF doesn't care who pays for the firearm, but, other than for family members, the person filling out the paperwork must be the "owner" of the gun. In other words, I can buy a gun for my girlfriend but she has to fill out the paperwork and undergo the background check.
    You aren't buying it for another person. You are buying it yourself. You are then giving it as a gift. No money from the other person is involved so you did not buy it for them. Yes I prefer not to deal with gifts that way but legally, there isn't anything wrong with it. Raffles are another sticky point and while someone can legally buy it and raffle it off, it is better to raffle the chance and then have the winner pick up the gun at the FFL. That takes the legal onus off of the rafflers and puts it on the winner.
    NRA Certified Pistol Instructor
    NRA Certified RSO
    Normal is an illusion. What is normal to the spider is chaos to the fly.

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