Top Ten Failures of the Concealed Carry Crowd - Page 5
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Thread: Top Ten Failures of the Concealed Carry Crowd

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by cluznar View Post
    I agree with some things such as not enough shooting practice, not being acquainted with good defense tactics, and not being aware of your surroundings. However, I feel the majority of CCW people do shoot at the range, some more than others. I believe most CCW people clean and lube their guns. I believe they look at videos about handling and shooting guns online. I believe the majority learn to realize how important a good holster and gun belt are.

    I doubt there is any other country that has people carrying guns which are better informed than CCW people in the U.S.

    Plus we have the best selection of firearms available.

    Having spent far too much time shooting at a public range, nothing could be further from the truth. As a whole, there is a total lack of skills, knowledge and common courtesy. It amazes me that anyone could ever believe that they could defend their lives with such poor preparation and meager equipment.

    Just as one simple example, I cannot tell you how many times that I have "repaired" a fellow shooters malfunctioning handgun with a quick cleaning and proper lubrication. When I inquire about their maintenance practices, I get the craziest answers. My personal favorite is "it's a new gun, I shouldn't have to clean or lube it".

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  3. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan Law View Post
    So you're saying no one needs training? As long as they have a gun, they are prepared to use it in a practical application?
    Ok read number 7 please...............
    BTTBBOB
    President & Chief Instructor
    www.sflagunschool.com

  4. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by FNWylde View Post
    Bob, clarify this please? Carrying does 'not' mean one is prepared to to use it in a practical application, correct?
    yes that is correct...........NOT is missing sorry I was typing fast.
    BTTBBOB
    President & Chief Instructor
    www.sflagunschool.com

  5. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Bttbbob View Post
    These statements are neither presumptuous nor arrogant. These are my observations of teaching as a profession for over 3 decades. And it was written for concealed carriers as in Florida we only have concealed carry. I don't teach in an Open Carry state. If you have that experience then jump right in if you instruct in an open carry state and tell us what you have seen in class......
    My experience mirrors Bob's. I feel bob has far more credibility given that his beliefs are based on a lifetime of shooting and training than those that hypothesize about the effectiveness of inadequate calibers without one bit of real life real world experience.

  6. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kosher kowboy View Post
    I get the craziest answers. My personal favorite is "it's a new gun, I shouldn't have to clean or lube it".
    I am amazed at the number of people that don't think they need to clean their weapon until they've shot 2000 rounds through it
    The finest Vodka is a razor Matthew, it leaves no ragged edges.

  7. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cypher View Post
    Does every thread on this forum turn into a pissing contest?
    You're in a much better position than most of us to answer that. You were the first to join apvbguy in pissing on this one.
    No one has ever heard me say that I "hate" cops, because I don't. This is why I will never trust one again though: You just never know...

  8. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Cypher View Post
    Does every thread on this forum turn into a pissing contest?
    No, I think it's more like the urinary Olympics.

  9. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by BluesStringer View Post
    You're in a much better position than most of us to answer that. You were the first to join apvbguy in pissing on this one.
    I can't fairly deny that you are correct, My apologies.
    The finest Vodka is a razor Matthew, it leaves no ragged edges.

  10. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Bttbbob View Post
    These statements are neither presumptuous nor arrogant. These are my observations of teaching as a profession for over 3 decades. And it was written for concealed carriers as in Florida we only have concealed carry. I don't teach in an Open Carry state. If you have that experience then jump right in if you instruct in an open carry state and tell us what you have seen in class......
    I live in Oklahoma. It's in all states that allow any form of carry. I can tell how serous a person is by the gun and gear they have and tell me they shoot once a year. You do make it sound like it's just conceal carry people. I read that only about 5% of people that own guns get any training. The training your state mandates does not count.
    Certified NRA Firearms Instructor
    Oklahoma SDA Instructor
    Utah CCW Instructor

  11. Couldn't have said it better myself, Cypher. I think anyone claiming to be the end-all and be-all of knowledge on the subject is giving themselves way too much credit and has an ego the size of Texas, really.

    As for the "Failure to..." list, you simply cannot have a one size fits all list when it comes to concealed carry, period. For example:

    "Failure to carry a gun of substantial caliber" is about as vague as you can be and still be incorrect depending on the circumstances.

    So is "Failure to properly equip oneself. (Belt, holster, reloads,illumination and nonlethal weapons)." I would think someone in Florida would understand this, but apparently not.

    If you're running to the grocery store to pick up milk and bread and it's a typical Florida summer, you're probably not going to be wearing enough clothing to properly conceal your "substantial caliber" .45 ACP Commander-style 1911 handgun and 4 spare magazines, belt, and holster. And if you ARE, people are going to look at you funny because you're WAY overdressed in 90 degree and 90% humidity. I live in the South Carolina swamps so the weather here is the same as Florida's, only without a nice ocean breeze. You sweat walking to and from the mailbox.

    Instead having to choose between heading out without a pistol at all or arming for the Rebel Uprising Mr. Harvey would have you do, there are lots of "pocket pistols" one can carry that are easily concealable....well, in the pocket of your short pants, even...imagine that - a "pocket pistol" - which would be a good compromise so long as it's a weapon you're familiar with and have practiced with.

    I would certainly much rather have a pocket pistol with 6 or 7 shots instead of nothing because of the way I'm dressed, that much is certain.

    The other thing about "failing" to carry a hand cannon is that some people simply cannot accurately fire a .45 or .44 magnum Dirty Harry gun if they are old, small in stature, or have physical problems. A GOOD instructor should take into account an individual's size, weight, strength, and experience and then go forward based on what that individual needs. Sitting at a computer being condescending to people who don't agree with 150% of what you say+ not only would make me wonder about that person's ego (it sure does), but it's someone I'd make sure NOT to be instructed by.

    Teaching is more than just imparting knowledge. It's doing so in a constructive and supportive way and in a manner that doesn't intimidate your students.

    If a student doesn't feel comfortable shooting a Macho-caliber firearm, I wouldn't force training on it down their throats. Why? Because chances are they'll not enjoy the experience and therefore won't PRACTICE the way they should in order to achieve a good level of proficiency. Find something that the student is comfortable with, even if it's a .22LR pistol, and make sure they get good practice techniques down and don't develop bad habits. I have seen too many people develop a flinch because of being forced to use too much gun for THEM than they should be using, and once a flinch develops, for example, it can sometimes be very, very difficult to train it back out of them...especially with new shooters.

    If someone really needs to be able to shoot a "big gun" for whatever reason and isn't used to it, start small and work your way up. Some people simply aren't suited for the bigger stuff. Bad habits are easy to form and difficult to break, so making sure their form is good with a firearm they feel comfortable with practicing repeatedly with is FAR more important than "uh...biggest gun wins."

    No...the biggest gun does NOT win. It's the person who gets their target incapacitated first without getting shot in the process. I don't care how macho and good you think you are, it's not a very good idea to practice with several "wee little .22LR bullet holes" in you, and being wounded will negatively affect your accuracy!

    Someone who IS very accurate with a .22LR WILL BEAT someone of average skills sporting a .45 - PERIOD. A round - whether it be .22 or a .45 - that goes through the brain stem will both have the same effect, which is to cause everything to instantly relax and therefore ending the confrontation. People hopped on drugs, for example, can and often have absorbed multiple shots to the chest and not stopped and have still been able to get to their victims.

    Nope, I'd take someone being fast and accurate with a .22 at my side over an average shooter with a .45 ACP with a 19 round magazine ANY DAY OF THE WEEK.

    Real-world, every-day application of common sense is an essential element in anyone's day-to-day self-protection needs. While I have no doubt Mr. Harvey's credentials are what he says they are, judging by his comments and his condescending, overbearing manner, something tells me he may not be the best firearms TEACHER around, assuming he has the same smug attitude with his students.

    Dunno about Florida, but in South Carolina we abbreviate "Know-It-Alls" to "KIA" for a REASON.

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