MI school threatens to incite panic and hold education hostage.... - Page 5
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Thread: MI school threatens to incite panic and hold education hostage....

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by ezkl2230 View Post
    The more postings I read from BC1, the fewer places he seems to be in favor of carrying if someone might object to the exercise of the right. Businesses? Uh uh. The parking lot of a business (after all, that is also the property of the business owner, and laws that allow us to secure firearms in our vehicles trample the private property rights of the owner)? Uh uh. Apartment complexes? Uh uh. Schools? Uh uh. Besides, you're not going to really be spending any significant amounts of time in any of these places, so the likelihood that something is going to happen to you while you are transacting your business in one of these places is really quite slim. Your concern amounts to paranoia. So let's just forget the inconvenient fact that shootings and other violent attacks have happened in every one of these places, and let's just remember that the owner/operator has the right to object to the exercise of our right, and we have the right to go somewhere else where they don't object. The common thread here is that the person who has the obligation to make the accommodation, in his view, is A:WAYS the person whose right is explicitly guaranteed under the Constitution - the carrier; the person who objects to the exercise of the right has no obligation to accept our right to carry. There's something fundamentally flawed with that logic.

    I get the growing feeling that the only place he is really in favor of carry is in one's own home - unless, of course, a member of your family objects?
    Whoa.... Lets take a step back and press the "common sense" button. Pouring more gasoline on a burning fire is not always a good idea....you have the ability and the right to do it, but there's a good chance that you too will get burned.
    Why does everything have to be taken to an extreme? If you're carrying into a school...and you know it will be locked down at the very sight of your weapon....what's the issue with pulling your shirt out and over your weapon? I don't know about you, but I have better things to do than sit in the school office waiting for the police to show up. Then waiting for them to explain to the administrators that you are perfectly legal. My time is valuable and sitting there is wasting it.

    As for BC1's posts... if you've read many of them, they are typically factual, especially when it comes to legal issues, and are well thought out from a 'common sense' perspective. I believe his comments about concealing when entering the building were aimed at the big picture... he knows you have every right to open carry, but when you know it will cause everyone, INCLUDING YOU, more grief and aggravation....why add that extra fuel to the already burning fire.

    Lets suppose I'm driving on an Interstate in the right lane.... another driver is entering the highway from an onramp and we will both end up at the same place in the lane as he enters. I legally can stay in my lane and have every right to do so...I DON"T HAVE TO MOVE...and if he pulls directly into "my lane" and hits me, he is 'at fault'. That's right...He's at fault!!!! BUT now I am inconvenienced by the fact that I have to now deal with the insurance companies, collision shops, car rental shop, etc, etc.....BUT I"M LEGALLY RIGHT!!!
    Now go back and press the "common sense" button... I go through what you would consider the "great inconvenience" of making a simple lane change.... I go on with my life, the other driver goes on with his life... no harm, no foul!!! Just think of pulling your shirt out to cover your weapon as the simple lane change... it's just common sense!

    That said... you can all start the personal attacks and express your hard line opinions that will add fuel to the anti-gunner's fire!

  2.   
  3. Quote Originally Posted by jrs View Post
    If you're carrying into a school...and you know it will be locked down at the very sight of your weapon....what's the issue with pulling your shirt out and over your weapon?
    The first issue that I can think of is that would be against the law in Michigan.

    The second issue I see is that the state of Michigan is claiming, "We are giving you the right to carry a firearm in school!" (which they really aren't but different argument.) Then in the same breath says, "But you better not do it, or we will take it away from you." Hmmm..... to me that is even worse government oppression than just banning the firearm. At least a real statutory ban can be fought in court. The idea that "don't do it, or we will make it illegal when you do" can't be challenged in court nearly as easily.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  4. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcreek View Post
    So...remind again why you carry a gun? If it's paranoid to think you might get attacked in the next 5 minutes its paranoid to think you might get attacked at all. If they want to call us crazy let then. The far left and the Brady's already refer to anybody who owns a gun as an extremist anyways. You think giving into to their will is going to change that? Smh..
    I generally don't carry a gun. Only in certain situations. I'm not so paranoid to think I'm getting killed today. This from someone who has experienced murder in the family.
    .
    I read people constantly complaining that they're hassled for OC. There are thousands of posts here about the subject. Then they go stick it in everyone's face and wonder why they keep getting hassled. Dad was right... the person who will cause me the most harm is the guy who watches me shave every morning in the mirror. There are way and then there ware ways.
    GOD, GUNS and GUITARS

  5. #44
    ezkl2230 Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by jrs View Post
    Whoa.... Lets take a step back and press the "common sense" button. Pouring more gasoline on a burning fire is not always a good idea....you have the ability and the right to do it, but there's a good chance that you too will get burned.
    Why does everything have to be taken to an extreme? If you're carrying into a school...and you know it will be locked down at the very sight of your weapon....what's the issue with pulling your shirt out and over your weapon? I don't know about you, but I have better things to do than sit in the school office waiting for the police to show up. Then waiting for them to explain to the administrators that you are perfectly legal. My time is valuable and sitting there is wasting it.

    As for BC1's posts... if you've read many of them, they are typically factual, especially when it comes to legal issues, and are well thought out from a 'common sense' perspective. I believe his comments about concealing when entering the building were aimed at the big picture... he knows you have every right to open carry, but when you know it will cause everyone, INCLUDING YOU, more grief and aggravation....why add that extra fuel to the already burning fire.

    Lets suppose I'm driving on an Interstate in the right lane.... another driver is entering the highway from an onramp and we will both end up at the same place in the lane as he enters. I legally can stay in my lane and have every right to do so...I DON"T HAVE TO MOVE...and if he pulls directly into "my lane" and hits me, he is 'at fault'. That's right...He's at fault!!!! BUT now I am inconvenienced by the fact that I have to now deal with the insurance companies, collision shops, car rental shop, etc, etc.....BUT I"M LEGALLY RIGHT!!!
    Now go back and press the "common sense" button... I go through what you would consider the "great inconvenience" of making a simple lane change.... I go on with my life, the other driver goes on with his life... no harm, no foul!!! Just think of pulling your shirt out to cover your weapon as the simple lane change... it's just common sense!

    That said... you can all start the personal attacks and express your hard line opinions that will add fuel to the anti-gunner's fire!
    the issue, as has already been stated, is that you can't just pull your shirt over it without violating MI law.

  6. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by ezkl2230 View Post
    The more postings I read from BC1, the fewer places he seems to be in favor of carrying if someone might object to the exercise of the right. Businesses? Uh uh. The parking lot of a business (after all, that is also the property of the business owner, and laws that allow us to secure firearms in our vehicles trample the private property rights of the owner)? Uh uh. Apartment complexes? Uh uh. Schools? Uh uh. Besides, you're not going to really be spending any significant amounts of time in any of these places, so the likelihood that something is going to happen to you while you are transacting your business in one of these places is really quite slim. Your concern amounts to paranoia. So let's just forget the inconvenient fact that shootings and other violent attacks have happened in every one of these places, and let's just remember that the owner/operator has the right to object to the exercise of our right, and we have the right to go somewhere else where they don't object. The common thread here is that the person who has the obligation to make the accommodation, in his view, is A:WAYS the person whose right is explicitly guaranteed under the Constitution - the carrier; the person who objects to the exercise of the right has no obligation to accept our right to carry. There's something fundamentally flawed with that logic.

    I get the growing feeling that the only place he is really in favor of carry is in one's own home - unless, of course, a member of your family objects?
    I object to carry on my own property. I maintain the upper hand on property for which I worked, paid and own. Thank God I live in a country where I can throw you out by the ear. The second amendment isn't between you and I, it's between you and your government. I'm not violating anything. If you want a job with me you don't carry in the workplace. Decide... you want big bucks or to carry a gun? you want to come to me home? Leave the gun in the car. You have zero say in these places. In NY the only place we can't carry is a school. I believe schools should be protected by armed guards.
    ...........
    Sooooo, I don't know where this crap you're writing comes from. I only object on my own property. And that will never be changed by anyone.
    GOD, GUNS and GUITARS

  7. Quote Originally Posted by BC1 View Post
    I generally don't carry a gun. Only in certain situations. I'm not so paranoid to think I'm getting killed today. This from someone who has experienced murder in the family.
    .
    I read people constantly complaining that they're hassled for OC. There are thousands of posts here about the subject. Then they go stick it in everyone's face and wonder why they keep getting hassled. Dad was right... the person who will cause me the most harm is the guy who watches me shave every morning in the mirror. There are way and then there ware ways.
    I haven't stuck my gun in anyone's face in my life. I wear mine on my belt. If my gun is in their face than that is an interesting situation indeed.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  8. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by BC1 View Post
    ~
    Do you honestly believe the chief of police would tell a school superintendent not to call the police when someone enters with a gun? Ain't gonna happen. They must respond each and every time.
    ~
    Here's a thought... how about leaving the gun in the car when entering the school for five friggin minutes. Forget the law. How about some common sense. Guns in schools scare the crap out of people who don't know guns or the law. It merely invites more accusations of lunacy. Stop feeding the liberals' agenda. To carry into the school on the off-chance that your will be attacked in the next five minutes is a bit paranoid.
    My question is, when are we going to stop rubbing the bellys of liberals and bending over to their will? OC in a school is legal in Michigan as long as you possess a CPL, however, Concealed Carry into a school is not legal. Paranoia isnt what this is about, although, in todays day and age, OC in a School isnt such a bad idea, if it scares people, so what, its a right, and Im glad this guy had the guts to do it. I think if anything, your comment feeds the Liberal agenda, calling for "common sense" laws.
    My question is, if you could CC into a school, would you do it? Do you OC on the streets? I ask these because if you say yes to either, it makes you a bit hypocritical.
    Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American Soldier....One died for your soul; the other for your freedom.

  9. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrs View Post
    Whoa.... Lets take a step back and press the "common sense" button. Pouring more gasoline on a burning fire is not always a good idea....you have the ability and the right to do it, but there's a good chance that you too will get burned.
    Why does everything have to be taken to an extreme? If you're carrying into a school...and you know it will be locked down at the very sight of your weapon....what's the issue with pulling your shirt out and over your weapon? I don't know about you, but I have better things to do than sit in the school office waiting for the police to show up. Then waiting for them to explain to the administrators that you are perfectly legal. My time is valuable and sitting there is wasting it.

    As for BC1's posts... if you've read many of them, they are typically factual, especially when it comes to legal issues, and are well thought out from a 'common sense' perspective. I believe his comments about concealing when entering the building were aimed at the big picture... he knows you have every right to open carry, but when you know it will cause everyone, INCLUDING YOU, more grief and aggravation....why add that extra fuel to the already burning fire.

    Lets suppose I'm driving on an Interstate in the right lane.... another driver is entering the highway from an onramp and we will both end up at the same place in the lane as he enters. I legally can stay in my lane and have every right to do so...I DON"T HAVE TO MOVE...and if he pulls directly into "my lane" and hits me, he is 'at fault'. That's right...He's at fault!!!! BUT now I am inconvenienced by the fact that I have to now deal with the insurance companies, collision shops, car rental shop, etc, etc.....BUT I"M LEGALLY RIGHT!!!
    Now go back and press the "common sense" button... I go through what you would consider the "great inconvenience" of making a simple lane change.... I go on with my life, the other driver goes on with his life... no harm, no foul!!! Just think of pulling your shirt out to cover your weapon as the simple lane change... it's just common sense!

    That said... you can all start the personal attacks and express your hard line opinions that will add fuel to the anti-gunner's fire!
    Making a lane change isn't illegal.... concealed carry in a school in MI is. Ummm, there's the difference. A better analogy would be, the on ramp driver sees you there and calls ahead for police to check you out as to why you are in the lane that he wants to be in... or you could just not be on the road at all.

    The fact remains, it is legal to carry in a MI school in an open carry fashion only. If the school isn't appreciative of the law, it is them that has to swallow it, not the person who is following the rules and open carrying as the state said they must if they go into the school armed. Putting that shirt over it, makes you a criminal. And to suggest one unnecessarily handles one's weapon in the parking lot and leave it in an unattended vehicle would be even more preposterous.

    Here's an aside... the citizenry doesn't get all riled up and start shutting schools down if a police officer carries his weapon in his holster on his belt in an open carry fashion. Why do they get riled up and paranoid when someone else does it?
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote."
    ~ Benjamin Franklin (maybe)

  10. Quote Originally Posted by Itstjs View Post
    My question is, if you could CC into a school, would you do it? Do you OC on the streets? I ask these because if you say yes to either, it makes you a bit hypocritical.
    I'm surprised you asked that! Read what he writes:

    Quote Originally Posted by BC1 View Post
    I generally don't carry a gun. Only in certain situations. I'm not so paranoid to think I'm getting killed today.
    Quote Originally Posted by BC1 View Post
    I object to carry on my own property. I maintain the upper hand on property for which I worked, paid and own. Thank God I live in a country where I can throw you out by the ear. you want to come to me home? Leave the gun in the car. You have zero say in these places.
    Did that answer your question, Itstjs? :-)
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  11. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    I'm surprised you asked that! Read what he writes:





    Did that answer your question, Itstjs? :-)
    Unfortunately yes, sounds alot like Ms. Fienstein and the other liberals on Capital Hill. "I can own it, but scerw your personal safety." Hm. Appears weve had a troll on here for quite some time, not sure how I missed it until now.
    Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American Soldier....One died for your soul; the other for your freedom.

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