To the Rabid Anti-Open Carriers - Page 2
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Thread: To the Rabid Anti-Open Carriers

  1. #11
    Well said. I both CC and OC. I will CC at work and OC almost everywhere else. The other day while standing in the check out line at a local grocery store, I was OCing. Standing behind me was a young couple with a child. I heard the young lady make a comment about my OC and said, "that's why I don't like OC." I turned to face her and ask what exactly about my OC that offended her. She came back with the standard litany of safety issues. I started by saying I respect your point of view but it is unfortunately misinformed. I started by showing her that my gun, a Ruger SR40c was very secure in the holster. I showed her that it could not be pulled out very easily by anybody. (I was wearing a Serpa). I then explained to her the laws in the state of OK govern who can OC and in what circumstances. In other words that not just anybody could OC. I also stated that most people that OC have had additional training beyond the state minimum in regards to use, and proper control of the weapon. I am not sure that I made a difference in her opinion, but I hope she at least may be a little less concerned.
    Those that bother me most about OC are those that are doing it to make a point and try to cause confrontation because they are trying to change people's opinion about OC. In reality what happens is more people become hardened towards OC and try to restrict us even more.

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  3. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Saginaw, Michigan
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    3,355
    Quote Originally Posted by davcommander View Post
    Well said. I both CC and OC. I will CC at work and OC almost everywhere else. The other day while standing in the check out line at a local grocery store, I was OCing. Standing behind me was a young couple with a child. I heard the young lady make a comment about my OC and said, "that's why I don't like OC." I turned to face her and ask what exactly about my OC that offended her. She came back with the standard litany of safety issues. I started by saying I respect your point of view but it is unfortunately misinformed. I started by showing her that my gun, a Ruger SR40c was very secure in the holster. I showed her that it could not be pulled out very easily by anybody. (I was wearing a Serpa). I then explained to her the laws in the state of OK govern who can OC and in what circumstances. In other words that not just anybody could OC. I also stated that most people that OC have had additional training beyond the state minimum in regards to use, and proper control of the weapon. I am not sure that I made a difference in her opinion, but I hope she at least may be a little less concerned.
    Those that bother me most about OC are those that are doing it to make a point and try to cause confrontation because they are trying to change people's opinion about OC. In reality what happens is more people become hardened towards OC and try to restrict us even more.
    About the part of your post I put in bold for highlight...

    Although open carry has been legal in Michigan since Michigan became a State in 1837 it was largely unheard of actually being done except by a few hunters while hunting. Certainly not seen in urban settings. Then, approximately 7 years ago, a very few guys got together, researched the laws, and decided that since open carry was legal within the current laws they would give it a try and see what happened. But they were wise and made sure they had recording devices to document what happened to them.

    Well... plenty happened. The original few encouraged a few more and then there were a few more.... and then the hassles began. People were arrested and the media got involved too. The result? Those recordings were used to get the charges dropped.. and those recordings were used as evidence in the lawsuits against the police agencies that had illegally arrested the open carriers. And the media got involved some more hoping to use yet another MAN WITH A GUN! issue to sensationalize the whole thing.

    And then there were the fellows who openly carried rifles. Oh my.. the police didn't like that at all... and the media went nuts! And more arrests happened followed by more lawsuits.

    The end result as of today? The media coverage that was supposed to sensationalize and demonize carrying guns ended up educating quite a bit of the public that it is legal to carry a gun in public. In fact.. the media helped educate the public that if a person in Michigan has a concealed carry permit it is illegal for them to carry concealed in a school but it is legal for them to open carry in a school. And the lawsuits that were won with judgements against the police caused many police to be retrained in the legality of open carry and even prompted the Michigan State Police to issue a legal update bulletin #86 (can be read at the link below).

    http://www.michigan.gov/documents/ms...2_336854_7.pdf

    that explained to police depts. how open carry is legal in Michigan.

    In short... in Michigan at least.... those who intentionally open carried to make a point, and even pushed that point in some cases, and made sure they recorded what happened (some recorded both audio and video) caused open carry to become known to the public as being legal and is now fairly well accepted as a great big.............. nothing. Harassment of any kind is rare and instead of people being afraid of seeing a man with a gun many folks approach that man with a gun with questions because they are curious if they can do it too.

    And that result is exactly the opposite of the fear that open carrying to make a point or resulting in confrontations would harden folks against open carry and cause even more restrictions.

    I open carry in urban settings all the time... almost daily... in Saginaw and the outlying areas. In businesses large and small. I've open carried into local council meetings to require illegal anti gun ordinances be repealed. And rarely do I get anything even resembling a negative response from anyone... and that is because a few hardy souls had the courage to step up, make a point, and endure the resulting confrontations a very short 7 years ago.

  4. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by SR40c View Post
    Never have understood the open carry vs conceal carry toxicity. Just makes no sense what so ever.
    I agree completely. We're just two sides of the same coin. I happen to CC but I've never had any issue with OC'ers. I respect their choice. All of us are 2A supporters so why does it make a difference HOW we chose to carry?
    NRA Life Member
    NRA Certified Instructor (Pistol & Personal Defense in the Home)
    North Carolina Concealed Carry Instructor

  5. I agree

  6. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Louisville Ky.
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    Yeah, I understand what you are saying. I CC because I don't like the attention I would get OC, but if someone else is comfortable OCing I have no problem with it.

  7. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Pittsburgh, PA
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    I wanted to say thank you to everyone so far within this thread.

    This is the very first thread on this forum I have seen concerning OC and CC that didn't turn into a rabid disgusting display of machismo and braggadocio. Thank you for restoring my faith in you brothers and sisters in arms. It's nice to see a polite conversation about OC and CC.

    So, once again, thanks to all of you who have acted like truly human beings.
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote."
    ~ Benjamin Franklin (maybe)

  8. #17
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Sepra Peratus/Arkansas
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    1,638
    In AR we're in the middle of a open carry fight with the letter of the law ACT 746. Some say it's legal to open carry some say it's not. So I'm forced to CC but would like the option to OC. AR Carry is having "Walks" to draw attention to OC and I suspect it will come up again this legislation cycle. Hope it will get passed this year!
    ~Responsible people who understand that their personal protection is up to them, provide themselves with protection. Those that don't have only themselves to blame.~Proud NRA ~SAF~GoA Member~

  9. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Saginaw, Michigan
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    3,355
    Quote Originally Posted by gejoslin View Post
    In AR we're in the middle of a open carry fight with the letter of the law ACT 746. Some say it's legal to open carry some say it's not. So I'm forced to CC but would like the option to OC. AR Carry is having "Walks" to draw attention to OC and I suspect it will come up again this legislation cycle. Hope it will get passed this year!
    I wish the best for your efforts!

  10. I am a very firm believer in the Second Amendment and in the future am willing to die to protect ALL the amendments as originally written. IT is NOT the governments job to tell THE PEOPLE how, when, why OR where they can carry, whether open or concealed. The second Amendment is there, not for hunting as "they" would have us to believe, but for the protection OF THE PEOPLE from tyranny in GOVERNMENT---ANY GOVERNMENT!!! If WE THE PEOPLE want to protect our rights, GOD GIVEN and guaranteed to us by nature and protected by THE CONSTITUTION AND THE BILL OF RIGHTS, then we need TO EXERCISE them EVERY day. I have a CC License, but choose to OC, the CC license allows me to keep my firearm loaded at all times versus having to unload it in the car. LAST--Keep ALL firearms out of the reach of ANYONE not able to be responsible with it. This being said, "AN UNLOADED FIREARM IS AS USELESS AS A CAR IN THE GARAGE WITHOUT FUEL.

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