Video/Audio recording
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Thread: Video/Audio recording

  1. Video/Audio recording

    There have been a lot of youtube videos showing encounters with police officers during traffic stops, etc. I think that this has been determined to be legal to do (even though it may bother the officer a bit). I have seen posts suggesting that a person involved in a self defense shooting try to record on video with his or her cellphone whatever evidence there may be at the scene (like shell casings, where the knife was tossed, etc).

    This is fine, but there is only your word to go on in many cases as to what led up to the shooting. Time dilation, tunnel vision, and other factors lead to inaccurate memory of the incident. Of course you can't run around with a vid recorder running 24/7 so I was thinking about other ways to record, say the last few hours of audio on a continual basis.

    I've found a device that does just that. It is a battery powered continuous loop pocket audio recorder. If an attack was to occur, it would be caught on the recording loop and then you could stop the recorder and the event could be captured for later review to (hopefully) help you defend yourself against a murder charge.

    Does anyone know of the legality of this? If you can record video of an officer performing his duty, and if public places are by definition in the public domain, is there some problem of recording in this manner? You are not storing or archiving anything, except the last few minutes of a crisis situation.


    Thanks in advance,
    Paul

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  3. #2
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    Recording laws for video and/or audio vary from State to State. In some States it is legal to record other people without their consent as long as there isn't an entitlement to privacy. Like it might be Ok to record in a restaurant but not be Ok to record in the bathroom for just one possible example. In other States it might be necessary to get the consent to be recorded from the people being recorded no matter where they are being recorded.

    And there might be different/more stringent laws about video recording over audio recording.

    It would be wise for everyone who carries (concealed or openly) to consider running some kind of recording device (following the recording laws of their State) every moment they are carrying simply because then there is a recording of how it started, what actually happened while it was happening, and how it all ended up after the cops were done and the dust settled.

    There is another advantage to constantly running a recorder (if that is legal in your State) because if someone lies and says you did something that you didn't do............ you have a recording that you can refer to in court and point out the lack of evidence supporting that lie.

    In my not so humble opinion video with audio recordings are best because not only is there a record of what was said but there is a good chance you caught who did what while they said it on video.

    So.... may I suggest doing a search for the recording laws in your State?

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by paulooch1958 View Post
    There have been a lot of youtube videos showing encounters with police officers during traffic stops, etc. I think that this has been determined to be legal to do (even though it may bother the officer a bit). I have seen posts suggesting that a person involved in a self defense shooting try to record on video with his or her cellphone whatever evidence there may be at the scene (like shell casings, where the knife was tossed, etc).

    This is fine, but there is only your word to go on in many cases as to what led up to the shooting. Time dilation, tunnel vision, and other factors lead to inaccurate memory of the incident. Of course you can't run around with a vid recorder running 24/7 so I was thinking about other ways to record, say the last few hours of audio on a continual basis.

    I've found a device that does just that. It is a battery powered continuous loop pocket audio recorder. If an attack was to occur, it would be caught on the recording loop and then you could stop the recorder and the event could be captured for later review to (hopefully) help you defend yourself against a murder charge.

    Does anyone know of the legality of this? If you can record video of an officer performing his duty, and if public places are by definition in the public domain, is there some problem of recording in this manner? You are not storing or archiving anything, except the last few minutes of a crisis situation.


    Thanks in advance,
    Paul
    Legality varies state to state. In some states it's illegal to record (audio or video) a LEO without his consent. Doing so will result in confiscation of your gear, and your subsequent arrest. These shield laws are, in my opinion, stupid and serve only to protect the government from the citizens it abuses, but they are in place.
    No statement should be believed because it is made by an authority.
    Robert A. Heinlein

  5. #4
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    If recording an event where my or my families life is in danger is illegal, to damn bad.

  6. #5
    Not saying right or wrong. I do see a lawyer using that as a pre meditated device--If he didn't want to kill him why did he just happen to have this recorder with him. I'm not a lawyer so not sure.
    FUNNY HOW PEOPLE ALWAYS WANT THE TRUTH AS LONG AS IT'S WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR

  7. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Burtboomer View Post
    Not saying right or wrong. I do see a lawyer using that as a pre meditated device--If he didn't want to kill him why did he just happen to have this recorder with him. I'm not a lawyer so not sure.
    Ummmm... if the rationale that a prosecutor/lawyer used was that a person is carrying a recorder because he intends to harm someone.. wouldn't the prosecutor/lawyer be able to say the guy was carrying a gun because he intended to shoot someone?

    Guns, and recorders, are very useful self defense devices. The gun to defend against the bad guy and the recorder to defend against being wrongfully charged with a crime.

  8. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    Guns, and recorders, are very useful self defense devices. The gun to defend against the bad guy and the recorder to defend against being wrongfully charged with a crime.
    I always have a video cam within reach while in my car, but it's really inadequate for walking around with due to it tying up my gun-hand. I'm not very ambidextrous, but to the extent that I am, the dedicated camera I have is really only a right-handed camera. I could make my phone function with my left hand, but it's clumsy and takes more concentration than I'm willing to allow myself to be distracted from situational awareness by. Do you have any suggestions for an affordable (read: cheap) hands-free rigging while on foot? Something that I could just aim in a general direction, turn it on and basically forget it until after whatever I'm recording is done? I looked and couldn't find anything useful for less than about $350 bucks, and those are large, bulky, restrict movement and more money than I care to spend anyway. I was hoping to find some kind of harness with a fairly unobtrusive mount around the center of my chest. Ever seen or used anything like that? BTW, what I have is not a Go-Pro. It's just a small JVC digital cam-corder. It would be easy if I had a Go-Pro, as they make every kind of hands-free mounts for them that's ever been thought of, but I can't afford a whole new system, just want to go hands-free with what I've got. Anyone who has any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

    Blues

  9. I live in California. As we all know it's a state full of stringent laws. When I posted the above, I also wrote to the ACLDN editors with the same question. I received a response from Gila Hayes containing links to several ACLDN newsletters with discussions about his very topic.

    This newsletter : http://www.armedcitizensnetwork.org/...ork_2011-5.pdf contains a reply from Attorney Keith H. Rutman, Esq. in San Diego. This is a an excerpt from his reply :

    "In short, as far as audio is concerned, California is a
    two party consent state. Absent both parties’ consent, it is
    deemed illegal wiretapping and you can also be sued for
    civil damages. The evidence is also inadmissible in court."

    Gotta love this place.

  10. #9
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    Ohio is a one party consent state for recording. As long as I'm a party to the "conversation", I can record all I want and with NO notice.

    EVERY time I leave the house armed, I've got an audio recording device running.

    Almost EVERY high profile police misconduct case I can think of involved recording of the cop's behavior.

    In addition, recording can protect you from other threats as well. An attorney friend once asked me to take pictures of some anti-abortion protesters intentionally blocking the view from a hidden driveway of a building with a Planned Parenthood office in it. This had already almost caused several accidents (including one involving me). This was a small faction of the the protesters who'd been warned repeatedly, and who had in fact said they didn't CARE if it caused an accident, even a FATAL one.

    While taking pictures of the illegal activity, I was approached by two of the troublemakers who attempted to provoke me. I just sat silently taking pictures and reading a book on machine guns. In addition to abundant photos of them trying to cause an accident, I got audio of one of them trying to start a fight with me.

    Afterwards, my friend called a meeting with the protesters, at which the majority disassociated itself from the troublemakers. As an aside, my friend asked the ringleader of the troublemakers, an easily 350lb. foul mouthed buffoon, if he thought it was bright to try to pick a fight with a guy wearing an NRA instructor's cap and reading a book on machine guns. At that point, a [rather dim] light bulb clicked on over Jabba the Hut's head. Apparently, his life in his mother's basement flashed before his eyes...

  11. #10

    Video/Audio recording

    Bikenut that is a very good point. I have to agree with that.
    FUNNY HOW PEOPLE ALWAYS WANT THE TRUTH AS LONG AS IT'S WHAT THEY WANT TO HEAR

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