Terrorist watch list and Guns - Page 4

View Poll Results: Should people on the U.S. terrorist watch list be allowed to buy guns?

Voters
146. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    80 54.79%
  • No

    66 45.21%
Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst ... 234
Results 31 to 36 of 36

Thread: Terrorist watch list and Guns

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Indiana
    Posts
    4,675
    Even though every single one of the 20,000 or so gun laws on the books in this country is unconstitutional, I'm going to play devil's advocate here and say that I'm in favor of denying them the right to purchase guns. Sure, laws against the purchase and possession of firearms and ammunition by convicted felons and the mentally ill have never stopped them from getting guns, and it won't stop accused terrorists either, but nevertheless, the thought of radical Islamic fundamentalists being able to purchase them as easily as I can doesn't sit well with me.
    Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.

    Benjamin Franklin

  2.   
  3. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by tattedupboy View Post
    Even though every single one of the 20,000 or so gun laws on the books in this country is unconstitutional, I'm going to play devil's advocate here and say that I'm in favor of denying them the right to purchase guns. Sure, laws against the purchase and possession of firearms and ammunition by convicted felons and the mentally ill have never stopped them from getting guns, and it won't stop accused terrorists either, but nevertheless, the thought of radical Islamic fundamentalists being able to purchase them as easily as I can doesn't sit well with me.

    I am against Terrorist having guns. However we all know that terrorists and terrorist watch lists are not one in the same. Seeing as how most of us that post on this forum are right wing terrorist according to some, we could very well be now or in the future on the government watch list.
    By faith Noah,being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear,prepared an ark to the saving of his house;by the which he condemned the world,and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith Heb.11:7

  4. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by tattedupboy View Post
    Even though every single one of the 20,000 or so gun laws on the books in this country is unconstitutional, I'm going to play devil's advocate here and say that I'm in favor of denying them the right to purchase guns. Sure, laws against the purchase and possession of firearms and ammunition by convicted felons and the mentally ill have never stopped them from getting guns, and it won't stop accused terrorists either, but nevertheless, the thought of radical Islamic fundamentalists being able to purchase them as easily as I can doesn't sit well with me.
    That is to say then that you give the NICS system less credability than this No-Fly/ terrorist watch list. Sorry, but when 963 people on the No-Fly list attempt to buy a gun, and 865 were successful, that tells me something. It tells me that the NICS system did it's job and prevented those 98 people who were not supposed to possess a gun from doing so. And the other 865 didn't belong on the list to begin with, just as approximately 24,000 other people on the list do not belong there.

    And by the way, Islamic Fundamentalists already get guns WAY easier than you or I. And they get all the fun ones too. They don't go to a gunshop or gunshow, they have smugglers bring them right to their front door.
    The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the Constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first. - Thomas Jefferson

  5. #34
    NRA-ILA :: Bloomberg's Billions Buy Opinions

    Friday, December 11, 2009


    Understanding the Latest Anti-Gun "Poll"

    This week, anti-gun New York City mayor Michael Bloomberg's anti-gun group, Mayors Against Illegal Guns, released the findings of a poll conducted by a political consulting firm called "The Word Doctors," whose slogan is "It's not what you say, it's what people hear." Word Doctors' president is a pollster who has been reprimanded by the American Association for Public Opinion Research and censured by the National Council on Public Polls, and who says that the key to polling is "to ask a question in the way that you get the right answer."

    At some other time in our nation's history, an organization like this would not have been commissioned to conduct a poll, and perhaps it would not even have existed. At a minimum, its poll would have been considered biased and rejected by every newspaper in the country.

    But today, as the distinction between editorials and news has become blurred, information is treated so superficially that a catchy word or two is enough to get someone elected to public office, and some in positions of authority cannot conceive of the concept of shame.

    Thus, earlier this week, Washington Post columnist E.J. Dionne and Sen. Frank Lautenberg (D-N.J.) excitedly called attention to the bought-and-paid-for Word Doctors "poll," which claimed that a majority of NRA members and other gun owners support Lautenberg's bills to prohibit the possession of firearms by people placed (often mistakenly) on the FBI terrorist watchlist (S.1317), to require gun show promoters to send ledgers of customer information to the federal government (S.843), and to let the FBI retain records for 180 days of every gun purchase approved by the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) (S.2820). The poll also claimed support for Bloomberg's proposal to rescind the Tiahrt Amendment, which prevents unfettered release of BATFE firearm trace data. (Bloomberg, of course, wants to use the data in lawsuits against the firearms industry.)

    But did the poll really show such strong support? Certainly the participants didn't have much information to go on. The poll didn't explain that the watchlist has been under fire by the Department of Justice's Inspector General's office and the ACLU for improperly including the names of innocent people, and that many innocent people have been mistaken for those who are on the watchlist. It didn't explain that Lautenberg's gun show bill would do much more than require NICS checks on private gun sales at gun shows.

    The poll mischaracterized the issue of NICS record retention. Instead of informing poll participants that the accused Ft. Hood murderer had been investigated by the FBI and found to not constitute a terror threat months before he went through a NICS check to purchase the gun he allegedly used in the murders, the poll simply asked whether "the FBI should be able to access and keep information about gun purchases by terror suspects in cases similar to [the accused Ft. Hood killer's]?" Worse, Word Doctors misinformed poll participants by telling them that the accused killer was still under investigation at the time he purchased the gun.

    The poll also asked if participants agreed that "The federal government should not restrict the police's ability to access, use, and share data that helps them enforce federal, state and local gun laws," when in fact the Tiahrt Amendment fully allows access to trace information, as long as it's related to crimes that they're actually investigating.

    And the poll also claimed that a majority of gun owners want to "balance" their rights against the need to stop criminals from getting guns. But what it actually asked was whether gun owners agreed that "We can do more to stop criminals from getting guns while also protecting the rights of citizens to freely own them." Coupled with the poll's findings that an overwhelming majority of gun owners believe "Criminals . . . should be punished to the maximum extent of the law" and "Law-abiding Americans should have the freedom to choose how to protect themselves, based on their personal situation," it's fair to conclude that gun owners understand the two concepts aren't mutually exclusive. Since the ideas are compatible, they don't require a "balance," as suggested by gun control supporters.

    Notably, Lautenberg mentioned none of the poll's findings that undercut the anti-gun agenda, and Dionne mentioned few. These include findings that an overwhelming majority of gun owners:

    * Thinks President Obama will try to ban guns;
    * Agrees that the Supreme Court's decision in last year's Heller case was correct;
    * Agrees that the Second Amendment should prevent all levels of government from infringing the right to arms;
    * Agrees that people should be allowed to carry guns for protection in national parks;
    * Agrees that people should be allowed to transport firearms in baggage on Amtrak trains;
    * Agrees that gun laws should be less strict or left as they are; and
    * Opposes or is neutral about gun registration and an "assault weapon" ban.

    One final note: Since Word Doctors had no access to NRA membership lists, there's no way the pollsters could verify that any of the "NRA members" actually were NRA members. While this is a fatal flaw, we mention it at the end only because the poll's other flaws were even worse.
    The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the Constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first. - Thomas Jefferson

  6. #35
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    South Carolina USA
    Posts
    1,450
    I a lot of us are probably on some kind of list. If you are a Christian conservative who clings to God and guns you ARE on this administrations "watch" list.

    I would have to say: Depends?
    Who Decides?
    What are the prerequsites used to place someone on a "Watch" list?
    Are they a "Law Abiding" American citizen?

    IMO; Law abiding "American" Citizens should have the right to "Bear Arms" PERIOD!!

  7. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by tcox4freedom View Post
    I a lot of us are probably on some kind of list. If you are a Christian conservative who clings to God and guns you ARE on this administrations "watch" list.

    I would have to say: Depends?
    Who Decides?
    What are the prerequsites used to place someone on a "Watch" list?
    Are they a "Law Abiding" American citizen?

    IMO; Law abiding "American" Citizens should have the right to "Bear Arms" PERIOD!!
    I'm a veteran and i believe in God, guns and guts. Noone is going to take any of the 3 without a fight!

    WATCH me all you want, just don't try to pet!

Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst ... 234

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Quantcast