"Accident" or "Gross Negligence"?????
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Thread: "Accident" or "Gross Negligence"?????

  1. #1
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    Thumbs down "Accident" or "Gross Negligence"?????

    N.J. Officer Accidently Shoots, Kills Self: Top News Stories at Officer.com

    N.J. Officer Accidently Shoots, Kills Self
    Gun discharged while he installed rubber sleeve on the grip


    Posted: Friday, February 19, 2010
    Updated: February 19th, 2010 10:48 AM EDT


    Atlantic City Police Department

    Officer Kevin B. Wilkins
    Officer.com News

    An Atlantic City officer died of an accidental gunshot from his service weapon while on duty yesterday morning, according to The Press of Atlantic City.

    Officer Kevin B. Wilkins was sitting in his cruiser at approximately 1:30 a.m. outside the Stanley Holmes Village apartment complex on Kentucky and Baltic avenues when the incident occurred.

    The 31-year-old removed the clip of extra bullets in his semi-automatic pistol's handle to install a rubber sleeve on the grip, but accidentally discharged the remaining bullet in the chamber.

    The bullet stuck him in the face, police told the newspaper.

    Nearby officers summoned medical help, but Wilkins was pronounced dead 15 minutes later.

    He is the first Atlantic City officer killed in the line of duty in five years.

    "He was a city resident who knew and was able to interact favorably with the community, and it's a great loss," Chief John Mooney told the newspaper.

    Funeral arrangements are pending.
    There are several things wrong with this story. First question that comes to mind is why was this officer attempting to install a rubber sleeve onto his duty gun in the field? Wouldn't it be more appropriate to be doing this in a "secure" location such as the department arms room, his home, or maybe some other location where he would be somewhat "safe". What if there was an incident while he was in the process of doing this modification and needed the immediate use of his firearm? Not good!

    Second is in the reporting. Does the Atlantic City Police Department issue officers M1 Garand pistols? I can't think of any semi-auto pistol that uses a "clip". If there was a "bullet" in the chamber of the gun, then it should be taken in to have the obstruction cleared. I have never heard of a "bullet" firing.

    Third is what was the officer doing pointing the muzzle of the gun at his face? What part of "Keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction" did he not understand?

    This is a graphic reminder of why it's critical that people handling firearms not be careless, and follow safe firearms handling procedures AT ALL TIMES!

    Something doesn't smell right about this incident. There are a lot of unanswered questions, and I'm sure that there's more to this story than whats' being reported.



    gf
    "A few well placed shots with a .22LR is a lot better than a bunch of solid misses with a .44 mag!" Glock Armorer, NRA Chief RSO, Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, Muzzleloading Rifle, Muzzleloading Shotgun, and Home Firearm Safety Training Counselor

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  3. #2
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    "Wilkins’ class received seven days of firearms training with Glock .40-caliber pistols “to the best of my recollection,” Saduk said. Atlantic City police currently carry that model."
    The pistol worked as designed. The officer failed to clear his weapon, and payed a terrible price. Condolences to his family. This should serve as a reminder to all of us. All firearms should be considered as loaded, until triple checked before servicing.
    The media never gets these things right.

  4. #3
    The biggest problem I saw was that they reported that he was "killed in the line of duty" which I suppose is technically correct, but diminishes what that means for an officer killed while actually engaged in protecting the public.

    The clip vs. magazine thing is no big deal. No reporter is going to get it right and we all know what he's talking about anyway.

  5. #4
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    Four safety rules to live by:
    1. All guns are loaded
    2. Never point a gun at a target you are not willing to destroy
    3. Never put your finger on the trigger until your ready to destroy the target
    4. Know what is beyond your target
    "You can get a lot accomplished if you don't care who gets the credit" - Ronald Reagan

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by fuhr52 View Post
    Four safety rules to live by:
    1. All guns are loaded
    2. Never point a gun at a target you are not willing to destroy
    3. Never put your finger on the trigger until your ready to destroy the target
    4. Know what is beyond your target
    Sadly, you’ve hit the nail square on the head; people don’t know the actual rules. Rule One is actually, “All guns are to be considered loaded until you have confirmed that they are not”.

    Somewhere along the way, the rule was dumbed down so that dumb people could remember it. As you can imagine, letting dumb people have guns increases the likelihood of an accident.

    If, as you wrote, ”all guns are always loaded” you would never clean it. After all, what sane person would clean a loaded gun?

    If, as you wrote, ”all guns are always loaded” you would never dry-fire it. After all, what sane person would ever dry-fire a loaded gun?

    The problem is that people make these sorts of sweeping claims truly believing that it’s making them safer, when in reality it makes them more dangerous. If you say you believe that all guns are always loaded and then you (or someone sees you) dry-fire it or clean it etc., you are proving yourself a liar. It’s not semantics; the simple fact is that rules that are so critical as the Four Rules for Handling Firearms are, they absolutely must be inviolate. PERIOD. If it’s a rule, you either follow it completely all the time are you are lying.

    Once I have confirmed that all the cartridges are removed from my gun, it’s unloaded. I can then safely clean it or dry-fire it or whatever. That does not, however, mean that I can ignore the other three rules by any means. The rules overlap and provide a redundant system to ensure your and other’s safety. But if you’re going to pretend that ‘all guns are always loaded’ when you know darn well you don’t always (100%) treat all guns as though they are always loaded, you are setting yourself up for a potentially tragic catastrophe. The rule is too important to dumb it down for convenience.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by fuhr52 View Post
    Four safety rules to live by:
    1. All guns are loaded
    2. Never point a gun at a target you are not willing to destroy
    3. Never put your finger on the trigger until your ready to destroy the target
    4. Know what is beyond your target
    Can't say anymore than that. Darwin wins.
    "When a government robs Peter to pay Paul it will alway's have the support of Paul" George Bernard Shaw

  8. No such thing

    There is no such thing as an "accidental discharge". Guns don't just fire all by themselves. Example: I have several cases of 45 ACP stored for a "rainy day" and in the years they have been sitting there, not one of the 2000 or so rounds has ever fired itself. This guy was killed because he failed to follow simple rules of gun use/ownership. When you don't follow the rules, it is negligence, not accidental.

    The only possible case of accidental discharge I can think of would be a black powder chain fire, and even that is preventable if you follow practice instead of taking the short cut.

  9. #8
    The incorrect terminology by the press always reinforces the fact that they have no idea what they are talking about when it comes to firearms.

    The officer removed the magazine but I guess he either forgot to rack the slide to clear the chamber or got lazy and did not take the time to do it. A very tragic incident that should never have happened.
    By faith Noah,being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear,prepared an ark to the saving of his house;by the which he condemned the world,and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith Heb.11:7

  10. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mainsail View Post
    Sadly, you’ve hit the nail square on the head; people don’t know the actual rules. Rule One is actually, “All guns are to be considered loaded until you have confirmed that they are not”.

    Somewhere along the way, the rule was dumbed down so that dumb people could remember it. As you can imagine, letting dumb people have guns increases the likelihood of an accident.

    If, as you wrote, ”all guns are always loaded” you would never clean it. After all, what sane person would clean a loaded gun?

    If, as you wrote, ”all guns are always loaded” you would never dry-fire it. After all, what sane person would ever dry-fire a loaded gun?

    The problem is that people make these sorts of sweeping claims truly believing that it’s making them safer, when in reality it makes them more dangerous. If you say you believe that all guns are always loaded and then you (or someone sees you) dry-fire it or clean it etc., you are proving yourself a liar. It’s not semantics; the simple fact is that rules that are so critical as the Four Rules for Handling Firearms are, they absolutely must be inviolate. PERIOD. If it’s a rule, you either follow it completely all the time are you are lying.

    Once I have confirmed that all the cartridges are removed from my gun, it’s unloaded. I can then safely clean it or dry-fire it or whatever. That does not, however, mean that I can ignore the other three rules by any means. The rules overlap and provide a redundant system to ensure your and other’s safety. But if you’re going to pretend that ‘all guns are always loaded’ when you know darn well you don’t always (100%) treat all guns as though they are always loaded, you are setting yourself up for a potentially tragic catastrophe. The rule is too important to dumb it down for convenience.
    The four rules I stated where instilled in me at a young age by my father. They are ment as a guide line to prevent unfotunate mishaps. They are not ment to be take literally. Obviously I would expect an individule to have enough sence to double and triple check to make sure a gun is unloaded before cleaning or dry fireing. That's the trouble with todays sociaty, they seem to be a little short on comon scence.These rules are ment as a guide. If you pick up a gun concider it loaded. Don't point it at something your not willing to destroy. Keep your finger off the triger untill your ready to fire. Know were the bullet is going.
    "You can get a lot accomplished if you don't care who gets the credit" - Ronald Reagan

  11. The Glock .40...everybody heard of a Glock .40" Fifty cent Too short" all talk about a Glock .40 This was an ATF agent that said he was the only one in this room professional enough to use a Glock .40 and shot himself in the leg like Plaxico Burris.At least in the academy they show you to always remove the mag first rack the slide 3 times and inspect the chamber.If these rules are followed no accidental discharge is going to happen.If this was a new Glock model why put a rubber sleeve they won't work.The original non rail Glock's fit the rubber grips.Skate board tape works.

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