CCW Rules You Can Live By. - Page 2
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Thread: CCW Rules You Can Live By.

  1. #11
    Join Date
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    OHIO
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    I want to preface this with a statement:

    I personally have NOTHING against Police Officers that follow the law. They have a very tough job and I believe are underpaid and under appreciated for it. For example, I expect to be pulled over if I am speeding, and I would deserve any ticket or fine I receive.


    I have no problems with them making honest mistakes, we all make mistakes. Not being held responsible for those mistakes is something I do have something against. There are many, many examples of Police officers getting away with myriads of crimes (mistakes?) that joe citizen would have been castrated for.

    Just google "the only ones files" for an example.

    Here is proof to back up what I said in an earlier post on this thread:


    Citizens may resist unlawful arrest to the point of taking an arresting officer's life if necessary." Plummer v. State, 136 Ind. 306. This premise was upheld by the Supreme Court of the United States in the case: John Bad Elk v. U.S., 177 U.S. 529.



    Texas Penal code

    Section 9.31. Self-Defense

    9.31. SELF-DEFENSE. (a) Except as provided in
    Subsection (b), a person is justified in using force against
    another when and to the degree he reasonably believes the force is
    immediately necessary to protect himself against the other's use or
    attempted use of unlawful force.
    (b) The use of force against another is not justified:
    (1) in response to verbal provocation alone;
    (2) to resist an arrest or search that the actor knows
    is being made by a peace officer, or by a person acting in a peace
    officer's presence and at his direction, even though the arrest or
    search is unlawful, unless the resistance is justified under
    Subsection (c);

    (c) The use of force to resist an arrest or search is
    justified:
    (1) if, before the actor offers any resistance, the
    peace officer (or person acting at his direction) uses or attempts
    to use greater force than necessary to make the arrest or search;
    and
    (2) when and to the degree the actor reasonably
    believes the force is immediately necessary to protect himself
    against the peace officer's (or other person's) use or attempted use
    of greater force than necessary.
    9.32. DEADLY FORCE IN DEFENSE OF PERSON. (a) A person
    is justified in using deadly force against another:
    (1) if he would be justified in using force against the
    other under Section 9.31;
    see "c" above
    (2) if a reasonable person in the actor's situation
    would not have retreated; and
    (3) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the
    deadly force is immediately necessary:
    (A) to protect himself against the other's use or
    attempted use of unlawful deadly force; or
    (B) to prevent the other's imminent commission of
    aggravated kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual
    assault, robbery, or aggravated robbery.
    (b) The requirement imposed by Subsection (a)(2) does not
    apply to an actor who uses force against a person who is at the time
    of the use of force committing an offense of unlawful entry in the
    habitation of the actor.

  2.   
  3. All good advice. thank you. Remember that you don't know whats going on with that patrol unit, Is he on a apb for a car just like yours.
    Last edited by StanCollins; 01-04-2010 at 10:11 PM. Reason: bad grammer

  4. #13
    Thanks for the comments Scott.

    I have been held at gun point a time or two and it is no fun looking down the business end of a gun or two with a rookie cop with an itchy trigger finger.

    If I carry I accept that LEOs may not believe I am a fine upstanding citizen upon immediate contact. I accept that I may create fear in the LEO because I carry and they do not know my intent or my history (or lack of it). I also accept that the LEO may feel the need to disarm me until they understand why I have a firearm on my person. I don't think these are unreasonable actions in todays world.

    We had a female LEO shot and killed recently so I expect other LEOs in the state to be a bit jumpy. I have no intention to make them afraid of me or to misunderstand my intent with my firearm. I will do what ever is required to protect myself from being accidentally misunderstood by my actions or lack of them.

    Resisting direct orders by a LEO is an invitation for disaster. There is nothing to be gained by doing so except for a long and difficult encounter...or maybe a very short and deadly one. Why risk it? Put yourself in their place...approaching an unknown person and suddenly finding out they are armed. That is why I would do everything I could to make sure the LEO does not see me as a threat. Compliance to their orders is easy and very well may keep you alive.

    I won't comment on the comments dealing with resisting a LEO. If you resist you can expect the full wrath (with backup) of the LEO. Not my cup of tea.

  5. #14
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    There are a few situations where the only choice for a free man/woman is to NOT obey unlawful orders from police. If you do not have those instances already figured out/decided upon before they happen..... May your chains rest lightly............

    The courts have proven that they are biased on some types of quote "laws/regulations" and you cannot get a fair trial. There are some "Federal" agencies who have, and still do falsify evidence and lie in court. Why would you want to go along with the unlawful/false arrest if you have no other chance of justice?

    This is something we all need to decide for ourselves, where our own certain line in the sand is...... I myself will die a free man, if I am FORCED to defend myself. (yes, that is the correct word, they have the choice to obey the constitution instead of infringing on MY Constitutional Rights, THEY would be breaking their oaths and the Supreme Law of this land, not me)

    If enough of us so-called 2nd Amendment supporters would actually give our lives, or at last be willing to without a doubt, then the 2nd Amendment would actually be a deterrent to those in power, instead of a little nuisance/irritant. Is that not the main reason it was included in the Bill of Rights?

    Talk/posts of "you should alway's do what the nice officer say's" is only re-enforcing their false/illegal power and weakening ours, they are taking away our freedoms, and you that talk that way are helping them.

    Now, before you start flaming me........ I am NOT saying that you should shoot a cop over a speeding ticket, or refuse to give him your name, or be an idiot about small matters/situations. What I AM saying is that we each need to think about just what we will and will not allow to be done to us. We need to have the training (and resolve) to defend ourselves if/when we need to, regardless if the person we are defending ourselves from has a uniform or badge...........

  6. #15

    Common Sense rules

    I live in Ohio 6 months of the year. We have open and concealed carry. I carry all the time. I am very pro Second Amendment. In fact I am an NRA pistol instructor and teach the Ohio CHL calss

    In the summer I work out in Yellowstone NP and I hike all over the place. I carry when I hike outside the park. This year, because of the law changes, I will be carrying inside the park.

    I carry and no one knows it. I pack a full sized 1911 and no one knows it. NO ONE KNOWS IT! NO ONE KNOWS IT!

    I'm sorry, but, if you are carrying an exposed AK47 lookalike when you are hiking, you are just trying to force a confrontation. You set out to be confrontational and you got what you wanted. You wanted to be the center of attention and shock people. Actions like this hurt us more than the Brady Anti Gun Freaks do. It makes us all look like lunatics. Every time this happens people start donating to the Brady Bunch and I have to write more checks to the NRA to counter it. I always use examples like this to convince my students to not act like this. Please stop it.

  7. #16
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldphart View Post
    I live in Ohio 6 months of the year. We have open and concealed carry. I carry all the time. I am very pro Second Amendment. In fact I am an NRA pistol instructor and teach the Ohio CHL calss

    In the summer I work out in Yellowstone NP and I hike all over the place. I carry when I hike outside the park. This year, because of the law changes, I will be carrying inside the park.

    I carry and no one knows it. I pack a full sized 1911 and no one knows it. NO ONE KNOWS IT! NO ONE KNOWS IT!

    I'm sorry, but, if you are carrying an exposed AK47 lookalike when you are hiking, you are just trying to force a confrontation. You set out to be confrontational and you got what you wanted. You wanted to be the center of attention and shock people. Actions like this hurt us more than the Brady Anti Gun Freaks do. It makes us all look like lunatics. Every time this happens people start donating to the Brady Bunch and I have to write more checks to the NRA to counter it. I always use examples like this to convince my students to not act like this. Please stop it.
    You may want to rethink what you wrote here.... you are NOT TALKING TO THE CORRECT PERSON, and this is not the correct thread /subject......

  8. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Axeanda45 View Post
    You may want to rethink what you wrote here.... you are NOT TALKING TO THE CORRECT PERSON, and this is not the correct thread /subject......
    Ooops, Sorry. Old people sometimes get confused. I did indeed post this in the wrong thread. I humbly apologize and meant no offense.

  9. #18
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    fine...I forgive you it's not like, uhmmmm, maybe, just maybe I may have kinda made a few THOUSAND of those "mistake thingies" myself.

  10. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Lowcountry, SC
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    Thanks, Officer, for the reminders.

    I'm constantly suprised by some people's disdain for the police in the US. Maybe I have been lucky where I live; our police are polite and generally very professional. I have been arrested overseas (our hotel caught on fire, and "gentle" Carabinieri hauled all the young, male Americans in our group to jail for ARSON!). THAT was a wakeup call. Foreign police can and will do things that would never pass here in the States, at least not where I live.

    I do support and stand up for my basic rights against false arrest and interregation, but in most cases there is "no harm/no foul" for just answering "Yes, Officer" or "No, Officer" instead of defiantly answering every question with "How can I help you, Officer" like they show in those crazy YouTube videos.

    BTW, I carry 24-7 and I kept my hands on the wheel last time I was caught speeding.

  11. #20
    Ughh you should try being arrested in Honduras! No, you should not, actually.

    I find that carrying makes me a better driver.

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