Martial Law in Boston Justified? Yay or Nay? - Page 13

View Poll Results: Was Martial Law Justifed In Boston?

Voters
101. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes...It was for the good of the people.

    4 3.96%
  • No...It was a violation of the people's rights.

    94 93.07%
  • Undecided...My brain hurts.

    2 1.98%
  • What does 'Martial Law' mean???

    1 0.99%
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Thread: Martial Law in Boston Justified? Yay or Nay?

  1. #121
    Kwimby, if you don't want to be called a troll, you shouldn't sound like one.
    It makes no difference what has happened. It isn't right for anyone to disregard another's rights... for any reason. Read the constitution! We are not a democracy. We are a Constitutional Republic. The constitution is our rule of law. You can't disregard one iota of it for yours or anyone else's pleasure. Period.
    And we aren't anti-government gun-nut extremists that believe that way. We are patriots. And we know what you are. You need to get your head screwed on straight. Your comments prove your ignorance.
    JMHO, of course.
    Stop, Drop, and Roll won't work in Hell.
    The truth about the former Republic of the United States of America:
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  3. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by dad45acp View Post
    But tell this to those who were killed, that 8 yr old's family...the MIT cop and his family. This wasn't just a "19yr old kid" as many of you like to water down.
    it certainly is a terrible thing that happened to those innocent people but I really couldn't care about this kind of emotional nonsense.
    you can never violate the basic god given rights granted to all in the USA for ANY reason whatsoever.

  4. #123
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    I agree that it was a tragedy for those who had relatives and friends that were injured or killed. However, tragedy is not qualify as justification for imposing martial law on the citizens of the United States.

    Those two brothers did not commit an act of war. First, war is much, much larger than what happened in Boston. Second, war is conflict between political communities.

    Martial law is a last resort type of action. Boston used martial law tactics to usurp the constitutional rights of law abiding citizens, and they did so in complete absence of any criteria normally associated with martial law.

    This is very, very scary.

    Wikipedia definition of war:

    War is an organized and often prolonged conflict that is carried out by states and/or non-state actors. It is characterized by extreme violence, social disruption, and economic destruction. War should be understood as an actual, intentional and widespread armed conflict between political communities, and therefore is defined as a form of political violence or intervention.

    Wikipedia definition of martial law:

    Martial law is the imposition of military rule by military authorities over designated regions on an emergency basis.

    Martial law is usually imposed on a temporary basis when the civilian government or civilian authorities fail to function effectively (e.g., maintain order and security, or provide essential services), when there are extensive riots and protests, or when the disobedience of the law becomes widespread.

    In most of the cases, military forces are deployed to subdue the crowds, to secure government buildings and key or sensitive locations, and to maintain order.[1] Generally, military personnel replace civil authorities and perform some or all of their functions. In full-scale martial law, the highest-ranking military officer would take over, or be installed, as the military governor or as head of the government, thus removing all power from the previous executive, legislative, and judicial branches of government.[1]

    Martial law can be used by governments to enforce their rule over the public. Such incidents may occur after a coup d'état (such as Thailand in 2006); when threatened by popular protest (China, Tiananmen Square protests of 1989); to suppress political opposition (Poland in 1981); to stabilize insurrections or perceived insurrections (Canada, The October Crisis of 1970). Martial law may be declared in cases of major natural disasters, however most countries use a different legal construct, such as a state of emergency.

    Martial law has also been imposed during conflicts and in cases of occupations, where the absence of any other civil government provides for an unstable population. Examples of this form of military rule include post World War II reconstruction in Germany and Japan as well as the southern reconstruction following the U.S. Civil War.

    Typically, the imposition of martial law accompanies curfews, the suspension of civil law, civil rights, habeas corpus, and the application or extension of military law or military justice to civilians. Civilians defying martial law may be subjected to military tribunal (court-martial).

  5. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwimby View Post
    Maybe the OP created the poll so he could indirectly get an answer to the burning option #4 question in his mind:

    "What does 'Martial Law' mean???"

    Naw, most likely just bloviations of an anti-government gun-nut extremist.
    What does Martial Law mean to you? A temporary suspension of civil rights for the public good of all?

    I have been trained by the FEDS on what to do under their version of martial law and trust me you would not like it.
    Which also brings up a valid point.
    I am willing to bet that the decision to: Cordon of this section of town and search every house. was made my a Fed rather than a Police Major or Colonel.
    Local Cops are cops Federal Cops are not cops especially the ones in charge.
    Tolerance of the intolerant leads to the destruction of tolerance. “You are also reminded that any inappropriate remarks or jokes concerning security may result in your arrest,” in the land of the free.

  6. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by golocx4 View Post
    What does Martial Law mean to you? A temporary suspension of civil rights for the public good of all?

    I have been trained by the FEDS on what to do under their version of martial law and trust me you would not like it.
    Which also brings up a valid point.
    I am willing to bet that the decision to: Cordon of this section of town and search every house. was made my a Fed rather than a Police Major or Colonel.
    Local Cops are cops Federal Cops are not cops especially the ones in charge.
    Please elaborate on "I have been trained by the FEDS on what to do under their version of martial law and trust me you would not like it."

  7. #126
    I don't see where what was done was actually marshall law being imposed as much as a police action to try and keep citizens safe and make their job easier by not having citizens on the street for their suspect to blend into and escape.
    That being said, I will not condone the actions taken by LEA against the citizens of Watertown and the surrounding communities. As to this being a prelude to bigger and worse things we can only speculate to there happening (I just bought a brand new roll of extra heavy duty foil).
    I'd rather be a Conservative Nutjob. Than a Liberal with NO Nuts & NO Job

  8. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by dad45acp View Post
    But tell this to those who were killed, that 8 yr old's family...the MIT cop and his family. This wasn't just a "19yr old kid" as many of you like to water down. He had and still has no remorse or fear....nothing to lose essentially and committed an act of war in a major US city. Ever since Columbine these situations require an offensive police action to either capture or kill. Understand the dynamics and psyche of these individuals before you make crass comments as above. And for those of you that thought this was an exaggerated police response with armored vehicles and weapons. Well, if there is an expectation that civilian LE is to respond to bombings, mass killings and shoot out with terrorists, this is the response you will get every time. The police getting "militarized" is a response to the increasingly dangerous world we are encountering and the weaponry being used, not to diminish constitutional rights of the citizens or create conspiracies suggesting the government is creating a 'commie' or 'gestapo' state. You can choose to read the erroneous internet conspiracies and jump to conclusions by looking and watching these Boston searches without knowing the facts but at the end of the day, you will still have to rely on LE to complete this mission to YOUR benefit and thousands if not millions of others when these tragic events happen on our soil and kill our people.
    I will never rely on cops for anything that I am not compelled by law to, like if someone breaks in my house and I have to take a life to defend myself and my wife, I will dutifully call them, give them the facts, and then shut the hell up until they either decide they've got no legal reason to arrest me and leave, or they do just that, arrest me. Either way, I don't talk to 'em if I don't have to, and unlike Bikenut, I have never had a cop come to my aid, nor do I want them to.

    These days they cannot do their jobs without violating constitutional rights. That's just a plain fact. Probable cause is a thing of the past, from traffic stops for license plate lights that are burned out (when they're not) to TN cops targeting Hispanic drivers on the Interstate that news choppers catch pulling them over for supposedly not staying in their lane when the footage shows clearly it was just made up, to getting tased for videotaping, or even just saying "I refuse to answer your questions until I see my attorney," Good Lord, the unconstitutional abuses that happen daily and with impunity are endless. Boston is just one of the more blatant and extreme examples.

    The Dorner debacle was just as bad, even worse really, because the thugs were caught saying on their radios that they intentionally set the fire that killed Dorner. At the same time the fire was blazing just outside of Big Bear City on Hwy 38, and they knew without a doubt that Dorner was inside, at least 30 miles away on Hwy 330 coming into San Bernadino every single vehicle was still being searched with a 4 mile trail of cars waiting to get down the mountain and past the Nazi check-point at rush hour. Oh yeah, and don't forget LAPD cops opened fire on two women who were Hispanic and driving a blue Toyota pickup instead of the gray Nissan the large black man, Dorner, was said to be driving.

    But citizens have no reason to fear cops, right? "Exigent circumstances" such as a four-county dragnet being conducted even as Dorner was being burned to death is supposed to be enough reason for us to baa-baa like the sheep cops demand we be. Screw that, and screw every single cop who ever got in someone's face just to "show them who's in control of this situation."

    Anyone who defends what happened in Watertown and its surrounding environs, and talks as cavalierly about the violation of our rights as the above poster does, is of the exact same police-state mind as Obama and his minions at the top, all the way down to the freshly-graduated recruit whose first assignment was to force people out of their homes with his jack-booted thug gang enthusiastically encouraging him, nay, training him for future operations. It's sickening to see how little people know about the liberty our Framers thought they were ensuring for us for perpetuity. They must have spun in their graves and drilled all the way to China by now.

    Blues
    No one has ever heard me say that I "hate" cops, because I don't. This is why I will never trust one again though: You just never know...

  9. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by dogshawred View Post
    I don't see where what was done was actually marshall law being imposed as much as a police action to try and keep citizens safe and make their job easier by not having citizens on the street for their suspect to blend into and escape.
    That being said, I will not condone the actions taken by LEA against the citizens of Watertown and the surrounding communities. As to this being a prelude to bigger and worse things we can only speculate to there happening (I just bought a brand new roll of extra heavy duty foil).
    Don't fall into the trap of looking at Watertown as just another isolated incident. How many isolated incidents does it take to become a pattern? Oh my God...I can't see the forest for all the damned trees!

  10. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by dad45acp View Post
    But tell this to those who were killed, that 8 yr old's family...the MIT cop and his family. This wasn't just a "19yr old kid" as many of you like to water down. He had and still has no remorse or fear....nothing to lose essentially and committed an act of war in a major US city. Ever since Columbine these situations require an offensive police action to either capture or kill. Understand the dynamics and psyche of these individuals before you make crass comments as above. And for those of you that thought this was an exaggerated police response with armored vehicles and weapons. Well, if there is an expectation that civilian LE is to respond to bombings, mass killings and shoot out with terrorists, this is the response you will get every time. The police getting "militarized" is a response to the increasingly dangerous world we are encountering and the weaponry being used, not to diminish constitutional rights of the citizens or create conspiracies suggesting the government is creating a 'commie' or 'gestapo' state. You can choose to read the erroneous internet conspiracies and jump to conclusions by looking and watching these Boston searches without knowing the facts but at the end of the day, you will still have to rely on LE to complete this mission to YOUR benefit and thousands if not millions of others when these tragic events happen on our soil and kill our people.
    You totally miss the point. How old the bomber was is irrelevant. You confuse my position on the 4th Amendment for sympathy for the bomber, which it is not. I'd be the first to volunteer to strap 10 pounds of c4 to that "kid's" ass and detonate it, once he's had his right to due process as an American.

    The cops forced homeowners out of their homes at gunpoint in violation of the 4th Amendment . That is wrong.

    If rights are only applicable in certain situations, then they aren't rights. You can't pick and choose.

    And I notice that you didn't answer the question I posed, "What if it was you and your family at gunpoint?" Was that the crass part?





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    Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.

  11. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by carracer View Post
    Please elaborate on "I have been trained by the FEDS on what to do under their version of martial law and trust me you would not like it."
    I'd like to hear that too.
    Posterity: you will never know how much it has cost my generation to preserve your freedom. I hope you will make good use of it.--- John Quincy Adams
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