"Weapons" vs "non-Weapons" ? ? ?
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Thread: "Weapons" vs "non-Weapons" ? ? ?

  1. Question "Weapons" vs "non-Weapons" ? ? ?

    I like something rcd2co said in the pen thread: "Look for something that won't be illegalized."

    Along these lines, I thought I might start a general discussion of what may or may not be classified as a weapon in the legal sense. Also, I'm interested it what may or may not attract attention or be considered a weapon.

    As we were putting together my wife's BOB, I reached for a 12" "Barong" machete, which is a versatile tool, while she reached for her Cold Steel OSS, which is definitely a weapon. I got to thinking about this.

    She likes her ASP telescoping baton (ex-cop, liked 'em in the past). But the ASP and various other non-lethal devices can cause more legal trouble than the guns we both wear legally.

    What about a small shovel in the car? Yes, I have one or two of the Cold Steel E-tools, and I have sharpened and repainted the edges.

    What about a hatchet? Normal item in a backwoods pack or survival kit. Axe, hatchet machete are all very common items near our rural home, but I'm not sure how they are viewed in the city where my wife works.

    Heck, we normally have at least one each, full sized axe and shovel in our vehicles in winter. Should be a chainsaw, too, at least for me on my commute.

    A Maglite is not a weapon, but it can be a heck of a bludgeon.

    I have a stainless skull-headed Cold Steel City Stick, but my youngest kid beat the crap out of it on a rock, and I'm have a very difficult time finding a plain stainless-headed City Stick to replace it. Seems Cold Steel is now selling a far less effective and poorly balanced aluminum-headed model. I've had to return two now, because vendors did not change their descriptions of the product. In general, I do not think canes are viewed as weapons, though a fighting cane from Canemasters might attract attention if recognized.

    Tactical pens and flashlights with "strike bezels" are becoming too well known. I have a hunch they'll attract unwelcome attention in some circles.

    Discussion on the legality of brass knuckles can go on forever, but regardless of whether it's a "paperweight" or a "belt buckle," the perception will be that it's a weapon.

    So.... do ya think that hatchet or small machete is a non-weapon if it's in a survival or hunting pack? What about the entrenching tool?
    “The police of a State should never be stronger or better armed than the citizenry. An armed citizenry, willing to fight is the foundation of civil freedom.” Heinlein

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  3. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Hamilton Felix View Post
    Should be a chainsaw, too, at least for me on my commute.
    I knew a Marine who went to great lengths to obtain a chainsaw to take with him to Afghanistan. He wanted one that could run off of either gasoline or diesel oil, including ethynol and methynol suplimented fuels. I am not sure what a Marine does in Afghanistan with a chainsaw, but some questions you realy don't want the answer to.

  4. #3
    Anything can be considered a weapon depending on how it is used, how ambitious the cop or D.A. is, and your local laws. Yes even your Maglite. A mere screwdriver can be considered a burglary tool, and as well as a weapon. But all that is moot when the SHTF. You need to pack survival gear in your Go Bag. Just remember some State Governors choose to disarm citizens during state of emergencies e.g. Katrina.
    Beware the Fury of a patient man.

  5. I agree with you, roguejesse. And I have a hunch it would be a challenge to disarm my beloved Kathleen. But I'm mostly thinking about the non-lethal and potentially lethal "tools" we may pack around in our cars (granted we're both smart enough NEVER to consent to a search) our on our persons. I'm thinking in terms of maintaining low profile and not attracting trouble during normal times. I think once the balloon goes up, we're not losing sleep over the appearance of being armed.

    Still wondering about that Marine with the chainsaw..... ;-)
    “The police of a State should never be stronger or better armed than the citizenry. An armed citizenry, willing to fight is the foundation of civil freedom.” Heinlein

  6. #5
    The point of this thread is about legality vs. illegality. Since anything CAN be a weapon, in trained hands, what's a good choice? I choose to carry a regular wooden hook-handled cane (in addition to my licensed CCW firearm). That's because there are times when using deadly force would get ME jailed instead of the bad guy, and using a firearm is ALWAYS use of deadly force. I want more choices than just between shooting or stepping aside, because there can be situations where I feel the need to step to someone's defense but the situation hasn't yet escalated to using deadly force. Better to keep it below that level if possible, so everyone goes home in one piece. Anyone who thinks otherwise has either never been in serious combat, or else is a serious danger to himself and others. Also, with some training, a cane can be a good substitute for an ASP baton or escrima stick, and I can carry my cane ANYWHERE, with never a question - and if anyone ever questions me (they haven't yet), a mention of the penalties available under the Americans with Disabilities Act should serve to back them off! Certainly no LEO will ever wonder about me, a 63 yr. old graybeard, carrying a cane - though he might wonder what that .45-sized bulge is, on my hip, under my coat!

  7. #6
    A combat tomahawk is an excellent weapon, in trained hands. So is a Barong, bowie knife, or short machete. But don't think for a moment that any LEO is going to let them slide for carry, just because they're not firearms. And if they are in a "survival or hunting pack", then they're not readily accessibe when you might need them, so why bother?

  8. #7
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    I (gently) tie my voracious min-pin on a 6-foot pole and nobody will get within arms reach!!
    1)"When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty." -Thomas Jefferson.
    2)"Imagine how gun control might be stomped if GOA or SAF had the (compromising) NRA's 4 million members!" -Me. http://jpfo.org/filegen-n-z/nraletter.htm

  9. #8
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    In the right circumstances, anything can be a weapon. Looking around, I can see five things on my desk that could cause fatality or at least extreme discomfort to an attacker, and all of them can be purchased at Staples.

  10. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by localgirl View Post
    In the right circumstances, anything can be a weapon. Looking around, I can see five things on my desk that could cause fatality or at least extreme discomfort to an attacker, and all of them can be purchased at Staples.
    I think Office Max is more tactical!
    1)"When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty." -Thomas Jefferson.
    2)"Imagine how gun control might be stomped if GOA or SAF had the (compromising) NRA's 4 million members!" -Me. http://jpfo.org/filegen-n-z/nraletter.htm

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