Post offices and CFP laws
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Thread: Post offices and CFP laws

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Durham, ME, USA
    Posts
    6

    Post offices and CFP laws

    Question: is it prohibited to carry with a permit in any post office, or just ones that clearly post notices prohibiting firearms? Some post offices post and others don't, no pun intended.

  2.   
  3. Funny you mention this. I just did research on the topic today. It's prohibited at my P.O . And I saw the sign posted inside the post office, but not at the entrance.

  4. #3
    My understanding is yes it is illegal at all federal buildings. I am open to education

  5. #4
    http://frwebgate4.access.gpo.gov/cgi...ction=retrieve

    39 CFR 232.1 ?

    “Weapons and explosives . Notwithstanding the provisions of any other law, rule or regulation, no person while on postal property may carry firearms, other dangerous or deadly weapons, or explosives, either openly or concealed, or store the same on postal property, except for official purposes.”
    In the beginning, the patriot is a scarce man -- brave, hated, and scorned. But when his cause succeeds, the timid join him. For then, it costs nothing to be a patriot. -- Mark Twain

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by RugerP345 View Post

    39 CFR 232.1 ?

    “Weapons and explosives . Notwithstanding the provisions of any other law, rule or regulation, no person while on postal property may carry firearms, other dangerous or deadly weapons, or explosives, either openly or concealed, or store the same on postal property, except for official purposes.”
    Reading the rest of that...seems it's not illegal as much as it is against the rules

    (p) Penalties and other law. (1) Alleged
    violations of these rules and regulations
    are heard, and the penalties prescribed
    herein are imposed, either in a
    Federal district court or by a Federal
    magistrate in accordance with applicable
    court rules. Questions regarding
    such rules should be directed to the regional
    counsel for the region involved.
    (2) Whoever shall be found guilty of
    violating the rules and regulations in
    this section while on property under
    the charge and control of the Postal
    Service is subject to fine of not more
    than $50 or imprisonment of not more
    than 30 days, or both. Nothing contained
    in these rules and regulations
    shall be construed to abrogate any
    other Federal laws or regulations of
    any State and local laws and regulations
    applicable to any area in which
    the property is situated.

    However, I think this is the one that is posted in the Post office:

    18 USC 930

    § 930. Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facilities
    How Current is This?
    (a) Except as provided in subsection (d), whoever knowingly possesses or causes to be present a firearm or other dangerous weapon in a Federal facility (other than a Federal court facility), or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 1 year, or both.
    (b) Whoever, with intent that a firearm or other dangerous weapon be used in the commission of a crime, knowingly possesses or causes to be present such firearm or dangerous weapon in a Federal facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both.
    (c) A person who kills any person in the course of a violation of subsection (a) or (b), or in the course of an attack on a Federal facility involving the use of a firearm or other dangerous weapon, or attempts or conspires to do such an act, shall be punished as provided in sections 1111, 1112, 1113, and 1117.
    (d) Subsection (a) shall not apply to—
    (1) the lawful performance of official duties by an officer, agent, or employee of the United States, a State, or a political subdivision thereof, who is authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or prosecution of any violation of law;
    (2) the possession of a firearm or other dangerous weapon by a Federal official or a member of the Armed Forces if such possession is authorized by law; or
    (3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes.
    (e)
    (1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), whoever knowingly possesses or causes to be present a firearm or other dangerous weapon in a Federal court facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title, imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.
    (2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to conduct which is described in paragraph (1) or (2) of subsection (d).
    (f) Nothing in this section limits the power of a court of the United States to punish for contempt or to promulgate rules or orders regulating, restricting, or prohibiting the possession of weapons within any building housing such court or any of its proceedings, or upon any grounds appurtenant to such building.
    (g) As used in this section:
    (1) The term “Federal facility” means a building or part thereof owned or leased by the Federal Government, where Federal employees are regularly present for the purpose of performing their official duties.
    (2) The term “dangerous weapon” means a weapon, device, instrument, material, or substance, animate or inanimate, that is used for, or is readily capable of, causing death or serious bodily injury, except that such term does not include a pocket knife with a blade of less than 21/2 inches in length.
    (3) The term “Federal court facility” means the courtroom, judges’ chambers, witness rooms, jury deliberation rooms, attorney conference rooms, prisoner holding cells, offices of the court clerks, the United States attorney, and the United States marshal, probation and parole offices, and adjoining corridors of any court of the United States.
    (h) Notice of the provisions of subsections (a) and (b) shall be posted conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal facility, and notice of subsection (e) shall be posted conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal court facility, and no person shall be convicted of an offense under subsection (a) or (e) with respect to a Federal facility if such notice is not so posted at such facility, unless such person had actual notice of subsection (a) or (e), as the case may be.

  7. #6
    Well, if that is the case, then concealed carry would not be illegal. Refer to section (d) (3) which lists the exceptions to the policy:

    Subsection (a) shall not apply to—
    (3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes.


    So if you went into a post office to rob the place, it wouldn't be a "lawful purpose". However, if you have a valid concealed carry permit, and were going to the post office to do business, then that would be a "lawful purpose".


    Guess it would be up to you to convince the judge that section (D)(3) applies in your situation. :)
    In the beginning, the patriot is a scarce man -- brave, hated, and scorned. But when his cause succeeds, the timid join him. For then, it costs nothing to be a patriot. -- Mark Twain

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by RugerP345 View Post
    Well, if that is the case, then concealed carry would not be illegal. Refer to section (d) (3) which lists the exceptions to the policy:

    Subsection (a) shall not apply to—
    (3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes.


    So if you went into a post office to rob the place, it wouldn't be a "lawful purpose". However, if you have a valid concealed carry permit, and were going to the post office to do business, then that would be a "lawful purpose".


    Guess it would be up to you to convince the judge that section (D)(3) applies in your situation. :)
    PA has the "other lawful purpose" as an exception to their carry in schools law...but nobody wants to be the test case...

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by rva1911 View Post
    Funny you mention this. I just did research on the topic today. It's prohibited at my P.O . And I saw the sign posted inside the post office, but not at the entrance.
    Title 39 requires the signs be posted at each public entrance. The recent case was based on having a gun inside a fenced and secure P.O. parking lot which was posted on the gate.

    The law needs to be clarified, either the Post Office must obey its own rules or the law must be changed.
    The people think the Second Amendment protects their rights;
    Government sees an obstacle to be over-come.
    NRA Life since 1966

  10. Follow the law of sign posted and you must leave your firearm in the car before you entering the post office. But I know concealed carry no body can see your gun, but still you will loose your ccw license and go to jail.
    NRA Life Member

  11. #10
    Another loop hole here is Post Offices inside other facilities..
    Near me is an Ace Hardware with a Post Office inside.. It is Legal to carry in the Ace Hardware and even do Postal transactions..
    This is important to me, as I mostly ride a motorcycle.. So, my choice is - Carry inside a post office - OR Remove my gun on a public street, place it in my unlocked Saddle bag and leave the pistol unattended..

    Now my statement that follows is not a "legal" question, but which is worse... Carrying a pistol that is concealed into a post-office or leaving a pistol unattended in an unlocked Saddle bag??? Hummmm...

    Thus I go to the Post Office inside of the Ace Hardware to avoid both of these situations..

    Gulf Coast, Floriduh
    Sccy is the limit

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