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  1. I had clearance when I was employed at NRL. My father on the other hand a Navy CT for 23 years go tout played for a little more then a year then got a job doing what I was told was the same thing he did in the Navy at NSA on FT Mead. We got calls and letter from people my dad had not seen or even thought of in 20 years saying the gov had stopped by and asked questions about him. I still have no idea what he actually did!

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  3. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by maine04619 View Post
    I had clearance when I was employed at NRL. My father on the other hand a Navy CT for 23 years go tout played for a little more then a year then got a job doing what I was told was the same thing he did in the Navy at NSA on FT Mead. We got calls and letter from people my dad had not seen or even thought of in 20 years saying the gov had stopped by and asked questions about him. I still have no idea what he actually did!
    My great-aunt that passed away a couple years ago was the same way. We knew she worked for the OSS/CIA, but until the day she died at 95 she never told anyone what she did. The family theory that I was always told was that she was somehow involved in smuggling Jews out of Poland during the Holocaust.

  4. Quote Originally Posted by jcreek View Post
    My great-aunt that passed away a couple years ago was the same way. We knew she worked for the OSS/CIA, but until the day she died at 95 she never told anyone what she did. The family theory that I was always told was that she was somehow involved in smuggling Jews out of Poland during the Holocaust.
    I will never know exactly what my dad did. I know he was a very good cryptology tech and he loved his job but I realized a long time ago I would never know more then that.

  5. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by mappow View Post
    I also throw this out there like flatulence in the wind.......Why would a E3 have access to millions of records and files listed TS or above? Pvt Manning, really???? Was this a set up like Fast & Furious gone bad? Need to know was always the standard of access. what has changed?
    I was hoping someone more familiar with the current system would comment. I had it explained to me in detail when Bradley Manning was first arrested, but don't remember all of the names and terminology.....and really don't feel like looking it up this morning to go in the detail I like to.

    This information may be dated, I was told this a few years ago. Classified documents up to TS are now available via an internet-styled system called SIPRNET, commonly known as "sipper". The current problems are due to that system, or at least it creates a new scenario. Back in the day, access to classified material was limited to what was available in the unit's library, besides whatever other measures were used to limit access by clearance level and need-to-know.....or lack thereof. Which means, even if someone was given access to material they weren't supposed to see, they were still limited by was was actually present in the library/file cabinet/safe/SKIF/etc.

    But with SIPRNET, if someone is accidentally given more access than they need or should have....and I'm sure that happens every day just like it did back in the day....they could very well have access to all of DoD's classifed information up to but not including TS codeword. Think about it.....picture an infantry battalion or brigade S-2. The S-2 NCO is also the security manager....an E-7 or E-8 infantry type who really would rather be leading a platoon/company of line-doggies rather than babysitting some lower-enlisted Intel Analysts and an MI lieutenant.

    So here you have PFC Bradley Manning....an analyst with far too much unsupervised time on his hands and more access than he needs.....exploring SIPRNET. He discovers that not only is DoD's classified stuff located on it, but the State Department is also using the same net. (most of the information he gave to Wikileaks was from the State Department, which if I understand correctly no longer uses SIPRNET)

    Chew on it for a while. Think about times that you or someone you knew had access to stuff you weren't supposed to have access to. (for nearly a year my job included looking daily at some TS codeword stuff that I wasn't read on to....I was attached and not assigned, and it would have been a little of a PITA to read me on....so no one ever did) Think about how much unsupervised time that Manning probably had, and he was passing the time by surfing around seeing what he could find on SIPRNET. Doesn't take a lot of imagination.....

    Just to add, if you weren't aware, Manning held on to this stuff for quite some time before he gave it to Wikileaks, over a year.
    "I don't think that a society that encourages over a million abortions a year....a society that kills out of convenience, i.e., Jack Kevorkian, can not have consequences." --Rush Limbaugh

  6. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by fstroupe View Post
    I was hoping someone more familiar with the current system would comment. I had it explained to me in detail when Bradley Manning was first arrested, but don't remember all of the names and terminology.....and really don't feel like looking it up this morning to go in the detail I like to...Just to add, if you weren't aware, Manning held on to this stuff for quite some time before he gave it to Wikileaks, over a year.
    Chances are he compiled stuff over the course of that year rather than getting it all at once.
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    I just completed my most recent SF73 for a general Secret Clearance, and nothing much clearance-wise has changed. You are correct that technology has changed, and in some instances it has out-paced security protocall. Kind of like the first guy that learned the hard way to keep his finger off the trigger until ready to shoot; after a few mishaps you start making or updating rules. For example, using flash drives on the network is now unauthorized, but it wasn't always. There is now a grocery list of permissions you need to legally copy things off the system, and they can now detect if you have done it w/o authorization.
    -
    It's kind of like computer viruses, the good guys are always a playing catch-up with the bad guys.

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    Quote Originally Posted by whodat2710 View Post
    Chances are he compiled stuff over the course of that year rather than getting it all at once.
    -
    I just completed my most recent SF73 for a general Secret Clearance, and nothing much clearance-wise has changed. You are correct that technology has changed, and in some instances it has out-paced security protocall. Kind of like the first guy that learned the hard way to keep his finger off the trigger until ready to shoot; after a few mishaps you start making or updating rules. For example, using flash drives on the network is now unauthorized, but it wasn't always. There is now a grocery list of permissions you need to legally copy things off the system, and they can now detect if you have done it w/o authorization.
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    It's kind of like computer viruses, the good guys are always a playing catch-up with the bad guys.
    Not targeting your post but my concern is "nothing much clearance-wise has changed" I went in in 1975. I did things and work with things I'll never go into. I was once questioned by NIS about a friendly meeting at a grocery store with a submariner that their boat was to get the "new system" I worked on.
    _
    It just really P O's me that a lot of the current appointments cannot pass a background check but a E6 with a clean record would be. At times I had a partially completed BI with TS. I keep 3.95 evals over ten years. But my dedication and professionalism apparently no longer is a basis for granting.

    The Libs are inside the wire and have taken over the system. I believe it was Lenin that stated " It's not the votes that counts, it the people that count the votes" THEY ARE INSIDE THE WIRE..........
    "The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." --author and philosopher Ayn Rand (1905-1982)

  8. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by mappow View Post
    Not targeting your post but my concern is "nothing much clearance-wise has changed" I went in in 1975. I did things and work with things I'll never go into. I was once questioned by NIS about a friendly meeting at a grocery store with a submariner that their boat was to get the "new system" I worked on...
    I'm just saying that the system has always been flawed, in that you can investigate the hell out of someone's past, and it will not reveal their intentions.

  9. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by maine04619 View Post
    I had clearance when I was employed at NRL. My father on the other hand a Navy CT for 23 years go tout played for a little more then a year then got a job doing what I was told was the same thing he did in the Navy at NSA on FT Mead. We got calls and letter from people my dad had not seen or even thought of in 20 years saying the gov had stopped by and asked questions about him. I still have no idea what he actually did!
    Dad was the same way. A CT of old never told what they did unless shown it in writing by someone else. Case in point was about a base in Turkey where we lived and dad was stationed. It was mentioned in a book called "Deep Black" so I asked him about it. He would neither confirm nor deny what was there but said to remember what the base was like. The Navy, under the NSGA, ran many things against the Russians back in the 50s-80s. Many of the old CTs are turning over in their graves at what the NSA is doing now. And I'm sure that there are many in still that feel it is wrong too.

    This page might give you a little more knowledge of what he did. Cryptologic Technician During dad's time in they were called Communications Technicians and on ships, they a lot of times knew more about what was going on than even the Captain of the ship/sub did. Captains on some ships were not even allowed access to areas where the CTs were working unless escorted thru.
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  10. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by S&W645 View Post
    This page might give you a little more knowledge of what he did. Cryptologic Technician During dad's time in they were called Communications Technicians and on ships, they a lot of times knew more about what was going on than even the Captain of the ship/sub did. Captains on some ships were not even allowed access to areas where the CTs were working unless escorted thru.
    A 1st cousin of my mom's was a computer guy in the Navy in the 60s-70s....I have no idea what his job was called. He retired from the Navy and was immediately snatched up by NSA, where he retired from in the late 90s. He told me he was "an IT tech for NSA".

    I can't imagine the non-disclosure statement someone like him has to sign when they retire. "I understand that in the event I open my mouth about anything I know, I will be quietly executed in the middle of the night and disappear without a trace,"
    "I don't think that a society that encourages over a million abortions a year....a society that kills out of convenience, i.e., Jack Kevorkian, can not have consequences." --Rush Limbaugh

  11. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by fstroupe View Post
    A 1st cousin of my mom's was a computer guy in the Navy in the 60s-70s....I have no idea what his job was called. He retired from the Navy and was immediately snatched up by NSA, where he retired from in the late 90s. He told me he was "an IT tech for NSA".

    I can't imagine the non-disclosure statement someone like him has to sign when they retire. "I understand that in the event I open my mouth about anything I know, I will be quietly executed in the middle of the night and disappear without a trace,"
    He may well have been a CTN or CTT in the Navy. CTN and CTT are network related so would fit in as an IT Tech. CTM and CTT (AEF) both require the same score levels on the ASVAB/AFCT and CTN requires the highest score of any Navy Job Rating. CTN wasn't in use when dad was in but he would likely have done the same type work as a CT. Dad became a CT to get out of staying at Great Lakes as an instructor and changed from an ET.

    As for the non-disclosure statement, you could more or less figure that out as he was refused duty in Vietnam and could not go to West Berlin or within 20 miles of the East German border while stationed in West Germany. While other CTs made trips to West Berlin by train.

    I ran into that same kind of ethos in dealings with former members of the WHACA. I carried a letter on WH stationary just to allow me to discuss non-operational info concerning two railroad cars that the gov't had owned and used for Presidential communications. And even at that, I had to provide the answers to my question so I could get a yes or no only answer. They, while traveling in these cars, were under a no cameras or cold spot in Alaska warning.
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