Grooming and Manner of Dress for O.C.
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Thread: Grooming and Manner of Dress for O.C.

  1. #1

    Grooming and Manner of Dress for O.C.

    I hate to admit this but to be non politically correct, it matters to me the kind of individual
    I might see that is open carrying a gun. I dont see it mentioned very much but if
    someone that looks like a gang banger or punker with mohawk and tatoos and piercings
    etc or is dressed shoddily and ungroomed and perhaps even walking with a particular
    swagger or strut, open carrying a firearm, I get worried as hell myself.

    I know what I am talking about cannot be defined by legislation but if I see this activity
    my self I honestly hope that the police would check them out and harass them a little bit.
    I dont mind there being some discretion that can be exercised even if it means that some
    overzealous cowboy L.E. miight harass me sometime. I know this, if I ever decide to
    use my OWB holster without anything to cover the gun such as loose shirt tails or coat,
    that I will definitely will be in dress clothes and dress shoes with slick every hair in place
    haircut.
    I think a tie would make a huge difference in obtaining the respectable or professional
    look. I'm no saying respectability cannot be attained any other way but everyone
    here has to know what I mean whether they agree 100 percent or not.

    I must say that I have picked the above examples as extremes to make my point
    and am not generally an alarmist myself. I'm just reflecting on some folks
    I have seen open carry such as many detectives, owners of jewelry shops
    and employees of gun stores etc. What they all have in common is a professional
    demeanor.

    I live in suburban Atlanta, GA and have begun to conceal carry just in the last month
    and acknowledge that my ideas are evolving and I recognize that where it is impossible
    to define grey lines that we must push for black lines that are extremely in our favor.

    Let me put it another way, i dont think I have ever seen any kind of holdup or
    robbery or mugging on TV where the bad guys got all dressed up first. I say TV because
    I have never seen any of those things first hand in real life.

  2.   
  3. #2
    Join Date
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    What you are describing is what the left and the politically correct call "profiling". I am not PC so I "profile" all the time. And most people do. LEO's are told not to profile but do it anyway. Profiling has actually saved lives on many occasions.

  4. #3
    Join Date
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    I know what you guys are saying...But I cant agree with this one. I like to O.C. sometimes and I also like to throw on a old pair of jeans and tee shirt, and if it's hot enough out side I just might have on the old skull cap (yes i'm balding) and my leather vest.
    To some folks I might just look like the thug you are talking about, And I don't want to be harassed just because I'm dressed for comfort. Cuzz I'm still the same person when I'm slicked up and carrying concealed, Witch I am 80% of the time..So just not a good idea IMO.

  5. #4
    Out here in the rural west we have many "colorful?" people that carry openly at times. In my mind everyone that can legally own a gun should be able to legally carry that gun however they see fit. I've seen many different looks and styles that convey every imaginable message. I assume every person around me is armed and also I assume they are potentially dangerous. I to profile to a large extent (i.e some set off more warning bells then others) but I observe everyone so that I am not caught unawares by a seemingly innocent looking bad dude. The cop that stops a law abiding punk for doing something legally is in my mind infringing on that persons rights. The grungy dude has the same rights as I do and given the day it may actually be me. I don't think the punk should say anything to the cop except(because it is now the law. thanks to the case out of Humbolt County NV that went to the supreme court) identify himself. If I am stopped from going on my way, in my mind, it is the same as an arrest. Whether it is for 5sec or 50 years it is a cop putting you under his immediate control. Anything you say can and may be used against you. Without evidence of a crime it is unnecessary to stop civilians from continuing in their lawful constitutionally protected right. This sounds in some ways like I am against profiling and I am against many of the methods used in profiling. According to the feds our veterans fit the profile of a potential natural born terrorist. On the other hand I do recognize that most cops are just trying to do a descent job. I think a degree in the constitutional rights of citizens might benefit the people a lot more then a criminal justice degree. Just my two cents. I am still studying this issue along with constitutional rights so that I will eventually be able to convey my thoughts and opinions more clearly.







    OBAMA- The best thing that has happened to the Republican party in a long time. See common enemy doctrine

  6. #5
    Yeah...um, not so much. I have no problem with L.E. observing a rough looking individual who is OCing. But in the name of consistency, it would be absolutely unacceptable for them to "harass" or even "check out" an OCer if there is no reasonable suspicion of illegal activity. Simply looking like a thug is not reasonable suspicion, nor is OCing (in OC states, of course). Therefore, looking like a thug while OCing is not reasonable suspicion, and an LEO who would detain such a person would (and has) find themselves the subject of a civil liberties lawsuit.

    Aside from that, you should also consider that it would be HIGHLY unlikely that a true thug would ever OC in the first place. Criminals don't like their unsuspecting victims or L.E. to know they are armed. Even if you wanted to make the argument that a thug might OC because he knows he cannot be harassed for it, this is equally unlikely because most criminals wouldn't even know that OC is legal in the first place.

    All things considered, regardless of their appearance, an OCer is very unlikely to be a person of interest.
    The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the Constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first. - Thomas Jefferson

  7. #6
    Join Date
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    On some days I would fail that "test" to give it a name. You apply a certain set of rules to manners, conduct, appearance and expect that the person who has the firearm on their hip will fit your expectation of responsible respectful citizen. That is why a person in uniform who has a gun on their hip does not incite that feeling of panic in the masses. They fit a certain visually acceptable norm. A person with ripped jeans a few tats and perhaps a leather jacket will cause the opposite reaction.

    Get used to it as many people will not fit the ideal image of what you consider to be a respectful law abiding citizen.

    I have had the pleasure of meeting and speaking to some individuals who would scare others just by their appearance.

    Sunday at the local Wal-Mart (armed of course as Wally World is a place I consider a mandatory carry location) I had a good laugh with a guy some would label a biker. He was kind and we looked each other in the eyes and shook hands after the laugh and conversation.

    Perhaps you should adjust your expectations and allow yourself to find the friend in a stranger you meet.

    I also had the pleasure of meeting some of the guys who post on this site for the first time in DC on the 19th. I had no expectation of what the visual would be and it did not matter. The joy that came from putting names and faces together, priceless...

    Peace...
    You can give peace a chance alright..

    I'll seek cover in case it goes badly..

  8. #7
    Join Date
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    Location
    MA, Away from the liberal loonies...
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    Quote Originally Posted by utimmer43 View Post
    Yeah...um, not so much. I have no problem with L.E. observing a rough looking individual who is OCing. But in the name of consistency, it would be absolutely unacceptable for them to "harass" or even "check out" an OCer if there is no reasonable suspicion of illegal activity. Simply looking like a thug is not reasonable suspicion, nor is OCing (in OC states, of course). Therefore, looking like a thug while OCing is not reasonable suspicion, and an LEO who would detain such a person would (and has) find themselves the subject of a civil liberties lawsuit.

    Aside from that, you should also consider that it would be HIGHLY unlikely that a true thug would ever OC in the first place. Criminals don't like their unsuspecting victims or L.E. to know they are armed. Even if you wanted to make the argument that a thug might OC because he knows he cannot be harassed for it, this is equally unlikely because most criminals wouldn't even know that OC is legal in the first place.

    All things considered, regardless of their appearance, an OCer is very unlikely to be a person of interest.
    Yea what he said...

    Peace...
    You can give peace a chance alright..

    I'll seek cover in case it goes badly..

  9. #8
    wolfhunter Guest
    I worry as much about the guy in business casual as the "biker". I watch for BEHAVIOR, not clothing, although I will try to spot others around me who MAY be carrying (fanny pack, vest, untucked loose shirt, etc.)

  10. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by preventec47 View Post
    if I see this activity
    my self I honestly hope that the police would check them out and harass them a little bit.
    I find it disheartening that, as a group of people here who all wish that we be treated fairly, regardless of our appearance, that someone would wish this upon someone else just because they are openly carrying a weapon. As another poster so eloquently put it, "Criminals don't like their unsuspecting victims or L.E. to know they are armed. Even if you wanted to make the argument that a thug might OC because he knows he cannot be harassed for it, this is equally unlikely because most criminals wouldn't even know that OC is legal in the first place.".

  11. #10
    To the OP, I have to concur about "stereotyping". You would probably look askance at me, since I resemble your "basic biker" most of the time. However, should you or your loved ones find yourselves in serious difficulty, when I was around, I might end up being the best friend you ever had. So, keep your situational awareness up, and listen to those internal "alarm bells" when they go off, but understand that all is not always what it seems.
    Prov. 27:3 - "Stone is heavy and sand a burden, but provocation by a fool is heavier than both"

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