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Thread: Bad Encounter in Ohio

  1. Quote Originally Posted by Bob Loblaw View Post
    Your verbiage suggests that not all win, wonder what happens to them. Some times it is wise to 'fly under the radar' and let our lawyers defend our rights.
    Unfortunately, the lawyers can't defend our rights without clients; and, even more unfortunately, there are no clients without arrests (or at least illegal harassments).

  2.   
  3. Open Carry

    Interesting semi-confrontation! Thanks for posting.

    We are in Open Carry in AZ; I have a CCW and carry that way; never open. Main reason for not exercising my OC rights/option is that I choose to remain below the radar of anyone--LEO's, perps--anyone! We have had discussions at the range and we all agree that, should a perp be planning something in a store, then case the place and decide to continue with his plans to rob or assault, guess who he's going to pop first? Yes! That's right! YOU! He will have that momentary advantage to draw down on you because you are in OC mode and he will deal with you first! I don't need that kind of "special attention."

    Having said that, I very much appreciate your stand up approach for all of our rights!

  4. Quote Originally Posted by gynojunkie View Post
    Interesting semi-confrontation! Thanks for posting.

    We are in Open Carry in AZ; I have a CCW and carry that way; never open. Main reason for not exercising my OC rights/option is that I choose to remain below the radar of anyone--LEO's, perps--anyone! We have had discussions at the range and we all agree that, should a perp be planning something in a store, then case the place and decide to continue with his plans to rob or assault, guess who he's going to pop first? Yes! That's right! YOU! He will have that momentary advantage to draw down on you because you are in OC mode and he will deal with you first! I don't need that kind of "special attention."

    Having said that, I very much appreciate your stand up approach for all of our rights!
    Can you provide any real-world examples of your theory actually happening in real life? The statistics gathered from real world felons indicate that felons do not like potential targets that they know are armed.

    http://www.gunfacts.info/pdfs/gun-fa...-5.1-print.pdf

    page 31:

    Fact: 60% of convicted felons admitted that they avoided committing crimes when they
    knew the victim was armed. 40% of convicted felons admitted that they avoided
    committing crimes when they thought the victim might be armed.
    Fact: Felons report that they avoid entering houses where people are at home because
    they fear being shot.
    So, if 60% avoided victims they KNEW was armed, and 40% avoided victims that MIGHT be armed.... I'll take odds that are in my favor and let them know I am armed right up front.

    When a criminal is casing a location for a potential crime, they are evaluating the effectiveness of defenses against that crime. It is much easier to go down the street one block and obtain a target location where there are no guns visible than it is to "deal with" the guns that are already present.

    Open carry deters armed robbery in Kennesaw - Atlanta gun rights | Examiner.com

    Contrary to popular belief, criminals are not all that dumb. Society has provided such an overwhelming number of potential victims that do not appear to be armed that it is just plain stupid for a criminal to "deal with" an armed target.

    Just some facts to pepper your range discussions with.

  5. #24
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    OHIO
    Posts
    2,109
    Update:
    Went to the Gallipolis City Police station today, had a very pleasant conversation with the Chief. He stated that they were aware of the incident ( one of the officers saw it online) and have been doing an investigation (informal) of it. I have purposely kept some info off of the prior posts that (possibly) involved the City Police in this also.....(what transpired after the posted audio) as I was waiting to see what the info/facts would show. I am now satisfied about this aspect (the city police) and see no need to pursue this part any further.

    I still need to have a conversation with the Sheriff, I just havent found a convenient time for myself to be able to do so. I have been told that he has an open-door policy and that it is easy to see/talk to him.

    I am sure though, that he is aware of what happened and would not be surprised if he has listened to the audio himself, so I see no reason to talk to him sooner than is convenient for both of us......

    I see some positives to what has transpired since this initially happened.... more people now know that open carry is legal (including some police/deputies that may not have known) and now maybe more citizens will carry that were possibly not sure of themselves (or the law) before.

    (hopefully now they wont be unjustly confronted about it)

  6. #25
    [QUOTE=gynojunkie;155489]Interesting semi-confrontation! Thanks for posting.

    We are in Open Carry in AZ; I have a CCW and carry that way; never open. Main reason for not exercising my OC rights/option is that I choose to remain below the radar of anyone--LEO's, perps--anyone! We have had discussions at the range and we all agree that, should a perp be planning something in a store, then case the place and decide to continue with his plans to rob or assault, guess who he's going to pop first? Yes! That's right! YOU! He will have that momentary advantage to draw down on you because you are in OC mode and he will deal with you first! I don't need that kind of "special attention."
    QUOTE]

    Can you or your range buddies provide any substantiated cases where the OC’er was targeted by the bad guys and popped first….. "Substantiated" being the key word here….not just ramblings of range windbags.

    BTW, most folks that seem to think that CC is an advantage never want to recognize that the bad guys don't seem to rob an OC'er or a store with an OC'er in it and in plain veiw. The same cannot be said for CC.

    Steve

  7. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Axeanda45 View Post
    Update:
    Went to the Gallipolis City Police station today, had a very pleasant conversation with the Chief. He stated that they were aware of the incident ( one of the officers saw it online) and have been doing an investigation (informal) of it. I have purposely kept some info off of the prior posts that (possibly) involved the City Police in this also.....(what transpired after the posted audio) as I was waiting to see what the info/facts would show. I am now satisfied about this aspect (the city police) and see no need to pursue this part any further.

    I still need to have a conversation with the Sheriff, I just havent found a convenient time for myself to be able to do so. I have been told that he has an open-door policy and that it is easy to see/talk to him.

    I am sure though, that he is aware of what happened and would not be surprised if he has listened to the audio himself, so I see no reason to talk to him sooner than is convenient for both of us......

    I see some positives to what has transpired since this initially happened.... more people now know that open carry is legal (including some police/deputies that may not have known) and now maybe more citizens will carry that were possibly not sure of themselves (or the law) before.

    (hopefully now they wont be unjustly confronted about it)

    Glad to hear that this is being resolved to your satisfaction, if you accomplish the task of educating the local LEO's and getting them to adhere to the law and not thier opinion you have done good.

    Steve

  8. #27
    Way too confrontational. Just cover it and go on about your business!

  9. Quote Originally Posted by makromer View Post
    Way too confrontational. Just cover it and go on about your business!
    So it's perfectly acceptable to you for police to confront law abiding citizens and ignore our Constitutional protections? We should just roll over and allow it, just do what "the man" says....

    There is no difference in a cop telling a person who is lawfully carrying a firearm to conceal it than there is a cop telling a black person to go somewhere else because of the color of their skin, or a cop telling a Jew to cover up their yarmulke, or telling a Christian to put away their Bible.

    Let's say the cop did tell a Jew to cover up their yarmulke because the protestants were getting upset by it. Would you tell the Jew they were being way too confrontational and just do what "the man" says and cover it up? Or would you say the same thing to the Christian if the Muslims complained about them carrying a Bible?

    My friend, if you are going to support the 2nd Amendment and the Constitution of the United States then you need to understand that carrying a gun is a Constitutionally protected right just as much as carrying a Bible is. Some states' laws support the right to carry firearms, and some states' laws don't. We need to support those states' laws that do and we need to fight to change those states' laws that don't and we need to stand against those officials who violate state laws and Constitutional protections.

  10. #29
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    OHIO
    Posts
    2,109
    Now that I have gotten some information from the 911 center and the city Police Chief, I can give a better explanation of what happened:

    Some info that I have not posted clearly or at all prior to this post:

    I had a late lunch inside of McDonalds, open carrying as usual, no one said anything to me, I have open carried at this particular McD's many times before....(it is not posted)
    When I went outside, I decided to walk on across the street to get some bread at the bread store (not posted either, have open carried there many times also), and left my vehicle parked at McD's. When I returned to my vehicle, there was an unmarked Chevrolet, possibly an Envoy, parked beside me with the front window down, that is where the audio starts, I cut out everything before this, I didnt think anyone here wanted to hear me eating and such.......


    1. The deputy was not dispatched on this, he must have just seen me as I walked across the street.

    2. He knew that open carry is legal BEFORE he confronted me, he admits it in the audio, so the ONLY explanation why he even confronted me is that he does not personally like or agree with open carry. He thought he could intimidate me into complying with his UNLAWFUL ORDER because he has a badge. HE WAS WRONG.

    3. I saw a Police car going towards the direction of McDonalds (after I left and was 1/2 mile down the road), they had the lights going and were traveling at a high rate of speed. I initially thought that someone (the deputy) called in a mwag call since when he left the McD's parking lot, he just went across the street and watched me. In my later conversation with the Chief, I now believe that it was an OHP car, and not a city car , so consider this part of the incident closed.

    4. I still am not sure when I will be able to speak with the Sheriff, I have an unpredictable schedule and just havent been able to find the time yet.

  11. #30
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Gulf Breeze FL
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    64
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    Can you provide any real-world examples of your theory actually happening in real life? The statistics gathered from real world felons indicate that felons do not like potential targets that they know are armed.

    http://www.gunfacts.info/pdfs/gun-fa...-5.1-print.pdf

    page 31:



    So, if 60% avoided victims they KNEW was armed, and 40% avoided victims that MIGHT be armed.... I'll take odds that are in my favor and let them know I am armed right up front.

    When a criminal is casing a location for a potential crime, they are evaluating the effectiveness of defenses against that crime. It is much easier to go down the street one block and obtain a target location where there are no guns visible than it is to "deal with" the guns that are already present.

    Open carry deters armed robbery in Kennesaw - Atlanta gun rights | Examiner.com

    Contrary to popular belief, criminals are not all that dumb. Society has provided such an overwhelming number of potential victims that do not appear to be armed that it is just plain stupid for a criminal to "deal with" an armed target.

    Just some facts to pepper your range discussions with.
    good info but another thing to take into consideration is someone is always the first.

    OC not legal in FL so not an option for me just saying.

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