Big G.
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Thread: Big G.

  1. #1

    Big G.

    I live in michigan and I have been readin a lot about the Open carry law in michigan, I am legal gun owner. what can anyone tell me about carrying open, I live in the city of Westland and i have not see anyone carry their weapon open. I am not a ccw person but will be in the near further, please advise thanks

  2.   
  3. #2

    OC in Michigan

    Go talk to some people at The Firing Line in Westland. It is a very nice range, most of the staff are cops or former cops (or somehow affiliated with LE), and there are always "gun" folks hanging around because they have a large selection of handguns as well as some long guns.

    I too have noticed that while it is legal to OC in Michigan, most people in this area (populated lower Michigan) do not. It would appear to be more of a rural practice, I'd say. Plus, the advantage of CONCEALED CARRY is the element of surprise ... why give that up?

    Personally, if I saw someone OC'g in a suburban or urban setting, I would assume that they had a need for attention....

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by eaccents View Post
    Plus, the advantage of CONCEALED CARRY is the element of surprise ... why give that up?
    Because the element of deterrence is more effective than the element of surprise.

    http://gunfacts.info/pdfs/gun-facts/...5.1-screen.pdf
    Page 31:

    Fact: 60% of convicted felons admitted that they avoided committing crimes when they
    knew the victim was armed. 40% of convicted felons admitted that they avoided
    committing crimes when they thought the victim might be armed.

    Fact: Felons report that they avoid entering houses where people are at home because
    they fear being shot.

    Fact: A survey of felons revealed the following:

    • 74% of felons agreed that "one reason burglars avoid houses when people are at
    home is that they fear being shot during the crime."

    • 57% of felons polled agreed, "criminals are more worried about meeting an armed
    victim
    than they are about running into the police."
    All the "element of surprise" does is allow you to shoot a criminal after they have already begun to attact you (and I still retain that ability when open carrying). I would rather deter that criminal from ever choosing me as a target to begin with. Why would a criminal pick a person who they can see is carrying a gun when they can wait two minutes for that person to leave, or go down the street one block and have their choice of many, many targets that do not appear to be armed? That just makes no sense at all. Criminals aren't THAT dumb. They have 3 goals: to get what they want in the easiest manner possible, to not get shot, to not get caught. Messing with a visibly armed civilian does not promote ANY of those three goals, ESPECIALLY when there is such a large percentage of targets available that are NOT visibly carrying a gun.

    Open carry deters armed robbery in Kennesaw - Atlanta gun rights | Examiner.com

    Quote Originally Posted by eaccents View Post
    Personally, if I saw someone OC'g in a suburban or urban setting, I would assume that they had a need for attention....
    That's funny. I would assume they were intelligent enough to recognize the deterrent value of a visible display of the capability of using defensive force making the effort required by the criminal to overcome the target to be much greater than the benefit gained should the criminal be able to overcome the target's defenses.

    And, while we're here, let's go ahead and debunk the myth that the open carrier will get shot first in a robbery:

    Gun Owner Saves Lives In The Richmond VA Golden Market Shooting

    Open carry was an advantage in this case because in the video I saw just how fast the GO managed to draw his gun and begin to return fire. You always hear about how open carry is so bad tactically – you’ll be the first one shot, etc. Oh, yeah? The GO had a HUGE gun in plain sight and he was NOT shot. Who got shot first? An unarmed store owner.
    To the OP,
    If you want real answers from experienced open carriers, I would suggest you check the Michigan forum at:
    OpenCarry.org - Discussion Forum

  5. #4
    I'm starting to think that the guys opposed to open carry are just afraid to do it. Every time someone mentions it, the old worn out arguments get presented over and over, despite the evidence to the contrary. Just like how the antis ignore all the studies showing the advantages of an armed citizenry.
    Prov. 27:3 - "Stone is heavy and sand a burden, but provocation by a fool is heavier than both"

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by JJFlash View Post
    I'm starting to think that the guys opposed to open carry are just afraid to do it. Every time someone mentions it, the old worn out arguments get presented over and over, despite the evidence to the contrary. Just like how the antis ignore all the studies showing the advantages of an armed citizenry.
    And I have noticed that they simply cannot refrain from making blanket judgments about those who do open carry. I would like to see the judmental attitudes reserved for the Brady Bunch to display and not within our own community. To wit: "I would assume that they had a need for attention.... "

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    And I have noticed that they simply cannot refrain from making blanket judgments about those who do open carry. I would like to see the judmental attitudes reserved for the Brady Bunch to display and not within our own community. To wit: "I would assume that they had a need for attention.... "
    That is the key: we are all one community and should be supporting one another, regardless of method of carry. No need for judgemental attitudes, they weaken our common cause.
    Prov. 27:3 - "Stone is heavy and sand a burden, but provocation by a fool is heavier than both"

  8. #7
    Come out of the closet already. Open carry all you want. I did it and it feels soooo liberating.

    "We're Proud, We're Armed, get use to it"



    A citizen who shirks his duty to contribute to the security of his community is little better than the criminal who threatens it.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by chroode View Post
    Come out of the closet already. Open carry all you want. I did it and it feels soooo liberating.

    "We're Proud, We're Armed, get use to it"


    Video - Breaking News Videos from CNN.com

    Another group is making a similar argument in California.

  10. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    Because the element of deterrence is more effective than the element of surprise.

    http://gunfacts.info/pdfs/gun-facts/...5.1-screen.pdf
    Page 31:



    All the "element of surprise" does is allow you to shoot a criminal after they have already begun to attact you (and I still retain that ability when open carrying). I would rather deter that criminal from ever choosing me as a target to begin with. Why would a criminal pick a person who they can see is carrying a gun when they can wait two minutes for that person to leave, or go down the street one block and have their choice of many, many targets that do not appear to be armed? That just makes no sense at all. Criminals aren't THAT dumb. They have 3 goals: to get what they want in the easiest manner possible, to not get shot, to not get caught. Messing with a visibly armed civilian does not promote ANY of those three goals, ESPECIALLY when there is such a large percentage of targets available that are NOT visibly carrying a gun.

    Open carry deters armed robbery in Kennesaw - Atlanta gun rights | Examiner.com



    That's funny. I would assume they were intelligent enough to recognize the deterrent value of a visible display of the capability of using defensive force making the effort required by the criminal to overcome the target to be much greater than the benefit gained should the criminal be able to overcome the target's defenses.

    And, while we're here, let's go ahead and debunk the myth that the open carrier will get shot first in a robbery:

    Gun Owner Saves Lives In The Richmond VA Golden Market Shooting



    To the OP,
    If you want real answers from experienced open carriers, I would suggest you check the Michigan forum at:
    OpenCarry.org - Discussion Forum
    @NavyLT: All very good things to think about in the consideration of open carry, AND you made me think hard about why I choose to continue to carry concealed. For me, it was a good mental exercise because it solidified my own reasons for not open carrying and also opened my eyes to reasons why others might choose differently.

    I grew up in a culture where we work hard, keep our heads down, and generally go about our business without attracting attention. To this day, I continue to do that. I realize that my choices in clothing, cars, home decor, etc all march in line with that philosophy and I'm OK with that.

    I agree that an obviously armed person is a GREAT deterrent, but because of where I live (medium sized town with a relatively low crime rate) and how I live my life I have tried to find a balance between being armed and drawing attention. Concealed carry works for me; but obviously it isn't the best choice for everyone else.

    Pointing the OP to the Michigan forum on Open Carry is probably the best advice.

    Thanks for the thought-provoking comments.

  11. #10
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Flint, Michigan
    Posts
    756
    Ive open carried in Michigan a few times, I live in Grand Blanc/Flint region. Ive only seen maybe 5-6 people openly carry, and most of them were at rest stops on the road on my way to my fathers in Cassopolis. Its not a common thing, unless however theres an open carry movement within your area. Id first talk with the local PD there, and the State police around there and find out how common it really is, and ask if theyre all farmiliar with the OC law. Last thing youd want to do is run into some rookie cop whos tryin to get a bust. Make sure theyre aware of the laws and so on and so forth.
    Anyhow. Have fun carrying, its a "new feeling."

    Good Luck.
    Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American Soldier....One died for your soul; the other for your freedom.

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