If I lawfully open carry can the police...? - Page 4
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Thread: If I lawfully open carry can the police...?

  1. Quote Originally Posted by jg1967 View Post
    I guess I don't see why some would want to refuse to show id just because they don't have to on principal grounds.
    Here's just a question I am going to ask... and there is nothing behind it.... just a question, that is all....

    If a police officer asks me for ID, and I am not required by law to show it to him, and I simply reply to the police, "Sir, I am not required by law to show you ID, and I would rather not engage in any voluntary discussion with you on this topic," why should that change the demeanor of the police officer after that? Why should that cause the encounter to go on any different track than it would be if I simply showed him ID? I am still just as much a law abiding citizen in either case.

    BTW, the reason I won't show ID to the police if I am not required to.... if Joe Schmoe citizen walked up to me on the street and asked me where I was going, what I was up to, who I was and please show him my driver's license...do you think it would be appropriate to answer those questions if Joe Schmoe, whom I have no idea is, asked me those questions and to show him my ID? Now, if I am engaged in normal everyday business in normal everyday life, lawfully carrying a firearm as I usually do, and Joe Police Officer approaches me and asks me the same things...why should I be more compelled to answer him than if Joe Schmoe asked? I don't know Joe Police Officer from Adam either. He is just as much a stranger to me as Joe Schmoe is - with one difference. If I make a mistake in answering Joe Police Officer, and he thinks he gains suspicion of criminal activity, Joe Police Officer can arrest me, whereas Joe Schmoe can't.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  2.   
  3. #32
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    Well when I said nonconfritational....I didn't mean to say that confrontational is just yelling, arguing or the like...just meant more having to "debate/discuss" opposing view points or rather not having to.

    As far as showing ID....I guess some people just want to live their lives with as minimal government interference as possible among other things.
    “Because when seconds count, the police are only minutes away”

    Posting in …….
    OpenCarry.org
    USA Carry
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    also check
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    Tennessee Laws at: Michie’s Legal Resources

  4. Quote Originally Posted by Fallguy View Post
    Well when I said nonconfritational....I didn't mean to say that confrontational is just yelling, arguing or the like...just meant more having to "debate/discuss" opposing view points or rather not having to.

    As far as showing ID....I guess some people just want to live their lives with as minimal government interference as possible among other things.
    Perfect!
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  5. #34
    Identity theft considerations might come into play as well.

  6. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    It's illegal in all 50 states to drive a car on public highways without a driver's license. Is driving a car on a public highway reasonable suspicion of a crime being committed because the driver may or not be license? Yet the Supreme Court has ruled that it is against the 4th amendment for a police officer to stop an individual for the sole purpose of checking to see if they have a driver's license or not. So what's the difference in a license being required to carry a gun?

    If a police officer legally detains you while you are carrying a gun, they certainly can require you to show the required license for that gun. But there has to be a legal reason to detain you to begin with. Simply performing an action that is legal, with a license, is no indication of a crime being committed, and; therefore, no basis for a lawful detention - just as the simple act of driving a car on a public highway is no basis for a lawful detention.
    take some time to research this more:

    The States are in violation of you civil rights by requireing you to have a drivers license for private use of the public highways:

    United States Code: Title 18,31. Definitions | LII / Legal Information Institute

    Right to Travel

    the only easy day was yesterday
    Last edited by Seeya; 03-26-2011 at 01:56 PM. Reason: spelling

  7. Quote Originally Posted by Seeya View Post
    take some time to research this more:

    The States are in violation of you civil rights by requireing you to have a drivers license for private use of the public highways:

    United States Code: Title 18,31. Definitions | LII / Legal Information Institute

    Right to Travel

    the only easy day was yesterday
    Do you have a driver's license?
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  8. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    Do you have a driver's license?
    do I need one? do you need one? why would you pay a tax on a right to travel? everyone thinks a license is nessasary to use the public highways, it is not. why would it matter if you or I have a license to do anything so long as we do not harm another physicaly or financially.

    Mugler v. Kansas 123 U.S. 623, 659-60.
    "Our system of government, based upon the individuality and intelligence
    of the Citizen, the state does not claim to control him, except as his
    conduct to others, leaving him the sole judge as to all that only affects
    himself."

    U.S. v. Morris. 125 F 322, 325. "Every citizen and freeman is endowed
    with certain rights and privileges to enjoy which no written law or statute is
    required. These are the fundamental or natural rights, recognized among
    all free people."

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many
    citizens, because of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

    Shapiro v. Thompson, 398 US 618, 89 S. Ct. 1322
    A citizens must be free to travel throughout the United States
    uninhibited by statutes, rules or regulation.

    Hodges v. U.S., 203 US 1 (1942). "The right to the enjoyment of life and
    liberty and the right to acquire and possess property are fundamental rights of
    the citizens of the several states and are not dependent upon the
    Constitution of the United States or the federal government for their
    existence."

    Drivers License and Concealed Weapon License or truely civil rights violations as they deprive you under color of law of your rights.

    I do not know you and have no obligation to inform you of what license I have or not.

    I have no desire to get in a pissing match with you or anyone else as I have observed recently on this site.

    some links for you and anyone else to study and conclude your own opinion.

    thurther this is not the forum to disscuss drivers license's and cwl's.

    perhaps someone else will compare the two on this or another site as they are entwined in many ways.

    Supreme Law School : E-mail : Box 036 : Msg 03678

    UNDERSTANDING JURISDICTION

    http://www.1215.org/lawnotes/lawnotes/pvc.htm

    Driver Licensing vs. Right to Travel - TLP

    Your Drivers License is a Contract.

    WHO HAS RIGHTS?!

    the only easy day was yesterday

  9. In other words, you do.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  10. #39
    People who claim that you don't need a drivers license are the same kind of people who say that the US Tax Code is illegal and that there is no constitutional requirement to pay income tax. Eventually they end up behind bars, complaining. Loudly!

    But, they're still behind bars.

  11. #40
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lakeland Man View Post
    People who claim that you don't need a drivers license are the same kind of people who say that the US Tax Code is illegal IT IS! and that there is no constitutional requirement to pay income tax. Eventually they end up behind bars, complaining. Loudly! Bullcrap

    But, they're still behind bars.

    Really?
    Please back up those statements with proof....

    I happen to know of only those that fought and WON their cases......... In other words, THEY ARE NOT BEHIND BARS.........


    Even though I consider myself quite brave... I do NOT have big enough ba*** to do what they did...... I prefer to choose my fights a little more carefully....

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