Philadelphia Fiorino Charged for Open Carry, July Court - Page 6
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Thread: Philadelphia Fiorino Charged for Open Carry, July Court

  1. #51
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    That's fine. I don't care what your personal opinion/preference is. I have a problem with you telling other people how they should behave, and being chastising when they act in a manner that you don't agree with, even though they are doing nothing illegal and doing nothing other than exercising their rights, to wit:



    I would suggest that you follow your own advice, to wit:
    In the end, all told, I think we really agree on this.
    GOD, GUNS and GUITARS

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  3. #52
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    Apr 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lakeland Man View Post
    Egads!

  4. #53

  5. I found the comments on policeone.com to be interesting. A lot more support for the OCer from LEOs than one might normally expect. Quite encouraging. Incident changes Philly PD's policy on "open carry"

  6. Quote Originally Posted by BlueMR2 View Post
    I found the comments on policeone.com to be interesting. A lot more support for the OCer from LEOs than one might normally expect. Quite encouraging. Incident changes Philly PD's policy on "open carry"
    I find this comment to be interesting...

    One should treat it as any other casual contact. Greet the subject, identify yourself, and ask if they would mind speaking with you for a moment. If asked why.....I would advise them that I would like to check the status of the permit to carry, if they refused.....then I would think one could articulate that as being an indication of possible wrong doing. While I know some people can be argumentative by nature....most law abiding citizens would not have a problem with it.
    So let me get this straight, you are going to "ask" me to produce my "papers", and then if I refuse you are going to take that as an indication of criminal activity? Since when does a person exercising their 4th Amendment rights raise suspicion? And if he wasn't going to take no for answer, then why not just make it a demand to begin with? Oh, wait.... because the officer feels we are incriminating ourselves by protecting our privacy.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  7. #56
    If I am correct, in order to open carry in PA (or in Philly), you need to possess a CC license. If this is the case, then there is no violation of a persons 4th Amendment rights by asking for their license in order to confirm that they are complying with the law.

    So when they are asked to produce their "papers" (In my head I always hear that word in this context with a German accent), to me it is no different than asking a driver to produce their drivers license.

    If I am wrong, and people in PA can open carry without a CC license, then there is no justification for asking for documentation.

  8. #57
    Join Date
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    OC is legal in PA without a permit, except Philadelphia. IMO, without RAS or PC, the PPD has no right to ask for your license. I guess it will take a court ruling and perhaps a hefty judgement against PPD before they stop trampling on the 4th Amendment.

    To another post, I am not guilty of anything because I choose to exercise my 5th Amendment rights to not speak to the police. Same as the 4th amendment. LE may not like it, but that's exactly the reason for it.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by Lakeland Man View Post
    If I am correct, in order to open carry in PA (or in Philly), you need to possess a CC license. If this is the case, then there is no violation of a persons 4th Amendment rights by asking for their license in order to confirm that they are complying with the law.

    So when they are asked to produce their "papers" (In my head I always hear that word in this context with a German accent), to me it is no different than asking a driver to produce their drivers license.

    If I am wrong, and people in PA can open carry without a CC license, then there is no justification for asking for documentation.
    If a person is driving on the highway, obeying the speed limit, staying squarely between the lines, all lights functioning on the vehicle, proper non-expired license plates on the vehicle.... can a police officer lawfully stop that individual person for no other reason than to ensure they have a valid driver's license?
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  10. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    I find this comment to be interesting... ...Since when does a person exercising their 4th Amendment rights raise suspicion? And if he wasn't going to take no for answer, then why not just make it a demand to begin with? Oh, wait.... because the officer feels we are incriminating ourselves by protecting our privacy.
    NavyLT, are you trying to imply that we shouldn't just cave into police abuses of our rights because it's for the children, or wait "officer safety" because the police are a bunch of crybabies if they don't get their way?

  11. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    If a person is driving on the highway, obeying the speed limit, staying squarely between the lines, all lights functioning on the vehicle, proper non-expired license plates on the vehicle.... can a police officer lawfully stop that individual person for no other reason than to ensure they have a valid driver's license?
    The sad fact of the matter is YES! They can pull you over for any reason they want(even if it's a made up one.) They can also follow you(or stalk) for as long as they want,till they find a reason to pull you over. If your car tire touches the yellow or white line they can use that as a reason to pull you over.

    If your looking for a person to blame for our ever eroding rights in this country, we need only look in a mirror!!! Our compliance and need to "Feel safe" has caused us to become nothing more then dogs, who come when called,play dead,fetch,roll over and speak only when our masters tell us to do so.

    Law Enforcement can come up with no valid points as to why we should not do things such as OC to name one. So they use the old standby that has worked for years and years "Officer safety!"

    They use made up facts to support their side of the issue and when that fails they use FEAR! When FEAR fails they use intimidation! They use all of the above not just on citizens who should DARE open carry, but on city/town boards and other citizens who support the rights of OCer's!

    The funnest part of this whole thing is as soon as they leave the "Blue brother hood" they are the first to ***** about their rights.

    THEY MAY TAKE OUR LIVES BUT THEY'LL NEVER TAKE OUR FREEDOM!!!!!

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