Why Open Carry is a bad Strategy - Page 29
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Thread: Why Open Carry is a bad Strategy

  1. Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    I understand your concern but please consider this. If OC were more prevalent then just by being seen on a daily basis it would become commonplace to the point where folks would eventually consider seeing a gun as the same as seeing green shirts. It would become no big deal. But in order for the sight of a gun to become commonplace somebody has to step up and.... open carry to make it happen.

    And I can say from first hand experience that the public's acceptance of OC in Michigan has changed dramatically in a positive way in the past couple of years mainly due to the efforts of a few individuals and Michigan Open Carry members (I'm not a member) OC'ing on a daily basis... sueing police depts. that harass OC'ers... open carrying into municipal council meetings and getting illegal ordinances changed.. and with having OC picnics in parks and OC dinners in restaurants.

    And when open carry becomes normalized and main stream even the police will stand behind the OC'er when someone calls and complains.... had it happen to me in a local park where the cops were called and the cop told off (politely of course) the one who made the MWAG call... not me.

    And if OC is illegal in your State and the only way you are "allowed" to bear arms is with the permission of the State called a "permit".... then you do NOT have the right to bear arms... all you have is the ability to beg the government for permission to be given the "permitted" privilege.
    Cliff notes:

    911 Operator: "911, what is your emergency?"

    Caller: "OMGWTHBBQ!!!!!!1111 I just saw a man carrying a gun!!!"

    911: "So?"

    Caller: "Uh uh uh uh uh uh uh uh...."

    911: -click-

  3. #282
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Tallahassee Florida
    Quote Originally Posted by FTG-05 View Post
    Cliff notes:

    911 Operator: "911, what is your emergency?"

    Caller: "OMGWTHBBQ!!!!!!1111 I just saw a man carrying a gun!!!"

    911: "So?"

    Caller: "Uh uh uh uh uh uh uh uh...."

    911: -click-

    "It's easier to avoid conflict than it is to survive it" - SGB

  4. Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    If a CC'er "shows" or "pulls" their gun in preparation to stop an attack already in progress and the sight of the gun ends the attack (no shots fired bad guy runs) then it was the sight of the gun that stopped the attack.

    If an OC'er carries their gun in plain sight and the sight of the gun prevents an attack then it was the sight of the gun that stopped the attack from even starting.

    So why do some CC'ers miss the point where the key element isn't some mystical magical "tactical element of surprise" but is simply the result of the bad guy seeing the gun? I would think the simple fact that it is the sight of the gun that does the deterring either exposed from CC during the attack or preventing the attack by continuous exposure with OC and not the method of carry would be some of the "common sense" you were calling for in your post.

    It would also seem to me to be "common sense" to do as much as possible to avoid the attack than to be behind the curve and be forced to respond to the attack.

    And for those unfortunate folks who live in places where OC is illegal..... first of all are you aware that a concealed carry permit (a permit is NOT a right but is an allowed by the government privilege) is the very worst kind of infringement the 2nd Amendment refers to with "shall not be infringed"? Secondly... why aren't folks in your State actively fighting to change that state of affairs? Other States have instituted "Constitutional Carry" just recently... so can yours if you want it bad enough.

    Edited to add:
    Just for clarity... I legally OC and CC every day everywhere I go so I'm not against CC. I am against perpetrating the myths against OC though.
    Believe me, we ARE doing our best to change the law here to allow OC. Used to be able to but!! It is changing but the process is too slow. When I lived in VA I did OC - especially as I lived in a less than safe area and also worked in one, too. We just have to do what we have to do.

  5. #284
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Saginaw, Michigan
    Quote Originally Posted by fjpor View Post
    Believe me, we ARE doing our best to change the law here to allow OC. Used to be able to but!! It is changing but the process is too slow. When I lived in VA I did OC - especially as I lived in a less than safe area and also worked in one, too. We just have to do what we have to do.
    Bravo Sir! Fight the good fight and never ever give up!

  6. #285
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Pasco, Washington, United States
    Quote Originally Posted by Big Gay Al:264160
    The title of this thread is a bad idea because we all know that OC is a personal choice, just like CC is a personal choice. The difference being, OC is a right in more states than CC is. So far as I am aware, CC is a right (i.e., no license required) in I believe, 4 states, or maybe it's 5 now. OC is a right in all but 7 states, to one degree or another.

    If this keeps up, does it mean we can go to the CC forum and talk about CCing being a bad idea?
    I thought of doing that...but didn't want to lower myself to pills standard. That and Navy would run out of tissues!

    I think just posting in the other two open carry threads will push this one into non existence.
    “One of the illusions of life is that the present hour is not the critical, decisive one.” – Ralph Waldo Emerson

  7. You guys are hilarious.

    My son has a business where he works nights. Once I watched as two punks came out of a bail bondsman's office at about 1am and stalked him from three angles looking to take his truck. I joined him and they left.

    Numerous times punks have come up and asked for change in the middle of the night.

    All of this stopped when he began OC'ing a 1911.

    Except for one. A punk came up to him and asked for money, then came back a few minutes later with a couple of more guys and said "I think you better check again" (for money). They didn't see his weapon from their angle, so he turned sideways to them and checked his pocket. They ran.

    Case closed. Nobody harmed. No damage done.

    That is the freedom the founding fathers envisioned for us.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by SGB View Post
    There is no documented evidence that an OC'er is more susceptible to a confrontation than a CC’er. There is, however, documented evidence that OC’ers have deterred crime; a recent one being the Waffle House in Georgia where the two lookouts who went into the Waffle House, saw the OC’ers and instructed their cohorts to wait in the car until the OC’ers left but, before that happened, a law enforcement officer noticed 4 men just sitting in the car behind the restaurant and, when the officer checked them out, found that they were armed and waiting for the OC’ers to leave, this according to one of the young lookouts who confessed.

  9. #288
    I open carry and concealed carry 50/50 of the time depending on the atmosphere. Dark out or in a bad neighborhood open carry for sure, grocery shopping etc. concealed carry. I don't think open carry is a bad idea at all. I think it comes down to experience in the person with their handgun. I feel in bad neighborhoods I doubt I will get mugged if the bad guy sees the handgun. Since I do open carry at times I do get a lot of weird or bad looks because of my gun. But oh well better safe than sorry.

  10. #289
    1. Why do cops open carry? It isn't for deterrence, that's just silly. Since they are in uniform already and advertising that they are cops... They carry open for ease of draw. Obviously it is quicker.

    2. What is this whole element of surprise thing about CCW? Only an offender has the element of surprise. A defender doesn't. A swat team raids a drug house at 5 am when everyone is sleeping. That is the element of surprise. Carrying concealed over carrying open isn't about the element of surprise--It is about being able to function normally in daily life without alerting BGs. It is so BGs when choosing/selecting a target/victim think they are looking at a lamb, when in fact they are looking at a lion. So again it isn't about the element of surprise, but disguise. Simple.

    One more thing, and this is my opinion, as well as that of many others and one major problem I have. It may stir upmsome controversy, but it really gets my goat. I see way too many OCers rationalize or defend their carry stating it is to "educate" people or make them understand the right to carry/educate them on 2A. This is the wrong reason to carry open. Carrying a gun is for self protection only. It is not and should in any way be a political or educational statement. And for god sakes it better not be done for a macho or coolness factor, I pray!

    If I was to open carry, and I may at sometime though I don't now and never have(regarding my name I do live in Nevada,) it would be for speed of engagement only while fully understanding the tactical disadvantages. I WOULD NEVER DO IT FOR POLITICAL REASONS. In fact I respectfully ask anyone to give me a tactical advantage other than speed of draw, and please don't use element of surprise cuz that is absolutely BS.

    Regarding the political statement of OC, I am not against making political statements in favor of pro gun, cc, or OC attitudes. I only believe carryin open is the wrong way to make a political statement. I believe there are other ways.

    Join the NRA, GOA, USCCA, JPFO, etc... and vote for pro gun, pro 2A candidates. Get out and vote... That is the best political statement of all! BAM!
    Last edited by NYMike; 02-06-2012 at 04:19 AM. Reason: Spell errors

  11. #290
    Why do u want to OC so badly?

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