Why Open Carry is a bad Strategy - Page 38
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Thread: Why Open Carry is a bad Strategy

  1. Quote Originally Posted by Irishcopper View Post
    In all due respect sir, you don't have any facts to back up what you say. There is no statistical evidence suggesting that open carry is wise from a tactical standpoint. Just because the statistics have not been properly recorded and organized into an easily readable form does not mean they do not exist. Wafflehouse is a perfect example. Does it happen often? Not really, but neither does OC in general, yet I can think of two confirmed incidents off the top of my head where OC deterred a crime. Pipedream? Damn, I haven't heard that term in many years! Open carry in an urban setting like Detroit, New Orleans and Memphis is simply a tactically poor choice. What reason would a law-abiding person have to go into a bad area in the first place? The fact that it's a bad neighborhood is irrelevant if people who lawfully OC are smarter than to go there. Those are the beats that I've worked dealing everyday with some of the most feral sub-humans you can imagine.

    If you want to walk around Arizona, Nevada and Utah or ride your motorcycle packing a 1911 on your hip like you are Wyatt Earp that is your business. Aaaaand the namecalling begins. With this statement, you solidify that you only support the parts of the 2nd Amendment right that you agree with. Fail. All I suggested was that you at least use a "Level II" holster, practice situational awareness and know some basic weapons retention technics. Finally, some common sense. With regard to your comment "OC works better for me. I feel safer, it is more comfortable, people are more polite, no problems waiting in lines, no BS, and few street people ask me for money." I have read your post several times. Correct me if I am wrong but it sounds like that you are trying to intimidate people. "I prefer to be left alone and I make it readily apparent" does not "I like intimidating people" make. Poison Dart Frogs are brightly colored for a reason - are they trying to intimidate anyone? No, they are displaying that they have a means of defending themselves and their kin, and if left alone, they don't cause problems. Do you really think that is is a good idea? Yes, considering that the chances of OC causing a problem for you with anyone other than an ill-informed cop are far smaller than the chances of you shooting yourself in the leg with your concealed firearm because you made a mistake. I don't care how tough you think you are, there is always someone out there that is tougher and can draw quicker than you! True! Which is why situational awareness is important.

    I've been a military and law enforcement survival and tactics instuctor for twenty years and worked on the streets of America's most dangerous cities. Places that the overwhelming majority of law-abiding folks don't go; if they live there, they tend to stay the **** inside, eh? How many real life deadly force encounters have ever been in where open carry gave you an edge on your opponent. It's a rhetorical question that I already know the answer to. It's none! How many real life, deadly encounters have police officers gotten into where OC helped them and saved their lives? Oh wait, that's unfair, because the answer is nearly all of them.

    I support your right to OC under the Second Amendment. ...no you don't. If you did, this post wouldn't exist, and your input would be limited to "I don't agree with OC, but to each their own." However, in all due respect thirty years of military and law enforcement experience tells me it's a bad idea! I guess we will agree to disagree! Stay safe out there!
    You were the type to stop an OCer and grill them for twenty minutes, weren't you?

  2.   
  3. #372
    Flanmedic51 Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefighterchen View Post
    That's funny cause I question the overall motives of many who CC. Many do it hoping to be that lucky guy that gets to kill another person and I'm more of an endorser of the practical application of openly carrying a firearm...not just to have the increased chance to kill someone.

    I think you need to go talk with some real cowboys, and not base it off a character from Hollywood....

    Just saying...:)
    I don't care if you wear a gun strapped to your head. I just wish that people do it responsibly and leave the chip on your shoulder home. I've seen many an OCer that wear the gun with a political agenda attached...for everyone to see. I'm not saying I'm biased either way or picking a fight here. This thread was started in poor taste because it pins CCer against OCer. Its too bad.

  4. #373
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    Open carry in an urban setting like Detroit, New Orleans and Memphis is simply a tactically poor choice.
    As a former Memphian that still has family there. I can tell you the only reason OC may be a poor choice "tactically" in Memphis is because of a few PISS POOR COPS with huge chips on their shoulders.

    I've been in most of the bad areas of Memphis as a civilian and my mother still lives in one of the most crime ridden areas of the city. I even has a little county LEO history there (on both sides of the badge) & I have a few family & friends who have served the "city". (One is a retired "Captain")

    They will ALL attest to the fact; Memphis has always had their share of piss poor cops with huge chips on their shoulders.; and it sounds like the city is still keeping up that reputation.

  5. #374
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flanmedic51 View Post
    I don't care if you wear a gun strapped to your head. I just wish that people do it responsibly and leave the chip on your shoulder home. I've seen many an OCer that wear the gun with a political agenda attached...for everyone to see. I'm not saying I'm biased either way or picking a fight here. This thread was started in poor taste because it pins CCer against OCer. Its too bad.
    You bet my OC'd sidearm comes with a political agenda attached! And my OC'd holstered sidearm has (and will in the future) made many a political statement (protected under the 1st Amendment by the way) in favor of the freedom to exercise the right to bear arms when worn right out there "in your face" at council meetings demanding that those local units of government obey the firearms laws in my State just like I have to.

    Now for a general statement ....

    In my not so humble opinion those who hid their guns for decades in fear of "offending" people contributed to the incremental loss of the ability to freely exercise the right to bear arms simply because they were too afraid to stand up for fear that some folks might be ... "offended". And, also in my humble opinion, those who continue to hide their guns because they are afraid of "offending" folks continue to help keep the right to bear arms.... hidden, out of sight, and worse... out of mind.

    And, in my not so humble opinion, those who ridicule and insult those who do stand up and do not hide their right to bear arms are not supporters of the right to bear arms but are detractors that help the anti gun agenda as they pit themselves against their own brethren. Imagine how much fun it is for an anti gunner to see how a person who is legally exercising the right to bear arms is ridiculed and insulted by one of their own... using the same insults and ridicule the anti gunners use!.

    And I am more than tired of hearing supposed supporters of the right to bear arms say they support the right to bear arms.... as long as folks do it in ways that are "reasonable", "appropriate", "responsible", and "acceptable", according to their own personal set of standards as if their standards should apply to everyone... never understanding that if the right to bear arms must comply with someone's standards... anyone's standards whether that be a government's, an individual's opinion, or even public opinion ... then it isn't a right at all but is an infringed upon the right privilege subject to what people think is...

    "reasonable", "appropriate", and "acceptable"... or "responsibly".

    Never forget...there are those who believe that guns in any way shape or form whether carried or not will never be ... "reasonable", "appropriate", and "acceptable" for the common man ... and that only the police are qualified to be "responsible".

  6. #375
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefighterchen View Post
    That's funny cause I question the overall motives of many who CC. Many do it hoping to be that lucky guy that gets to kill another person and I'm more of an endorser of the practical application of openly carrying a firearm...not just to have the increased chance to kill someone.

    I think you need to go talk with some real cowboys, and not base it off a character from Hollywood....

    Just saying...:)
    "Many"??? I, for one, am a CC'er who hopes & prays to never get "lucky". I also didn't switch to Geico just to run out & get in an accident... I like savings, and pie, just sayin'

  7. #376
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    Quote Originally Posted by Count-to-Nine:282890
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefighterchen View Post
    That's funny cause I question the overall motives of many who CC. Many do it hoping to be that lucky guy that gets to kill another person and I'm more of an endorser of the practical application of openly carrying a firearm...not just to have the increased chance to kill someone.

    I think you need to go talk with some real cowboys, and not base it off a character from Hollywood....

    Just saying...:)
    "Many"??? I, for one, am a CC'er who hopes & prays to never get "lucky". I also didn't switch to Geico just to run out & get in an accident... I like savings, and pie, just sayin'
    Funny you quote me, and not Flan whom posted the original message I copied...just saying....:-)
    “One of the illusions of life is that the present hour is not the critical, decisive one.” – Ralph Waldo Emerson

  8. #377
    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis1209 View Post
    This could get heated, so you guy's help yourself to some popcorn. I put extra butter on it.

    Attachment 4034
    Thanks, appreciate the extra butter.

  9. #378
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefighterchen View Post
    Funny you quote me, and not Flan whom posted the original message I copied...just saying....:-)
    His post didn't strike me as something of immediate personal interest. Was this a breach of forum etiquette? Did I break an unwritten law? My apologies if I have.





    Nope, not gonna say jus' sayin'.....

  10. Quote Originally Posted by bikenut View Post
    you bet my oc'd sidearm comes with a political agenda attached! And my oc'd holstered sidearm has (and will in the future) made many a political statement (protected under the 1st amendment by the way) in favor of the freedom to exercise the right to bear arms when worn right out there "in your face" at council meetings demanding that those local units of government obey the firearms laws in my state just like i have to.

    Now for a general statement ....

    In my not so humble opinion those who hid their guns for decades in fear of "offending" people contributed to the incremental loss of the ability to freely exercise the right to bear arms simply because they were too afraid to stand up for fear that some folks might be ... "offended". And, also in my humble opinion, those who continue to hide their guns because they are afraid of "offending" folks continue to help keep the right to bear arms.... Hidden, out of sight, and worse... Out of mind.

    And, in my not so humble opinion, those who ridicule and insult those who do stand up and do not hide their right to bear arms are not supporters of the right to bear arms but are detractors that help the anti gun agenda as they pit themselves against their own brethren. Imagine how much fun it is for an anti gunner to see how a person who is legally exercising the right to bear arms is ridiculed and insulted by one of their own... using the same insults and ridicule the anti gunners use!.

    And i am more than tired of hearing supposed supporters of the right to bear arms say they support the right to bear arms.... As long as folks do it in ways that are "reasonable", "appropriate", "responsible", and "acceptable", according to their own personal set of standards as if their standards should apply to everyone... Never understanding that if the right to bear arms must comply with someone's standards... anyone's standards whether that be a government's, an individual's opinion, or even public opinion ... Then it isn't a right at all but is an infringed upon the right privilege subject to what people think is...

    "reasonable", "appropriate", and "acceptable"... Or "responsibly".

    Never forget...there are those who believe that guns in any way shape or form whether carried or not will never be ... "reasonable", "appropriate", and "acceptable" for the common man ... And that only the police are qualified to be "responsible".

    Outstanding!!!!

  11. #380
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    Quote Originally Posted by Count-to-Nine:283007
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefighterchen View Post
    Funny you quote me, and not Flan whom posted the original message I copied...just saying....:-)
    His post didn't strike me as something of immediate personal interest. Was this a breach of forum etiquette? Did I break an unwritten law? My apologies if I have.





    Nope, not gonna say jus' sayin'.....
    The breach is of hypocrisy. That CC'ers seem to be able to generalize the OC crowd, but can't take it when they receive it back :-)

    I'm saying it...just saying....
    “One of the illusions of life is that the present hour is not the critical, decisive one.” – Ralph Waldo Emerson

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