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Thread: Positive Inquiry

  1. Quote Originally Posted by gbad6255 View Post
    I live in an OC state but prefer to CC. In a tough situation I want the element of surprise to be on my side.
    The "element of surprise" is way too much like wild west gunfighting for me. Bad guy attacks you. Now it is up to you to draw your gun, from concealment and, at a minimum, show it to the bad guy (most self-defense scenarios involving the display of firearm end without any shot being fired), but you must draw your gun from concealment and show it to the bad guy before he has a chance to see your actions and react to them. I mean, to me, that sounds just like wild west gunfighting. I would rather the bad guy sees the gun and just waits 5 minutes for me to leave or goes down the street one block and picks out one of the remaining 99.9% of the population that does not visibly display the means to kill the bad guy.

    As has been pointed out already, there has been no documented instance of Joe Civilian openly carrying a gun being picked out of a group in a robbery and shot first. You are much more likely to get killed by being run over by a car while crossing the street to go into the store or bank.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

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  3. #32
    I open carry a full size 1911 to make my butt look smaller...no really...
    Due to the increased cost of Ammunition I will be forced to discontinue warning shots as of now! USAF Chief Master Sergeant, Retired, 1979-2005

  4. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    About that "element of surprise" thing..........

    CC and OC have the very same "element of surprise" because the "element of surprise" is really nothing more than the bad guy being "surprised" to discover his intended victim ..... has a gun.

    With CC the bad guy is "surprised" to see his intended victim has a gun to defend himself with after the attack is already in progress and at that point seeing the gun can make the bad guy decide to stop the attack.

    With OC the bad guy is "surprised" to see his intended victim has a gun to defend himself with during the bad guy's choosing a victim process and at that point seeing the gun can make the bad guy decide not to attack at all.

    But either way... it was the bad guy being "surprised" to see a gun that was the actual "element of surprise".

    Quite frankly... I'd prefer the bad guy be "surprised" to see my openly carried gun and decide not to attack me so I can go home and watch the 6 o'clock news coverage .... from the comfort of my easy chair..... about the CC'er who had to pull his gun and "surprise" the bad guy who attacked him.

    Does OC's "element of surprise" really work? Well.... there have been thousands of folks open carrying in many States (Like Arizona) for decades! and yet accounts of folks OC'ing being attacked are rare. And you know with the anti gun media any incident involving an open carrier being attacked would be covered over and over and over yet such has not been the case in the past nor is it now.

    And, in my not so humble opinion, because CC's use of the "element of surprise" is only effective after the attack has begun but OC's use of the "element of surprise" can prevent an attack from happening............. OC's use of the "element of surprise" is far superior to CC's because....

    I'd much rather watch the 6 o'clock news than to BE the news
    .
    Reading this post brought to my attention the fact that most (if not all), of the SD accounts we read about in NRA & other publications seem to involve CC'ers and not OC'ers. In all the years (decades) of reading such stories, I don't remember ONE single article stating the victim "pulled is OC weapon".

    The terms I always see in these articles are statements like: "the victim was able to retrieve a firearm" or something like: "the victim, who has a conceal carry permit pulled their firearm".

    What this tells me is most BGs just don't choose to victimize a person who chooses to OC. But, may by accident pic a CCer to victimize because the look like any other victim out there.

    -
    “Only a rookie who knows nothing about science would say science takes away from faith. If you really study science, it will bring you closer to God.” —JAMES TOUR, NANOSCIENTIST

  5. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by tcox4freedom View Post
    Reading this post brought to my attention the fact that most (if not all), of the SD accounts we read about in NRA & other publications seem to involve CC'ers and not OC'ers. In all the years (decades) of reading such stories, I don't remember ONE single article stating the victim "pulled is OC weapon".

    The terms I always see in these articles are statements like: "the victim was able to retrieve a firearm" or something like: "the victim, who has a conceal carry permit pulled their firearm".

    What this tells me is most BGs just don't choose to victimize a person who chooses to OC. But, may by accident pic a CCer to victimize because the look like any other victim out there.

    -
    I never really thought of it this way. You are right....Dang, the things that makes one go hmmmmmmmmmmmm.
    Due to the increased cost of Ammunition I will be forced to discontinue warning shots as of now! USAF Chief Master Sergeant, Retired, 1979-2005

  6. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by longslide10 View Post
    Open carry is not unlawful here in Pennsylvania but never see anyone do it unless they are hunting. I am apprehensive but want to just to see what reactions I get. I know in some areas would be negative because people aren't accustomed to seeing open carry.
    Honestly, I think most people assume you are a plain clothes cop.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by rkleaman View Post
    If you try the public stunt of an open carry in North Carolina, it is more than likely that you will be charged with "going armed to bring terror to the people". This will happen even if you have a valid Concealed Carry Permit. If you have CCP and you intend to carry in North Carolina, keep your hand gun where it is supposed to be, concealed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Chief1297 View Post
    This is the most uninformed, untrue post I have read in this forum. I have been open carrying in Fayetteville NC for the past 5 years with no problem at all. To be charged with GATTTOTP certain criteria must be met and a person with a holstered weapon does not meet it. I carry all around the state with no problem and have not had a negative encounter. Carry concealed if you want to with permission from the state. Or dont. Read state vs huntley.
    I agree with this completely. OC in NC is not that big of an issue. You can be charged with anything for any reason at any time. That does not make it valid. The NC supreme court has ruled in State VS Huntley that just by carrying a firearm, there is no justification in "going armed to the terror of the people." For that charge there are 4 things that MUST be present. These are: (1) arms himself or herself with an unusual and dangerous weapon; (2) for the purpose of terrifying others and; (3) goes about on public highways; (4) in a manner to cause terror to the people. There must be intent. Unless you are specifically OC to scare people then this is not a valid charge. However many law enforcement do not understand the law fully.

    When I OC, I will carry a few copies of the NC OC Flyer to hand out if asked. You can find the most current one here: https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B9S...GNmS1c2X0RKcm8 and stay up to date with it here: Great "quick reference" guide for NC Gun laws. know your rights! (PDF)

  8. #37
    Yesterday while at the grocery store checkout a young lady (looked late teens) was bagging my groceries and also sent them outside for me to pick in the drive thru. When I got outside to pick up my purchase the same young lady was outside loading groceries into customers cars. She didn't load mine for me but got my attention by calling out "Hey, nice gun". I thanked her but didn't have time to speak with her to see if she were a shooter.
    ~
    Out youth today is the population that needs to become comfortable and trained to accept and use firearms of all types. For only then will we be more able to confront the future of our 2nd Amendment in this country.
    ~
    Although short, this young ladies response to my open carry felt good and her not worrying about who heard her say it was refreshing.
    I'd rather be a Conservative Nutjob. Than a Liberal with NO Nuts & NO Job

  9. Ok so I see from all the responses that my theory on the element of surprise going to the CC doesn't hold water. Maybe its just an excuse because I'm apprehensive about going OC. Then again, I remember the first time I took my pistol out with me to the store. Was a bit nervous about that as well. Now I don't leave home without it. I see the point many of you are making. I just need to DO IT.

  10. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by gbad6255 View Post
    Ok so I see from all the responses that my theory on the element of surprise going to the CC doesn't hold water. Maybe its just an excuse because I'm apprehensive about going OC. Then again, I remember the first time I took my pistol out with me to the store. Was a bit nervous about that as well. Now I don't leave home without it. I see the point many of you are making. I just need to DO IT.
    I admire the man who's mind is open enough to reassess his beliefs when presented with new information. No joke... I really do. Of course that and a $1.25 will buy a cuppa coffee but none the less... good for you!

    May I suggest making sure you understand all the laws that might affect open carry before doing so? The reason I say that is in Michigan a person who doesn't have a carry permit cannot "possess" a firearm in certain places... and a person who does have a carry permit can "possess" a firearm in many of the places the person without a carry permit cannot... and then... a person with a carry permit can legally open carry in places it is illegal to concealed carry.

    At least in Michigan it can be confusing.

  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by gbad6255 View Post
    Ok so I see from all the responses that my theory on the element of surprise going to the CC doesn't hold water. Maybe its just an excuse because I'm apprehensive about going OC. Then again, I remember the first time I took my pistol out with me to the store. Was a bit nervous about that as well. Now I don't leave home without it. I see the point many of you are making. I just need to DO IT.
    GET-R-DUN and quit being a pansy about it!

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