The Open Carry Argument - Page 31
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Thread: The Open Carry Argument

  1. #301
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefighterchen View Post
    You have a very skewed view of a meet and greet. Do you ask all carriers if they dress in baggy pants and big hoodies and carry around "forty fo's" or desert eagles? You can make up as many asinine descriptions of a carrier as you want, and some one some where probably fits that description, but 99% of us don't ride Harley's and carry 357 magnums. 99% of the people attending meet and greets here don't look like red necks. Maybe that's the way they are in SC, but it seems by your description of SC, it's a very restrictive and policed state, and maybe red necks are the only people that would want to live there. Though, I feel your other SC patrons wouldn't feel the same way.

    Meet and greets are not gun shows btw. They have little to do with the gun itself, and more to do with the person and rights behind it.

    I find gun owners that make up degrading descriptions of carriers to try and get their point across as ugly. I find the Brady bunch to be ugly for the same reason.
    Most self respecting red necks I know, would never put up with that much regulation.
    Big Gay Al: Big Gay Al's Big Gay (Gun) Blog
    An unarmed person speaking of the benefits of gun control is like a
    eunuch speaking about the benefits of sexual abstinence.

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  3. #302
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Lowcountry, SC
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    Quote Originally Posted by GOV5 View Post
    In South Carolina, if someone tries that "I'm gonna exercise my rights" crap, they go straight to the jailhouse. Reason: You are required to present your driver's license, proof of insurance, and registration. If you are a permit holder, your are required to present that also and inform the officer you are carrying, )and where it is on your body, if you are smart).
    Not quite correct. I assume you are talking about a traffic stop, but it makes no difference. If you are carrying a concealed weapon AND the LEO BOTH informs you he is a LEO AND asks for ID or Drivers License, "a permit holder must inform a law enforcement officer of the fact that he is a permit holder and present the permit identification card when an officer".

    You have no obligation by law to actually state whether or not you are carrying. Your choice, however, could get you taken to the pokey, right or wrong.

    Article 4 of Chapter 31 of Title 23: South Carolina Law Enforcement Division (section K)
    Islander's Law: Registration is Preparation for Confiscation

  4. #303
    This is the best OC/CC DISCUSSION thread I've ever seen.

  5. Your state is not a Gold Star state when it comes to Open carry, so you can only crow so loud. There are only a few states that allow Constitutional Carry, so until your state is one of them, you still have some work to do.

    Sure, I'd like to have the ability to open carry if I wanted. But I have to admit, I'd probably conceal carry most of the time. Just my preference. Since we've never had open carry, I guess it's just what I've gotten comfortable with. But, my conceal carry is in a case that looks like a PDA case, on the OUTSIDE of my belt. I am not comfortable with those inside the waistband holsters.

    WE have a petition right now for open carry in our legislature. I think it will pass this coming year. Each state has different laws. You still have to get a permit in your state for conceal carry. For those in favor of that style, you state isn't Gold Star....i.e.,....they make you get a permit. So it depends on your carry views as to which states are "friendly".

    South Carolina requires training, and I don't see a problem with that. In today's litigious society, knowing the laws is very important if you carry a gun, concealed or open. Personally, I don't think we got enough training on the law part of it. So, any state that does not require training as part of the concealed carry permit process, we deny reciprocation. Your state must require training because we have reciprocity with each other.

    The U.S. house just passed H 822, the National Reciprocity Law. I hope the Senate brings it to the floor and passes it. I don't think the Democrat-controlled Senate wants to be on the wrong side of the 2nd Amendment during an election year. Besides, this gun issue is not nearly as partisan as most things are. This bill passed the House by a 2:1 margin. That's huge! There are a lot of Democrats that are pro 2nd Amendment. Even Senate Leader Harry Reid got funds for a real nice shooting range in Nevada.

    I would have rather seen this issue settled in Chicago in the McDonald case, but the NRA wimped out and didn't include the issue in it's case to the Supreme Court. I don't like reciprocity coming from the Federal Govt on an issue that is already in our law..the 2nd A. But it might be a first step in finally getting the 2nd Amendment applied as it should be.

  6. "You have no obligation by law to actually state whether or not you are carrying. Your choice, however, could get you taken to the pokey, right or wrong."

    XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX B N M

    LOL! Yeah, you're right..off to the jailhouse you go. Some things don't have to be law. They are just common sense. Inform the officer that you are carrying, and where it is. Also state: " For that reason, for your safety, AND MINE, I will not make a move unless instructed by you, and the moves will be VERY SLOW.

    Are we required to say that in S.C.? NO! Does it make the officer feel safer? YES!! Look, most of the time the LEO s carrying a much bigger gun than me, and they are nervous anyway. I want them as calm as possible, for MY safety! I don't want some nervous rookie thinking I made a move for my weapon and emptying a Glock 22 on me. LOL!

  7. "theres an old saying about not judging a book by its cover. i guess you havent herd it."

    XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX B N M

    Of course I've heard it, but I think in your case, the "cover of the book" is pretty descriptive.

    And us Harley riders have a saying too, and it definitely applies here.

    "If I have to explain it, you won't understand."

  8. Quote Originally Posted by Firefighterchen View Post
    You have a very skewed view of a meet and greet. Do you ask all carriers if they dress in baggy pants and big hoodies and carry around "forty fo's" or desert eagles? You can make up as many asinine descriptions of a carrier as you want, and some one some where probably fits that description, but 99% of us don't ride Harley's and carry 357 magnums. 99% of the people attending meet and greets here don't look like red necks. Maybe that's the way they are in SC, but it seems by your description of SC, it's a very restrictive and policed state, and maybe red necks are the only people that would want to live there. Though, I feel your other SC patrons wouldn't feel the same way.

    Meet and greets are not gun shows btw. They have little to do with the gun itself, and more to do with the person and rights behind it.

    I find gun owners that make up degrading descriptions of carriers to try and get their point across as ugly. I find the Brady bunch to be ugly for the same reason.

    If it walks like a duck.............

    Uh, you're wrong about the 99% don't ride Harleys too. I ride a Harley, and have for years, and I carry a Smith& Wesson.

    And the "meet & greets" aren't what you say they are either. They are "staged" events to make a political point. Just like Occupy Wall Streeters. Heck, at least have the guts to say what you're doing. I've seen them on TV and in gun Magazines, and I didn't like them, so I'm positive it didn't present well to our opponents.

    For those of you that think "looks don't matter", you are kidding yourselves. Appearance tells a lot in most cases. If you say you don't care what you look like, and you don't care what others think about you, you have failed in your thinking. You have just made about as big of a statement, in a LOUD voice as you can about yourself. And it isn't a POSITIVE ONE EITHER!

    When you make a decision to strap on that gun, you have thrown some attitudes out the window. You are now in a world of new responsibility. To yourself, your community, and fellow gun owners. Some of us live in states where getting a permit to carry a gun isn't the easiest thing in the world to do. Some of us live in states that have upcoming legislation that could affect our rights. Currently, we have a bill in the U.S. Congress that does that. We all depend on each other to present a positive image to our community, so that ALL of us are viewed in a favorable light.

  9. To the individual who said " Looks like a redneck " please do describe exactly what a redneck looks like so we all can be on the lookout for these people. As a side note please explain where the term redneck came from and when it was fist used IF you can. I'm betting you have not a clue !!!

  10. Quote Originally Posted by GOV5 View Post
    "You have no obligation by law to actually state whether or not you are carrying. Your choice, however, could get you taken to the pokey, right or wrong."

    XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX B N M

    LOL! Yeah, you're right..off to the jailhouse you go. Some things don't have to be law. They are just common sense. Inform the officer that you are carrying, and where it is. Also state: " For that reason, for your safety, AND MINE, I will not make a move unless instructed by you, and the moves will be VERY SLOW.

    Are we required to say that in S.C.? NO! Does it make the officer feel safer? YES!! Look, most of the time the LEO s carrying a much bigger gun than me, and they are nervous anyway. I want them as calm as possible, for MY safety! I don't want some nervous rookie thinking I made a move for my weapon and emptying a Glock 22 on me. LOL!
    Just curious, is the GOV in your screen name short for "government". Sure sounds like it is to me.
    Anyone who says, "I support the 2nd amendment, BUT"... doesn't. Element of Surprise: a mythical element that many believe has the same affect upon criminals that Kryptonite has upon Superman.

  11. #310
    Join Date
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    Location
    Vickery, (Whites Landing) Ohio
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    Quote Originally Posted by GOV5 View Post
    If it walks like a duck.............

    Uh, you're wrong about the 99% don't ride Harleys too. I ride a Harley, and have for years, and I carry a Smith& Wesson.

    And the "meet & greets" aren't what you say they are either. They are "staged" events to make a political point. Just like Occupy Wall Streeters. Heck, at least have the guts to say what you're doing. I've seen them on TV and in gun Magazines, and I didn't like them, so I'm positive it didn't present well to our opponents.

    For those of you that think "looks don't matter", you are kidding yourselves. Appearance tells a lot in most cases. If you say you don't care what you look like, and you don't care what others think about you, you have failed in your thinking. You have just made about as big of a statement, in a LOUD voice as you can about yourself. And it isn't a POSITIVE ONE EITHER!

    When you make a decision to strap on that gun, you have thrown some attitudes out the window. You are now in a world of new responsibility. To yourself, your community, and fellow gun owners. Some of us live in states where getting a permit to carry a gun isn't the easiest thing in the world to do. Some of us live in states that have upcoming legislation that could affect our rights. Currently, we have a bill in the U.S. Congress that does that. We all depend on each other to present a positive image to our community, so that ALL of us are viewed in a favorable light.
    I agree with several points here, but lets not forget that just being able to share our opinions with each other here, is a wonderful thing? When free thinking people all over the world get their civil rights infringed upon daily; we still live in America, and have rights.

    Political convenience "occupy" is exactly what meet & greets, and gun walks are. Part time gathering of like-minded individuals. But it is, what it is folks. Coming from Ohio, where little by little we are gaining ground on certain aspects of legal carry; I for one, don't necessarily want, or agree with the 20-30 gun walkers who say they are meeting to "exercise" their 2nd amendment rights? I don't want to lose my open carry rights like California just did. And how the NRA, or other gun lobbying group allowed it to happen, is beyond me? What good did it do them to exercise their rights? Nothing, because LE was being swamped with calls about a "man with a gun"! Instead of the Atty. General's office making a public announcement about gun owners rights to carry, nothing was done, and the gun owners of California lost their right? I agree with exercising your rights, not just a mob, or group. It brings with it, too much negative exposure.

    I'm alot like the rest of you guys....veteran, husband, father, tax payer, hunter, etc... NO? Well, that just goes to show you don't it? We are not all alike. When I assume that we are alike, I'm wrong. Not all of you are a "veteran, husband, father, tax payer, hunter, etc...are you?

    Just because I believe in the Constitutional right to Open Carry; doesn't mean I believe that group carry is sending the right message RIGHT NOW. Not when we are slowly making advances in certain carrying aspects, "however small they may be". And what may work for you, may not work for me, or "my" personal agenda.

    Personally, I find most, not all of the open carry videos on youtube.com are nothing but bitching, griping, and moaning. If you are so well versed in the Constitutional law, and other gun laws of your State; then why do you need to rally? You've got it all figured out already? Because most of these events are scheduled in certain cities, or towns where an individual or small group of people's rights to openly carry were violated. Or believed to be violated. I'm not saying thats always the case, but they're are some strong coincedences? And I'm not saying that this is all bad either. I think with some proper planning, such an event would be tremendously helpful to educating the public on gun rights, and activities. Pro-gun speakers, especially local politicians, can pave the way to understanding. I just don't think people in general...want to see a bunch of gun-toting locals shoving guns down their throats? It's just like the smoking ban in bars?

    People come from all different walks of life. Morals, eithics, and values vary as much as opinions on this forum. Personally, I would like to see the open carrying of firearms, as much as I see a woman carrying a purse! I think exercising your rights as a law abiding citizen will go farther, than the pissed off right fighter. That's just my opinion. I understand my rights. I understand your passion when it comes the right to bear arms. I just think there's a better way to get the message across? Someone needs to step up from the NRA. Or maybe it's an attorney? Or a chief of Police? Or a ccw instructor? Or the mayor of a community? Or maybe it's you? But it's as important a message. Just as important as the people giving it. So yes, appearances do matter, especially since we live in a visually aware society. I think of "Deliverance" when I see some of these scarey ass people who are being videoed. They are scarey! I'm sorry, but scarey people with guns is not the message I want my anti-gun friends to see when I'm trying to educate them about our gun rights.

    It is what it is....I'm all for open/concealed carry. I don't want any laws to infringe on my right to bear arms. But I also don't need 20-30 BillyBobs from the trailer park, to walk arm and arm with me to the village municipal building, carrying 2nd Amendment signs, and chanting "We the people".... I think there are better ways to get the message out there. And shame on the gun lobbyists, gun televised shows, and gun manufacturers, who should be representing us where our 2nd amendment rights are concerned!

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