Graduated voting rights
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Thread: Graduated voting rights

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
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    Florida Panhandle
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    Exclamation Graduated voting rights

    Chew on this for a while

    What if voting was based on a 5 point system.

    You get 1 point for being an American Citizen (you must be one to vote anyway)
    You get 1 point if you are serving or are an honorably discharged veteran, police, fire or paramedic or honorably retired
    you get 1 point if you actually own 1 acre or more of property
    You get 1 point if you are fully employed or fiscally self sufficient (no govt' handouts, welfare, or of social programs)
    and finally...
    you get 1 point if you are a high school graduate and can pass a simple literacy test (8th grade level just to keep it fare)

    It would put making the decisions back in the hands of those that work hard and are earning an honest living and rewards those that serve the public.

    Those that don't contribute much to society would still vote. How much their vote counted would be up to them
    FESTUS
    IN OMNIA PARATUS

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Rhode Island
    Posts
    59
    I understand your propasal in its theoretical sense but I do not think that it is either constitutional or appropriate. This is a free country where "all men are created equal." This does not mean that all men are created equal unless the don't own land, aren't civil servants, ect.

    Also, that would require the government to label us with our "worth" and that is a road that I am not willing to go down.

  4. If all men are created equal...

    ...then let us define the meaning of the word "men."

    "Men" may not be either male or female...but one that is just.
    "Men" may not be a land owner, yet one that tends to his/her flock...the one that provides for one's family.
    "Men" in America are those who are citizens, not subjects, nor interlopers, nor freeloaders.
    "Men" make adult decisions, demonstrated by an ability to participate in cheerful discord.

    And lastly while I particularly like the serving one's country aspect of this, as a Marine, I must say that I have protect those whose viewpoints I don't share. They deserve their vote.

    Let's flip this around:
    If you are not just, they you don't get a vote.
    If you are not tending to your flock, you don't get a vote.
    If you are an interloper, a freeloader,, then you don't get a vote.
    If you do not make adult decisions, like reading, then YOU don't get a vote.

    I'm not asking for all to agree with my viewpoint. I'm challenging you to not agree.

    As for the "worth" argument, it's entirely moot...we do it today.
    Felons can't vote (legally). Evidently they're "worth" less.

    If felons are worth "less;" aren't heros and veterans worth "more?!" I think Memorial Day says yes....they are.


    Cheers,

    [-null]

  5. #4
    handgonnetoter Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by null View Post
    ...then let us define the meaning of the word "men."

    "Men" may not be either male or female...but one that is just.
    "Men" may not be a land owner, yet one that tends to his/her flock...the one that provides for one's family.
    "Men" in America are those who are citizens, not subjects, nor interlopers, nor freeloaders.
    "Men" make adult decisions, demonstrated by an ability to participate in cheerful discord.

    And lastly while I particularly like the serving one's country aspect of this, as a Marine, I must say that I have protect those whose viewpoints I don't share. They deserve their vote.

    Let's flip this around:
    If you are not just, they you don't get a vote.
    If you are not tending to your flock, you don't get a vote.
    If you are an interloper, a freeloader,, then you don't get a vote.
    If you do not make adult decisions, like reading, then YOU don't get a vote.

    I'm not asking for all to agree with my viewpoint. I'm challenging you to not agree.

    As for the "worth" argument, it's entirely moot...we do it today.
    Felons can't vote (legally). Evidently they're "worth" less.

    If felons are worth "less;" aren't heros and veterans worth "more?!" I think Memorial Day says yes....they are.


    Cheers,

    [-null]
    Goodnight Chesty, wherever you are.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Rhode Island
    Posts
    59
    I do not agree with this practice of not allowing fellons not to vote. If they are citizens then they have a right to vote.

  7. When this Country was founded, the voter base was restricted. They knew if the masses would learn they could vote themselves anything paid for by someone else, they would, and the Republic would be doomed. They chose the criteria to be land owners. People with ties to their community, who were fiscally responsilble enough to own land, and they probably had a vested interest in improving their communities. Most of the really disagreeable restrictions were state and local.

    Heinlein, in Starship Troopers (the movie was nothing like the book!!) in his utopian vision, only allowed vets to vote, on the basis they had demonstraited they were willing to sacrifice their lives for the betterment of all, therefore, they had demonstraited they had the correct character trait to be responsible enough to make decisions for the group.

    An unrestricted voter base will inevitably create a situation where the lazy vote themselves the benefits of the productive, paid for by the productive, until they completely destroy the wealth of the society.

    Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb deciding what's for dinner. How do you like being a lamb???

    "All men are created equal" means in the eyes of God and the Law, what you do with that equality is entirely up to you.
    You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
    Robert A. Heinlein

  8. #7
    I see what you're trying to say here, however, there are some problems with the point system. First, I know of a couple of people who work hard to provide for their family and can't buy a house or property. Secondly, while I think everyone should serve in the military there are those who, for whatever reason (religious or otherwise), decide not to. This doesn't make them any less a citizen. Third, as for education I sincerely wish everyone would get at least a high school education. My Grandfather was a drop out because of family needs. If he were alive today, I would match him with many of the so called educated government officials running the country now. He had more common sense than anyone I knew. In my opinion, the only ones who should lose some of their rights are those who have shown a blatant disregard for the rights of others. This would mainly be violent felons.

  9. #8
    Your system would probably work fine. Our system works fine when an election is not a 'bread and circuses' event. Unfortunately, our voters are in a 'what's in it for me' mood when they go to the polls no matter what their status on your list. If people take their responsibility seriously and look at issues, they vote well. Once upon a time, American voters paid attention -- now they watch 10 second sound bites on TV and vote according to them.

    BTW ... I know a woman who grew up in Alaska and she is extremely self-sufficient, believes in individual rights, supports the Constitution; in other word exactly like the people most here would like to vote. She has chosen to not own property for personal reasons even though she is extremely successful. Your system would limit her voting rights.

    Systems survive because they work, when they cease to work things break down and something else is put in their place. Our system appears to be collapsing, so discussion of how to fix or replace it is prudent.
    People don't like to be meddled with. We tell them what to do, what to think, don't run, don't walk. We're in their homes and in their heads and we haven't the right. We're meddlesome.--River Tam

  10. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by festus View Post
    Chew on this for a while

    What if voting was based on a 5 point system.

    You get 1 point for being an American Citizen (you must be one to vote anyway)
    You get 1 point if you are serving or are an honorably discharged veteran, police, fire or paramedic or honorably retired
    you get 1 point if you actually own 1 acre or more of property
    You get 1 point if you are fully employed or fiscally self sufficient (no govt' handouts, welfare, or of social programs)
    and finally...
    you get 1 point if you are a high school graduate and can pass a simple literacy test (8th grade level just to keep it fare)

    It would put making the decisions back in the hands of those that work hard and are earning an honest living and rewards those that serve the public.

    Those that don't contribute much to society would still vote. How much their vote counted would be up to them
    Citizenship= 1 point. I agree. This provision SHOULD be enforced now...but isn't.
    Service= 1 point. Most women (and ALL handicapped individuals) would be disqualified under this provision.
    Landownership (1 acre or more)=1 point. I think making this provision "Homeowner" or "Renter" would be more fair. Many hard-working citizens rent apartments or live in houses that sit on much less than 1 acre of land.
    Employed or self-sufficient=1 point. I agree. "Taxpayer" should be added to this provision, also.
    HS grad/pass literacy test=1 point. Good idea. Voter should only have to take the test ONCE to qualify under this provision.

    Some good ideas here, festus. Keep working on it!
    Conservative Wife & Mom -- I'm a Conservative Christian-American with dual citizenship...the Kingdom of God is my 1st home and the U.S.A. is my 2nd.

  11. #10
    The problem I would have with this system is it sets up a ruling class in this country. If you met this, this, and this, then you have a say. If not then you can vote but we don't have to listen to it. And what would stop some group from changing the rules ? It may be a good idea, but good ideas can cause problems down the road.
    Vote for those who will stand up for your rights and believe as you believe everytime there is a vote. Change comes slow, have many years did it take to get where we are now?
    NRA CRSO and Instructor: Certified Pistol, Personal Protection in the Home, Certified Home Firearm Safety, Refuse to Be a Victim
    SABRE Civilian Safety Awareness Program Instructor

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