Should citizen militias secure our border? - Page 4

View Poll Results: Should citizen militias secure our border?

Voters
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  • YES

    42 72.41%
  • NO

    12 20.69%
  • UNDECIDED

    4 6.90%
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Thread: Should citizen militias secure our border?

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
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    South Carolina USA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Treo View Post
    I am undecided but I can't think of a better way to start a war. Texas actually has a state militia that is totally separate from the National Guard or Army Reserve. Perhaps they could be called up but, as chroode posited it would very likely lead to armed conflict
    An "armed" conflict with whom?

    No one is talking about invading another counrty. BG's from "other countries" have invaded us!

    I honestly do NOT believe Mexico would declare war on the U.S. because we decided to protect ourselves.

    I don't see active "military" troops shooting American citizens who are protecting themselves against drug cartels either.

    Now, I'm certain it will piss off the drug cartels and there will be a substancial increase in violence along the border. But, sometimes a "violent" defense is the "only" way out of a situation.

    I think we're fast approaching an increase in "violent" scenarios involving U.S. citizens; UNLESS the POSPOTUS finally fulfills his responsibility and sends the US military to the border. This outright invasion of our country needs to be STOPPED by whatever means necessary!

  2.   
  3. #32
    Texas does have the independant of the federal Gov. Texas Guard. I do not think gov Perry would consider using them due to his plan to run for Pres.

  4. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by chroode View Post
    Governors lose in power struggle over National Guard

    ALSO:

    The Posse Comitatus Act of 1878 forbids U.S. troops from being deployed on American soil for law enforcement. "The one exception is provided by the Insurrection Act of 1807, which lets the president use the military only for the purpose of putting down rebellions or enforcing constitutional rights if state authorities fail to do so. Under that law, the president can declare an insurrection and call in the armed forces. The act has been invoked only a handful of times in the past 50 years, including in 1957 to desegregate schools and in 1992 during riots in south central Los Angeles after the acquittal of police accused of beating Rodney King.

    Friday, January 12, 2007
    Governors lose in power struggle over National Guard
    By Kavan Peterson, Staff Writer
    To the dismay of the nation’s governors, the White House now will be empowered to go over a governor’s head and call up National Guard troops to aid a state in time of natural disasters or other public emergencies. Up to now, governors were the sole commanders in chief of citizen soldiers in local Guard units during emergencies within the state.

    A conflict over who should control Guard units arose in the days after Hurricane Katrina in 2005. President Bush sought to federalize control of Guardsmen in Louisiana in the chaos after the hurricane, but Gov. Kathleen Blanco (D) refused to relinquish command.

    Over objections from all 50 governors, Congress in October tweaked the 200-year-old Insurrection Act to empower the hand of the president in future stateside emergencies. In a letter to Congress, the governors called the change "a dramatic expansion of federal authority during natural disasters that could cause confusion in the command-and-control of the National Guard and interfere with states' ability to respond to natural disasters within their borders."
    Just so we are clear...

    I am and will remain in opposition to any and all control of an applicable states national guard by the federal government...
    Other than a Citizen Militia it leaves the applicable State Virtually NO WAY to Resist Federal Tyranny...

    I am no more a fan of the Patriot Act or other trampling’s of the Constitution by W. Bush or Gun Ban Obama & Company...

    Your latest information is Yet Another reason to FIRE CONGRESS NOVEMBER 2ND, 2010...

    NO RINOS...
    NO DEMOCRAPS...
    NO LIBERALS, PROGRESSIVES, SOCIALISTS, MARXISTS, COMMUNISTS, ETC...

    Take Back The Republic...

    Restore The Constitution...

    "The people never give up their liberties, but under some delusion." - Edmund Burke

  5. #34
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    This is another one of those flawed premise threads. Everyone should be rightfully outraged about what's been a worsening situation across the sounthern border over the past, oh what 20+ years? Old Owl supposes maybe there's thousands of properly inclined, qualified, equipped and organized citizens ready to take this on. Chroode correctly points out the logistical folley of that notion. The Gypsy as usual, takes the opportunity to blow off another anti-government rant.

    The simple fact of the matter is that this situation is not of a military nature in any way shape or form. Getting your panic and paranoia levels cranked up on high blowing it all out of proportion is not gonna help anybody. If the various police departments and Border Patrol cannot handle it, then they are the ones who need to be making adjustments. Let's not throw the baby out with the bath, people.

  6. #35
    I vote no. There's a difference between being able to shoot and understanding combat tactics. I can shoot well, but have almost no knowledge of combat tactics. In my house, I might be okay. In someone else's house not so much. In the middle of a desert I don't know the first [email protected] thing about - I'm pretty much screwed. Add to that the fact that I seriously doubt the civilian authorities would be protected from murder charges if they in fact had to shoot someone.

    Don't forget also that the Zetas are mostly former Mexican Special Forces. They probably couldn't carry a Delta Force/Navy SEAL/Green Beret/Marine Force Recon operator's jock strap but still more than most here can handle, whether we want to admit it or not.

    In the most recent case, I have no problem with the authorities patroling Falcon Lake with armed and armored patrol boats, manned by either Navy or Coast Guard personnel.

    The way to do it is with trained military personnel (regular infantry). Give Mexico an ultimatum that the border violence must stop, and that any more Americans harmed by Mexicans is unacceptable. If it continues after a set time period (say 30 days) then we divide northern Mexico into South Texas and South Arizona! (South New Mexico would just sound too wierd) Clean it up then give it back - maybe (depends on if there's anything there worth keeping). I've lost all confidence in the Border Patrol, whether it be because they are incompentent or (more likely) they have incompetent leadership who has hamstrung them with inferior equipment and poor directives. Where's Bill Jordan when we need him?

    There is a 500-lb gorilla on the block, and we're it. There is a time to use diplomacy and a time to use that 500 lbs to beat the snot out of them.

    The thing is most Mexicans that I know are good people but the government is just too corrupt.

  7. #36
    Join Date
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    I agree completely with SC Tiger when he says this is going to take the might of the US Military. (I think every "intellegent" poster here would agree with that.)

    The problem is: Our POSPOTUS will NOT do anything other than "token" gestures.

    I agree with SC Tiger; give Mexico an ultimatum. But let's be real this [insert "slang" term for female anatomy part here] of a president we currently have is NOT going to to anything about the problems on the border; UNLESS he is FORCED to act. (American citizen militias and state guard troops taking matters in there own hands would force his hand.)

    Again NOBODY is talking about invading Mexico. We just KNOW something NEEDS to be done (on this side of the border) and done NOW!

  8. #37
    Before anything was to happen No American should be allowed to cross into Mexico. If things were to happen like some of you want there would be a lot of Americans and Canadians trapped in Mexico with no chance of getting out and they may become Hostages. Very bad idea.

  9. #38

    Cool Militias

    For those not old enough to remember, there used to be a rallying cry in the U.S., "Remember the Alamo." This had meaning in many cases to cause people to be resolute in their undertakings and not give in. Today, we can say, "Remember Falcon Lake." Tomorrow or days after it may be, "Remember Tucson" or "Remember El Paso" or "Remember Laredo." Where is it going to stop? We have an impotent government which has failed to protect our borders all the while saying that our borders are more secure now than ever. That is pure hogwash and everyone knows it. If any group or militia tries to enforce our laws and protect our borders, the federal government will be down on them like stink on manure. We have become so liberal that we are letting our country be taken over (or given away by liberal politicians) and will soon be but a mere shell of the country we all grew up in. This has to stop and we again have to develop a national backbone. If our elected officials won't stand up for us, we need new ones. Personally, I intend to vote for the meanest SOB in the valley who will take our country back.

  10. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Peterson View Post
    My vote was no! I don't believe that we should relieve the US government of it's responsibility to protect us. The feds have an obligation that citizens must demand be fullfilled. Taking federal law into private hands is anarchy. Self protection is a given. Homeland protection is a service that must be federally provided. To think that citizen militias can do the federal job is plain foolishness.
    Problem is the feds will not do it. If you are waiting on them hell will freeze over first. I vote yes. Yes a thousand times yes.
    By faith Noah,being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear,prepared an ark to the saving of his house;by the which he condemned the world,and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith Heb.11:7

  11. #40
    Join Date
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    MA, Away from the liberal loonies...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cocked _and_Locked View Post
    This is another one of those flawed premise threads. Everyone should be rightfully outraged about what's been a worsening situation across the sounthern border over the past, oh what 20+ years? Old Owl supposes maybe there's thousands of properly inclined, qualified, equipped and organized citizens ready to take this on. Chroode correctly points out the logistical folley of that notion. The Gypsy as usual, takes the opportuity to blow off another anti-government rant.

    The simple fact of the matter is that this situation is not of a military nature in any way shape or form. Getting your panic and paranoia levels cranked up on high blowing it all out of proportion is not gonna help anybody. If the various police departments and Border Patrol cannot handle it, then they are the ones who need to be making adjustments. Let's not throw the baby out with the bath, people.

    And meanwhile the problem gets worse because our own government is doing nothing about the problem and to make matters worse when the individual states decide to step up and enforce laws that are already in existence (like AZ has done), they get ham-stringed by the government that should be doing the job in the first place.
    To make matters worse, the current administration decides to write a document that addresses the manner in which we violate human rights and hand it off the UN as if the UN has any jurisdiction here or should have any say in this matter whatsoever. Then the Department of Justice decides to waste taxpayer money on a law suit against the state of AZ. To add further insult to injury, they invite foreign governments (11 at last count) to join in.

    Are you frigging daft?

    In the year + since I joined this site I've tried to read your posts and apply some degree of logic to them. I stopped since that was becoming a futile endeavor. I then simply tried to see things from your point of view. I came to this conclusion; My backbone does not bend in that direction or to a degree that would allow me to put my head up my own ass so I really can't see things from that point of view.

    If I recall the military is charged with keeping us the citizens of the USA, safe from enemies both foreign and domestic. I interpret security in a simplistic manner. If the immigrants are not coming through the border checkpoints with legal papers, proper ID's and announcing themselves and clearly stating their intentions and are not willing to submit to background checks and proper identification procedures that would ensure their safety and ensure the safety of US residents, then they are perceived as the enemy and should be dealt with in that manner. Asking residents who live along the border who have a vested interest in their property and safety, to monitor and participate in this activity is not wrong.

    We're not talking a shooting gallery here. That is still murder in any case. Allowing volunteers who own property along the border to be trained and become active in defense of themselves and others is akin to having neighborhood watch groups in action. People ought to be able to be responsible and assist when matters of their own well being are the issue.

    Keep relying on the government to help you along and believing they have your best interests in mind..
    You can give peace a chance alright..

    I'll seek cover in case it goes badly..

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