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Thread: A ban that I would welcome...

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheEggman View Post
    BUT making it illegal, however, to have a painted gun, because bright colors are 'reserved' for toys would only encourage the bad guys to do so for the advantage they could gain. Not ALL criminals are stupid!.
    Great point! The cases where I've seen BG paint the barrel and front of their firearms orange was due to laws requiring "toy guns" be painted in such a way. The LEO obviously were able to react properly and apprehend the BG. Let's give our LEO a little more credit and hope that they are in fact properly trained to react to ANY threat while on the job.

    Thanks to Mayor Bloomberg, BG can expand their creativity.




    gf
    "A few well placed shots with a .22LR is a lot better than a bunch of solid misses with a .44 mag!" Glock Armorer, NRA Chief RSO, Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, Muzzleloading Rifle, Muzzleloading Shotgun, and Home Firearm Safety Training Counselor

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  3. #22
    Notice I neer said anything about banning this paint. My first thought was along the lines of a good lawyer getting me out of trouble if some idiot pointed a BB gun at me and ended up breathing through something other than his nose.

    Still can't see me painting my carry gun but, I do have several anodized parts on my G19 for GSSF.
    Unapologetic American
    NRA/IDPA/USPSA/GSSF

  4. #23
    I love how the news media puts emphasis on the responsibility of the GOVERNMENT to ban painted guns as they may be mistaken for toy guns, etc. I say let them paint guns, however they want. Bloomberg is just trying to get his hooks into the gun industry again. Yes everyone from cops to civillians are going to have issues with such a gun pointed at us. But, you should be following some sort of rules of force in your mind anyhow. "Stop or I'll shoot", presentation of a firearm, ect. If the gun and the person appear threatening to your life in that instance then its a reasonable threat. Only you will know in that situation. You can't take a colored gun pointed at you as instantly a toy, just as you cannot take having a black gun pointed at you as instantly a gun. They should ALL be guns. We've got kids around here pointing airsoft guns without orange at people to try to steal money. They come up on me, I'm going to take it as a serious threat and draw my weapon. If they run away, well there you go, if they procede well they are probably going to learn that it was not such a great idea the hard way. Treat all guns as if they are real until deemed otherwise. I'm really surprised that all the weight is being put on the officers having problems to know the difference and the governments job to ban them. Yet nothing has been said about the parents. When I was little I ran around with a black alluminum allow type m16 toy rifle. I was taught not to point it in a threatening manner at anyone and to treat it like the real guns when out in public. Sure we would have small little war games, ect. but, if we were around people off property, ect during the day mind you, we always handled them like they were real. If the kids out at 2 am in the morning, pointing a gun at people, and he looks threatening. (Thats one to picture) then well someone ain't raisin him too well. I praise the toy manufactures who started making everything clear. That solves a bigger issue. Since we have not figured out how to make clear guns yet. HMMM. There is no way, I'm letting bloomberg get his hooks into trying to forbid our rights. Where is my pink spray paint????:sly:
    They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
    ---Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759.

  5. #24
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    If LEO needs to ban gun paint because they'll be confused if the gun is "real" or not, they have a very BIG training issue. I'm not a big fan of LEO, but do have enough confidence in them to be able to respond appropriately when put into the situation. :icon_cheesygrin: Any LEO agency that admits that simply painting a gun will "confuse" their officers should seriously consider their methods of training and a possible career change.



    gf
    "A few well placed shots with a .22LR is a lot better than a bunch of solid misses with a .44 mag!" Glock Armorer, NRA Chief RSO, Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, Muzzleloading Rifle, Muzzleloading Shotgun, and Home Firearm Safety Training Counselor

  6. #25
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    Bottom line, if it pointed in my direction, it is considered deadly until proven otherwise.

  7. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Glock Fan View Post
    If LEO needs to ban gun paint because they'll be confused if the gun is "real" or not, they have a very BIG training issue. I'm not a big fan of LEO, but do have enough confidence in them to be able to respond appropriately when put into the situation. :icon_cheesygrin: Any LEO agency that admits that simply painting a gun will "confuse" their officers should seriously consider their methods of training and a possible career change.gf
    An LEO must make a split second decision on shooting a suspect. That is why toy guns started being made with bright orange or red pieces in an attempt to keep LEO's from shooting kids holding toy guns. While I don't agree with banning gun paint, I do understand the difficulty in decision making when 1/10 of a second may be all you have.

  8. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by ronwill View Post
    An LEO must make a split second decision on shooting a suspect. That is why toy guns started being made with bright orange or red pieces in an attempt to keep LEO's from shooting kids holding toy guns. While I don't agree with banning gun paint, I do understand the difficulty in decision making when 1/10 of a second may be all you have.
    Bright orange or red on toy guns are the result of the "anti" making ligitimate gun owners look like "bad guys". There are cases I've seen where BG have started painting the muzzle of their firearm bright orange. In one case, a BG had orange duct tape on an extended barrel of a very bad "knock off", but real HK pistol. Making more laws isn't the answer. Proper training and enforcement of the current laws will make a difference.

    I'm a reservist in the U.S. Military, and work in a law enforcement capacity while on duty. We're trained to treat ANY firearm (or something resembling a firearm) as a REAL threat. Don't see why civilian LEO can't train the same way. There guns shaped like ordinary stuff like cellular telephones, anchor bolts and even flash lights. Split second decision making is part of the job. If a BG is aiming ANY gun at me, I'll react accordingly. Treat the situation as "hostile" until you've personally deemed it to be otherwise.



    gf
    "A few well placed shots with a .22LR is a lot better than a bunch of solid misses with a .44 mag!" Glock Armorer, NRA Chief RSO, Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, Muzzleloading Rifle, Muzzleloading Shotgun, and Home Firearm Safety Training Counselor

  9. #28
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    I understand LEO have to make decissions in split seconds and should be given the binifit of doubt.But I have personel experiance with this when I was 12/13 years old I was playing cops and robbers with younger neighbor when from behind me I was told to stop and drop the gun. I did what I was told because I heard a adult voice. it turned out he was a police officer when he found out I was a kid with a toy playing a game I could tell he became very nervous. He rounded up the kid I was playing with and went and talked to my Mother. What had happen had not sunk in yet as I still thought I had done something wrong. When the police officer told my Mother he was notified of a male with a gun in the area and saw me (I was tall for my age) he thought I was the person the call was about and could have been and if I would not have listen to him and turnrd around and pointed the toy gun I may have been shot. To make a long story short If kids are going to be playing guns in a neighborhood they need to look like toys. If you want to play games with toy guns that look real ( I do ) do it some place safe and away from people other than who you are playing with.
    I do not mind different color firearms but we need to keep them looking as real as possible. I do agree that our police need to have the best training avilable to them in all aspects of their jobs.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the American people's liberty teeth and keystone under independence ... From the hour the Pilgrims landed, to the present day, events, occurrences, and tendencies prove that to insure peace, security and happiness, the rifle and pistol are equally indispensable . . . the very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that is good" (George Washington)

  10. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by oidsailor View Post
    .... I was told to stop and drop the gun. I did what I was told because I heard a adult voice. it turned out he was a police officer when he found out I was a kid with a toy playing a game I could tell he became very nervous. He rounded up the kid I was playing with and went and talked to my Mother. What had happen had not sunk in yet as I still thought I had done something wrong. When the police officer told my Mother he was notified of a male with a gun in the area and saw me (I was tall for my age) he thought I was the person the call was about and could have been and if I would not have listen to him and turnrd around and pointed the toy gun I may have been shot. To make a long story short If kids are going to be playing guns in a neighborhood they need to look like toys. If you want to play games with toy guns that look real ( I do ) do it some place safe and away from people other than who you are playing with.
    I do not mind different color firearms but we need to keep them looking as real as possible. I do agree that our police need to have the best training avilable to them in all aspects of their jobs.

    The LEO responded properly to the situation. These days it could be possible for some "gang banger" 7th grader to be running around with a gun. Do you think the officer should have reacted differently if it were bright orange and looked like a toy? An LEO responding to ANY call should be prepared for anything. The LEO shouldn't let his guard down because the gun looks like a toy. Parents need to be responsible and be aware of what their children are doing. Don't let children go playing with guns (real or toys) in a public place unless it's specifically designed for that purpose. There are laws here in HI that prohibit brandishing of "toys" that resemble firearms. People need to realize that robberies have been committed with "toy" guns. It's still "armed robbery" in most jurisdictions. Hence the NRA basic rule of not pointing at anything you don't intend to shoot.

    I'm against children playing with toy guns until they're old enough to understand that there are serious consequences for improperly using their toy guns. People should use firearms (toys or otherwise) only in appropriate places.




    gf
    "A few well placed shots with a .22LR is a lot better than a bunch of solid misses with a .44 mag!" Glock Armorer, NRA Chief RSO, Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, Muzzleloading Rifle, Muzzleloading Shotgun, and Home Firearm Safety Training Counselor

  11. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Glock Fan View Post
    Bright orange or red on toy guns are the result of the "anti" making ligitimate gun owners look like "bad guys". There are cases I've seen where BG have started painting the muzzle of their firearm bright orange. In one case, a BG had orange duct tape on an extended barrel of a very bad "knock off", but real HK pistol. Making more laws isn't the answer. Proper training and enforcement of the current laws will make a difference.

    I'm a reservist in the U.S. Military, and work in a law enforcement capacity while on duty. We're trained to treat ANY firearm (or something resembling a firearm) as a REAL threat. Don't see why civilian LEO can't train the same way. There guns shaped like ordinary stuff like cellular telephones, anchor bolts and even flash lights. Split second decision making is part of the job. If a BG is aiming ANY gun at me, I'll react accordingly. Treat the situation as "hostile" until you've personally deemed it to be otherwise.gf
    We agree that the situation is to be deemed hostile until determination. The problem is being in a known bad area (maybe where drugs are sold) looking for a BG. It's dusk and visibility is low, a kid pops out with a gun in his hand. Is it real? You have 1/10 of a second to decide. Is reacting accordingly shooting the kid, who may be just out playing with a toy gun? I am retired military, worked a small stint as a reserve police officer and know the training. They train you for many situations and try to prepare you for this scenario. In the end it comes down to the situation and tension at hand. By the way, it wasn't the anti's that had toy guns started being made with bright colors. It was parents groups and police agencies. Just a way of aiding under the described situation.
    Last edited by ronwill; 03-31-2008 at 08:10 AM.

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