Can muslims be good Americans/Canadians? - Page 3
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Thread: Can muslims be good Americans/Canadians?

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by G50AE View Post
    I have studied both religions and several others as well. Christianity and Islam are very much similar. The two religions are monotheistic and infact worship the same god, and not some stone or some single guy in Rome. The two religions use a lot of the same religious figures, Adam, Moses, Jesus of Nazzereth, the angel Gabriel, et cetera. Islam adds the addition prophet of Mohamed, much the same way that the Latter Day Saints Church adds Joseph Smith and the Angel Moroni. Muslims consider Christians to follow a more primative form of Islam, and thus should be treated with patience.

    You yourself ought to study religion from a more balenced perspective. Skip over the Pat Robertson and Fred Phelps stuff.
    G: I want to commend you on coming back with an actual paragraph rather than your usual one-liners. That makes it much more enjoyable having a repartee with you than hearing about CCW badges, etc. Keep it up! Now back to the subject at hand. Read a little more into Islam and you will indeed find a few similarities with Christianity but a lot of dis-similarities. I would refer you to a couple of web sites, www. Muslin-Christian-Beliefs.com and also A Love I Could Not Deny, by Diane Dew. There is some excellent information contained in both which make valid comparisons but, in the end show a great deal of difference between the two religions. The statement below was taken from one of the sites. As for Christianity being a more primitive form of Islam, I don't think so considering when Islam was founded. As I stated previously, I have nothing personal against Muslims, in general, but I am highly suspicious of those whose religion calls for me to be killed if I don't convert.

    "Islam is a religion and, keeping truth with itself, would find itself incapable of being anything other than a religion. It is founded on the very mind-set of belief. Its name, Islam, means, literally, subjection: to be thrown under. It describes the ideal state, which exists between a believer and God. The idea that it is derived from the word ‘peace’ is untrue. Converts to it seek its certainty and its way of life. Apostates from it seek freedom from it. Islam is only distantly related to Christianity. It does not fulfil or supersede it. That is an untruth put about to win converts."

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  3. #22
    One of the things I was always taught in the public schools (I know that some of you have a great disdain for those) was that America, These United States, had as one of Its founding principles the freedom of religion. Although many think that that freedom extended only to Christianity but it actually extends to all religions. For anyone to be a good American they must accept others religion and that includes Muslims. If they cannot live in peace with others then they cannot be good Americans. It is my understanding that s good Muslim cannot accept other religions and live in peace with them. Therefore for a Muslim to be a good American they cannot accept all the beliefs of their religion. As a Christian I have never been taught to use force or punishment against someone of another religion.

    Many wars have religion as the base for them and in fact some such as the Crusades were completely about religion. WW II was in many ways about religion. The nazi basis was all about religion but the more moderate Christians and others joined together to defeat it. I fear that it will not be long before the people of the world who accept the idea of Freedom of Religion will again need to join together to try and defeat those who will not accept other's religions.

    There are those who refuse to join because they claim that all religions are the same foolish idea. However they will find that the Freedom of Religion also includes the freedom to have no religion. Our America is not about Christianity but the freedom of any religion including none. To the devout Muslim there is no difference between any religion or lack of religion other than the Muslim.

  4. #23
    FN1910: I have no problem with religious tolerance and have practiced it all my life. My problem is with those who don't, i.e., Muslims, who are radical and would kill me or my family for not converting to Islam. If they will leave us alone and accept us as we are, I can easily leave them alone and let them practice their religion, minus the part that tells them do harm to us. As long as we have that understanding, I have no problem with them. They are in our country and have to obey our laws just as anyone else and are entitled to freedom of religion also. It is the radicals that cause the problems AND the reluctance of other Muslims to not speak out against them!

  5. #24
    oldgrunt: I agree totally. When in the US one must obey the laws of this country no matter what your religion or anything else is. The real problem I have are those that will excuse some act such as the carving of a star on a man's back as a religous practice. Even the recent acts of certain Amish breaking into a home and cutting the hair and beard of a man should not be tolerated in this country.

  6. #25
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by FN1910 View Post
    oldgrunt: I agree totally. When in the US one must obey the laws of this country no matter what your religion or anything else is. The real problem I have are those that will excuse some act such as the carving of a star on a man's back as a religous practice. Even the recent acts of certain Amish breaking into a home and cutting the hair and beard of a man should not be tolerated in this country.
    Just a litle correction here, FN 1910...The event you mentioned happened here in MO. The family are new immigrants here. They wanted to start a new life here. They were Pakistanis. He was beaten almost to death then the Star of David was carved on his back with the threat that if he ever open his mouth to side with the "infidels" here, they will kill him and his family. The family was never heard of from again. Glenn Beck and his company tried to find them to offer help but it seems that they had disappeared from the face of the earth. I do not believe it is a religious practice. Now if these things can happen here, what are the chances of other Muslims who are really friendly towards us?
    "Don't let the door hit ya where the dawg shudda bit ya!"
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  7. #26
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
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    28

    There's tons of ignorance to go around here...

    Emails like this bouncing around the Internet just amaze me I hate feeding the trolls, but here's some food for thought.

    First off, there's quite a few anti-terrorism Muslim groups. Of course they don't have much of a voice because it's not newsworthy to advertise Muslims as a peaceful religion with all the wars and atrocities being committed in the name of Islam. So condemnations of terrorist acts by Islamic groups goes widely unreported. They're out there though. Just search Muslims against terrorism.

    Second, just like critics of most religions can do, anti Muslim critics are cherry picking out of the Koran what they want rather than seeing the big picture. There's just as many quotes in the Koran or from Mohammed condemning violence against innocents as there are justifications for using violence. So there are as many references the crusaders used to wage war against Islam, and catholic groups use to persecute Protestants, etc. Feel free to google Koranic quotes against violence.

    As far as Allah goes, there's tons of references of him as a loving god, just as there are tons of biblical references of God wreaking vengeance and punishment against non believers (Sodom?). Take your pick on what you want to believe, but the idea of God being merciful and loving is a relatively modern concept.

    Take your pick on what you want to believe, but I can tell you this much; terrorists WANT you to fear and be suspicious of Muslims so it makes it easier for them to justify killing us.

  8. #27
    I think one of the key words used throughout this thread is "extremist". Any extremist group, whether Christian, Muslim, Hindu etc can be thought of as bad (Except for Marines :) ) One mentioned they can not be good American because they put their God above the country. The US Marines used to say "God, Corps, Country". Does that make Marines bad citizens? Of course not. That being said, one of the finest Marines I had the honor to serve with was a practicing Muslim. We when through Scout Sniper School together and he was in my Sniper Section when in Iraq. There are members of ALL regions who are not good "Americans".... but in their eyes, I'm sure they think I am not one either. My .02 and worth what you paid for it.
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  9. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker's Mom View Post
    Just a litle correction here, FN 1910...The event you mentioned happened here in MO. The family are new immigrants here. They wanted to start a new life here. They were Pakistanis. He was beaten almost to death then the Star of David was carved on his back with the threat that if he ever open his mouth to side with the "infidels" here, they will kill him and his family. The family was never heard of from again. Glenn Beck and his company tried to find them to offer help but it seems that they had disappeared from the face of the earth. I do not believe it is a religious practice. Now if these things can happen here, what are the chances of other Muslims who are really friendly towards us?

    I had only heard a small bit about the story of the carving of the star and notice that I did not say it was Muslims or any particular group that did it as I did not know. I was merely pointing out that many times attempts to "whitewash" such events as a religious practice are common. Just like the use of the N word by a black person is perfectly acceptable in the media, primarily in rap songs, but if a white man uses it even to reference a rap song he is persecuted. We are a nation of religious tolerance but we cannot use religion to justify the breaking of laws or persecution of our fellow Americans. We must continue to enforce the thought that "It may have been a common practice in the country you came from but you are in American now and we don't put up with that". Until we start treating all Americans like Americans and not like they were treated in their "homeland" we will continue down the road to destruction.

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