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  1. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Bohemian View Post
    WRONG AGAIN RON WILL!

    Obama's VAULT COPY ORIGINAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE HAS NOT BEEN EXAMINED BY ANYBODY!
    If by vault copy you're talking about the original at the Heath Department then you my be correct about an examination. I was referring to the one presented by him. The one in the health department was verified by the Director of Health and the Registrar of Vital Statistics as shown by the below excerpt from your source:

    “Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures."

    Please don't try to convince me this is a certificate given to someone not born in the state. This simply is not done. If so, how many illegal immigrants could get one for their children born elsewhere to use in getting an SSN? By the way I have experience in this matter as my wife is a naturalized citizen and first had to get a birth certificate from her home country.

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  3. #92
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    Please don't try to convince me this is a certificate given to someone not born in the state. This simply is not done. If so, how many illegal immigrants could get one for their children born elsewhere to use in getting an SSN? By the way I have experience in this matter as my wife is a naturalized citizen and first had to get a birth certificate from her home country.
    I guess you ignored the law in Hawaii at the time Obama was born. But that aside, do you want a birth certificate? I can get you one, along with a SS card, and a Kalifornia Driver's license, for about $100 around most LA downtown parks. Pretty much the same is available in most big cities around the country.
    Maybejim

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  4. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by ronwill View Post
    If by vault copy you're talking about the original at the Heath Department then you my be correct about an examination. I was referring to the one presented by him. The one in the health department was verified by the Director of Health and the Registrar of Vital Statistics as shown by the below excerpt from your source:

    “Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures."

    Please don't try to convince me this is a certificate given to someone not born in the state. This simply is not done. If so, how many illegal immigrants could get one for their children born elsewhere to use in getting an SSN? By the way I have experience in this matter as my wife is a naturalized citizen and first had to get a birth certificate from her home country.
    Wake up Ron Will...

    The Hawaii Director of Health stated they have the official birth certificate for Obama; only, WHICH IN FACT CAN BE A CERTIFICATE OF LIVE BIRTH FOR A U.S. CITIZEN BORN ABROAD! they have not verified the validity of the "CERTIFICATE OF LIVE BIRTH" that Obama's CAMPAIGN, not Obama himself has put up on his fightthesmears site and has been propagated to factcheck (Run by his and William Ayers former employers the Annenberg Foundation), politicfact, snopes, the dailykos, et.al., as being the real deal...

    U.S. Department of State - Documentation of U.S. Citizens Born Abroad:
    Documentation of U.S. Citizens Born Abroad

    Additionally, there is a special law in Hawaii and many other states, that allows the state to issue a certification of live birth to children of residents even if they were born outside of the state. YES, a Hawaii certification can be issued in such a case, but the resulting document would probably be along these lines: “Hawaii certification of live birth: Barack Obama, parents Barack Obama and Ann Obama. Date of Birth: Aug 4, place of birth: KENYA.”

    Why the Barack Obama Birth Certificate Issue Is Legitimate:
    American Thinker: Why the Barack Obama Birth Certificate Issue Is Legitimate

    Obama and the Natural Born Citizen Clause:
    http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/..._syndrome.html

    Hawaii State Department of Health:
    Hawai‘i State Department of Health

    Amended certificates of birth may be prepared and filed with the Department of Health, as provided by law, for 1) a person born in Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health or 2) a person born in a foreign country.

    Are your eyes opening up to the fraud that is Barack Obama yet?

    Hawaii DOES IN FACT happen to issue birth certificates for babies born outside Hawaii. A Related Hawaiian law on that states:
    "Certificates for children born out of State. (a) Upon application of an adult or the legal parents of a minor child, the director of health shall issue a birth certificate for such adult or minor, provided that proof has been submitted to the director of health that the legal parents of such individual while living without the Territory or State of Hawaii had declared the Territory or State of Hawaii as their legal residence for at least one year immediately preceding the birth or adoption of such child."
    Last edited by Bohemian; 01-01-2009 at 04:27 PM.

  5. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Bohemian View Post
    Wake up Ron Will...
    Bohemian, let's just say we're going to disagree on this point. From other posts I see we agree more often than not when it comes to the 2A. I believe I'll move on to some local (Georgia) things going on and start getting prepared for upcoming attacks on the 2A, the possibility of a "national defense force" being organized and the military being used to police civilians. Good luck in your battle.

  6. After reading through the 10 pages of this thread, I'm going to chime in here.

    As far as I know, each recorder of vital statistics keeps detailed records of births, deaths, etc. In the case of a live birth, such information as hospital and physician names are recorded by the governmental entity responsible.

    I also am aware that every hospital that I have had contact, has kept at least some medical records from the beginning of time. The same of physicians.

    Why not access the recorded information and backtrack the hospital record and physician notes? It may or may not exist, but has no one person tried to access it?

    Secondly, my paternal grandfather took photos of me from the day I was born, lying in the nursery of the hospital. There are a number of other photos of my mother carrying me out of the hospital, as well as my baptism a couple weeks later. My mother duly recorded my birth in her diary, as well as a number of subsequent entries as I had gotten older.

    Is there no family evidence of his birth in Hawaii?

    Third, during that era of time, for a white woman to bear a black child, would have caused some attention. Can anyone suggest that nobody saw his mother pregnant in Hawaii at the time in which she would have given birth, or known of Obama's birth at the time that it occurred? Somebody must have some direct, independent evidence, even if it just eyewitness proof of him being carried home from the hospital.

    Has anyone found a neighbor, or a friend of the grandparents who might have some knowledge?

    While not absolutely conclusive, strict record keeping from one source does not appear as it will be enough. It's time to dig deeper. Even if it's just to lie this matter to rest.

  7. Steelhorse, much of your questioning is true. Unfortunately, much of it has been investigated, and the Obama legal brigade has blocked every legal avenue to pursue. Obama himself has told every legal, health, and educational agency to not let ANYONE examine ANY of his records. Not even from the Ivy League schools. Why? Why would ANYONE want to not let you look at his/her records from an Ivy League school? Talk about prestiege!! If I had graduated from one of them, I'd be carrying the diploma around WITH me, as well as my transcripts! But then, I have nothing to hide. ;)
    As for the medical records, they are all covered by HIPAA, which does not allow ANY information to be released that could identify the patient to anyone who does not need it for continued medical care or reimbursement thereof. And, the patient can still deny that access to anyone who DOES have a legal right to access it. Therefore, no one can see or access any medical records related to his birth or any other visit to a hospital EVER.

  8. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by ronwill View Post
    Bohemian, let's just say we're going to disagree on this point. From other posts I see we agree more often than not when it comes to the 2A. I believe I'll move on to some local (Georgia) things going on and start getting prepared for upcoming attacks on the 2A, the possibility of a "national defense force" being organized and the military being used to police civilians. Good luck in your battle.
    You still can't see that he is doing his best to hide something? Why else would all this stonewalling be going on?
    Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.

    Benjamin Franklin

  9. Ronwill, I looked at your evidence concerning Mr. Obama's birth records. The digital copy posted on politifact.com states across the top "CERTIFICATION OF LIVE BIRTH". The legal definition of "certification is as follows:
    certification - confirmation that some fact or statement is true through the use of documentary evidence

    The legal definition of "certificate" is as follows:
    A document (such as a birth certificate) prepared by an official during the course of his or her regular duties, and which may be used as evidence for certain purposes.

    Do you see a difference in the meanings of the words? One states a condition is true (i.e. Mr. Obama was, in fact, born. Duh). The other can be used as evidence for certain purposes. The digital copy the Obama camp posted is not something that can be used as evidence for anything. Whether it is a forgery or not doesn't matter. It can not be used as evidence. By definition, it is not evidentary. It is not legal. It is not proof of anything, nor can it be used as proof of anything in a court of law in the U.S. I don;t know how to make that any more clear.

  10. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by magicman007 View Post
    Ronwill, I looked at your evidence concerning Mr. Obama's birth records. The digital copy posted on politifact.com states across the top "CERTIFICATION OF LIVE BIRTH". The legal definition of "certification is as follows:
    certification - confirmation that some fact or statement is true through the use of documentary evidence

    The legal definition of "certificate" is as follows:
    A document (such as a birth certificate) prepared by an official during the course of his or her regular duties, and which may be used as evidence for certain purposes.

    Do you see a difference in the meanings of the words? One states a condition is true (i.e. Mr. Obama was, in fact, born. Duh). The other can be used as evidence for certain purposes. The digital copy the Obama camp posted is not something that can be used as evidence for anything. Whether it is a forgery or not doesn't matter. It can not be used as evidence. By definition, it is not evidentary. It is not legal. It is not proof of anything, nor can it be used as proof of anything in a court of law in the U.S. I don;t know how to make that any more clear.
    I agree with you, MagicMan. Only a bona fide birth certificate will put this to rest once and for all.
    Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.

    Benjamin Franklin

  11. #100
    gpbarth Guest
    And apparently, Obama cannot produce an authentic birth certificate, else he would have done so immediately and closed all arguments.

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