Concealed Carry Reciprocity is CURRENTLY banned under Federal Law. (Important) - Page 10
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Thread: Concealed Carry Reciprocity is CURRENTLY banned under Federal Law. (Important)

  1. Phew! That was a lot of reading are any of the posters an attorneys? Now my head hurts.

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  3. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Eagle2009 View Post
    Yes, the only letter from BATFE we have addressing reciprocity is this one which specifically states they do not recognize reciprocity under any circumstances. Ronwill's letter says absolutely nothing whatsoever to the contrary.


    http://www.handgunlaw.us/documents/batf_school_zone.pdf
    That letter was written when ATF fell under the Department Of The Treasury. They now fall under the Department Of Justice and guidelines change. These departments have a hard enough time working together let alone coming up with the same guidelines. You can read whatever you want into the response I received, however, my belief is that it says to follow the laws of the state. If the statement was to be "No your reciprocity does not allow carry in school zones" why then did they not simply state this rather than say contact the states? You can argue this as long as you want but to me the question was answered quite clearly. Without NEW evidence the subject is dead to me.

  4. They did not say defer to the States regarding GFSZA. They said to contact the States with any questions you have regarding State law, as they do not answer it. It does not matter what department ATF is under... the law remains the same. Reciprocity is illegal under Federal Law. BATFE did not address the question of reciprocity in anyway whatsoever in your letter. If anything, they carefully avoided answering the question that you asked.

  5. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Eagle2009 View Post
    They did not say defer to the States regarding GFSZA. They said to contact the States with any questions you have regarding State law, as they do not answer it. It does not matter what department ATF is under... the law remains the same. Reciprocity is illegal under Federal Law. BATFE did not address the question of reciprocity in anyway whatsoever in your letter. If anything, they carefully avoided answering the question that you asked.
    Yeah, ATF is good at that. They like to leave things open for their agents to interpret as fits them.
    Not a slam just the facts.

  6. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by vn6869 View Post
    Yeah, ATF is good at that. They like to leave things open for their agents to interpret as fits them.
    Not a slam just the facts.
    10-4 on that. Make the rules up as you feel like it is a $hitty way to play kickball. When it involves federal law, it is 100x worse.

  7. #96
    handgonnetoter Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by Eagle2009 View Post
    Yes, the only letter from BATFE we have addressing reciprocity is this one which specifically states they do not recognize reciprocity under any circumstances. Ronwill's letter says absolutely nothing whatsoever to the contrary.


    http://www.handgunlaw.us/documents/batf_school_zone.pdf
    Hold on. Are you saying that the reciprocity map, that is on this website, does not really mean anything? I don't understand.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by handgonnetoter View Post
    Hold on. Are you saying that the reciprocity map, that is on this website, does not really mean anything? I don't understand.
    Reciprocity exists at the state level, not at the Federal. Reciprocity will make it legal for you to conceal carry in states that recognize your permit. Reciprocity will allow you to transport guns in more convenient ways in states that recognize whatever permit you have.

    Reciprocity will not get you out of Federal law prohibitions. The Gun Free School Zone Act is one. In order to be exempt from the FEDERAL Gun Free School Zone Act, you must have a permit issued from the same state the school zone is located in because that is the requirement in Federal law.

    Federal law also allows some states' permits to bypass the NICS checks. Reciprocity is not valid in that case either. For example, the Texas CHL exempts Texas gun buyers. Your non-Texas CCW permit would not exempt you from the NICS check in Texas, even though you could conceal carry in Texas if Texas recognized your CCW permit.

  9. Eagle2009
    So if i understand this GFSZ law, even if u have a license to carry or a cwp in your own state, you could technically be arrested for carrying a loaded firearm within 1000 feet of a K-12 school, under FEDERAL law? Is that what i am reading here?
    Ive read this whole thread, and see a lot of disagreement, is there any movement in congress to amend this law?

  10. Bills340, your CCW protects you from Federal GFSZA in the State that physically issued your permit, and only that State. For example, if you have a permit issued by the State of Missouri, you are protected from GFSZA in Missouri, and only Missouri. If you travel to any other State and carry a loaded firearm within 1000 feet of a K-12 school... you are committing a Federal Crime punishable by 5 years in Federal prison, and if convicted, you will lose your right to own a gun for the rest of your life. Another example, all the people that have Non-Resident Utah licenses are protected from Fed GFSZA in the State of Utah... but they are not protected in the State they actually live in.


    There has not been a serious movement to correct this law, we need to change that. Write your Senators and Representatives. I am attaching a PDF packet you can send them that explains everything. Click the link below to download it.

    Federal Gun Free School Zones Act 1995 Information Packet

  11. #100
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    I've followed your GFSZA caveat for quite a while. You're to be commended for solid technical adherence to the letter of the law and your, what I believe, genuine concern for law-abiding CCW men and women caught up in a legalistic trap. Your warning points to a bigger issue than a hapless CCW's life being incarcerated for substantial years and forever stained by a bogus felony and all its ramifications. I sat down with a calculator to plot how many seconds a licensed-legal (state-reciprocity factors included) CCW holder traveling, say, 25mph through a 1000 K-12 school zone would be breaking the law. I quickly realized that the only constant in the equation was 5,280 ft in a mile to be divided by 1000. The rest depends upon the curvature of the street (road) and actual distance of the road from the school encompassing "1000" ft. The key point is "motion" and the mathematics involved in proving the 1000 ft GFSZA violation. The CCW holder is in motion. He or she cannot possibly be even suspected of breaking a gun law unless that motion is terminated. Only THEN can the LEO make credible observations that the previously "in-motion" suspect broke a gun law. A lawyer with even a C in HS calculus would make cosine mince meat of any district attorney trying to get elected on this one.

    Ah! the STOP POINT! Well, that would implicitly and damn near explicitly show that local LEOs were road-block set up to entrap! No, not "play-the entrap-card" entrapping, but the REAL kind of entrapping. Any law enforcement agency that would contrive, conclude and press such a serious charge against someone simply passing through a GFSZA with no (and the following word is very important in the legal world) INTENT, I repeat, INTENT to commit a crime does not exist in the most brain-dead sense. The LEOs involved in "stopping" the legal CCW holder could conceivably be seen as creators of the crime! Don't misunderstand me - conspiracies exist and conspiracies to impugn conspiratists exist. But the scenario you put forth is not one upon which we should scramble. When LEOs reach that level of corrurption and their hearts are that far removed from the general public, we have a far more serious problem than one's right to bear arms.

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