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Thread: The NRA Continues To Compromise On The Second Amendment

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Midnight View Post
    Lol, most people wouldn't be able to afford WMD's. And the ones who would are enjoying their lives so much that wouldn't dream of doing anything that would take that away from them.

    But that's decide the point. You've made the conscious decision to appease. I recommend you go back and read the 2nd Amendment a few dozen times before you respond to this thread anymore. Tell us what you read.
    http://www.usacarry.com/forums/off-t...dsen-flag.html

    "The people never give up their liberties, but under some delusion." - Edmund Burke

  2.   
  3. Quote Originally Posted by Bohemian View Post
    Same arguments of the anti's...

    Under this view, which flips the Declaration of Independence on its head, on what grounds can you ever rebel? Since your rights are “gifts” from government, and merely whatever the government courts say, with no higher power or law, it is never legitimate for a people to rebel, no matter how ridiculous the government’s “interpretation” of its own powers or how arbitrary and murderous it becomes once its servants in black robes “make it legal” by interpreting your so-called rights out of existence. Without natural rights there is no right to revolt, which is precisely why these elites think it totally illegitimate for you to have effective means of resistance.

    The First Fundamental Principle of Constitutional Interpretation: Your Rights Don't Come From Government
    Oath Keepers: CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC 101: YOUR RIGHTS DON’T COME FROM GOVERNMENT

    IF they can ban one type or class of weapon they can ban them all...

    Without our Liberties, we have NOTHING...
    I respect the views and the passion of everyone on this issue. The constitution itself was written, based on a series of significant compromises. Compromise is not a bad thing if it can help one maintain the overall objective. I know the constitution well and read it through every two or three months. My undergraduate degree is in education with most of my teaching hours in history. The Consitution is a document that protects our rights with the reasonable expectation of logical responsibility. To think that someone should be able to build a nuclear weapon in a privately funded facility based on the protection of the Second Amendment borders on the rediculous. There are expectations of responsibility accompanying the ownership of all rights. And believe it or not, I'm a Libertarian in the vast majority of my views (see some of my other posts)............however logic and reason are our friends and we shouldn't fear them.

  4. Quote Originally Posted by MONTANA View Post
    I respect the views and the passion of everyone on this issue. The constitution itself was written, based on a series of significant compromises. Compromise is not a bad thing if it can help one maintain the overall objective. I know the constitution well and read it through every two or three months. My undergraduate degree is in education with most of my teaching hours in history. The Consitution is a document that protects our rights with the reasonable expectation of logical responsibility. To think that someone should be able to build a nuclear weapon in a privately funded facility based on the protection of the Second Amendment borders on the rediculous. There are expectations of responsibility accompanying the ownership of all rights. And believe it or not, I'm a Libertarian in the vast majority of my views (see some of my other posts)............however logic and reason are our friends and we shouldn't fear them.
    Well I just graduated from a Top 20 institution with a major in History, and I can definitely tell you that disarmament is a slow, eventual process. Some of the greatest fascists and communists in history all said that you can't strip away freedoms from the people all at once. You have to gradually do it, justifying each small bit in the name of protection. The Second Amendment is not just a right to own guns; it is an affirmation of the God-given/natural right to protect yourself again oppression.

    Under your logic, it begins with the automatic weapons (civilians don't need them). Then the assault weapons (who needs a gun with an ammo capacity greater than ten?). Then the right to carry in public goes (accidents will be more likely to happen, after all. And most people are stupid, so they shouldn't be trusted. The guns should stay at home). Then the gun registration happens (after all, no one wants to use a gun in a crime if it can be traced back to them. And this keeps the black market in check). Then the handguns go (statistics show that the majority of homicides and crimes are done with handguns). Then the semi-autos go (guns are baaaaddddd. They should only be used for ceremonial purposes). And then finally all guns are banned (ordinary people do not need guns. Only the military does).

    Still think appeasement and compromise is a good idea? Still think compromise is "logical"? While we're at it, why don't we ban cars? Too many people die from that every year. And how about we ban free speech? Racism has no place in today's society after all.

    No, I do not believe in drawing any lines for fundamental rights. Everyone should be allowed to bear arms without restrictions. It's not like arms controls even stops anything. If a psycho wants to build a doomsday device, he'll find a way. I don't think MY RIGHTS should be trampled on by ANYONE ELSE!!

  5. #24
    Thanks Midnight. You put into words what most people either fail to understand, or haven't been around long enough to know what America was like in the years preceding the 1968 gun control act. We have given away too many rights and not paid enough attention to Big Brother's intentions. Don't give away anymore freedoms, there are too few left anyway.

  6. #25
    Join Date
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    Thumbs down The NRA Continues To Compromise On The Second Amendment

    Those of you who have bad-mouthed the NRA over the GOA don't really mean it, I know. It is an inherant trait among Americans to believe in gossip and news media bias without researching the facts properly. Some feel the NRA has "sold them out", this could farthest from the truth, the NRA has sold no one out! If the GOA and other 2A Organizations had the lobbying power the NRA has, and had pooled their efforts together and fought as one against the House Bill "Disclosure Act" they might have been able to defeat it, or at a minimum, be excluded from it. But did they? No! They sat back on their fat butts and waited for the NRA to do their work for them! The GOA and the rest got their just desert (if the Senate passes this, which I feel won't happen). All this amounts to is an endrun around the SCOTUS decision on "The Citizens United v. The Federal Election Commission". Citizens United won that one, and if passed the SCOTUS will shoot down th "Disclosure Act".
    MSgt, USAF (ret), Life Member - NRA, Life Member - NAHC,
    Life Member - NCOA, Member - USCCA, Member - NCGR,
    Member - Oathkeepers

  7. #26
    wolfhunter Guest
    Those of you who state you are against "military grade" weapons in civilian hands, or claim that there is some test of what is "reasonable", PLEASE tell me who gets to define these terms? My model 700 has a higher capacity, higher rate of fire, and better accuracy than the "military weapons" used in ANY battle fought on US soil. Is it a military grade weapon? My 1911 is the same design used by our military for as long as most of the members of this forum have been alive. Is it a military grade weapon, and if it's not what differentiates it from a service-issued weapon?

    The Second Amendment doesn't say "except military or unreasonably effective weapons". Nor does it say "except in certain places TBD at a later date, at random." ANY compromise is a step towards serfdom and a LOSS of a right.

    I will obey the laws as written while doing what I can to stop further encroachments and reverse current restrictions.

  8. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Bohemian View Post
    Perhaps with a better grasp of the framers founding documents, their writings and what the first 56 of them put on the line when they signed the Declaration of Independence; you & others herein and elsewhere would understand the difference between a rant and integrity, honor and veracity and the content of ones character...
    The Declaration of Independence
    Give Me Liberty Or Give Me Death
    Constitution of the United States
    Articles of Confederation
    Bill of Rights and Later Amendments
    The Federalist Papers...
    University of Oklahoma College of Law: A Chronology of US Historical Documents

    Further, perhaps reading up on the Battles of Lexington & Concord and the Alamo, you will have a more clear understanding of why Government (Fed, State or other Municipality) cannot be permitted to limit the type or class of weapon(s) WE THE PEOPLE CAN KEEP & BEAR...
    Does "Come And Take It" ring any bells?

    “Important principles may and must be inflexible.” Abraham Lincoln

    "Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect every one who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined." - Patrick Henry

    Please show me where in the Constitution, Second Amendment or any of the founding documents that says "SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED" Except ...
    IF it does not pass what current day society (mob rule democracy vs. Constitutional Republic) deems reasonable...

    Explain how without a Unabridged Second Amendment "WE THE PEOPLE" could ever be able to remove and replace a tyrannical government?

    http://www.usacarry.com/forums/firea...-criteria.html

    http://www.usacarry.com/forums/firea...1986-fopa.html

    http://www.usacarry.com/forums/firea...fiscation.html

    Do we really want to follow in the foot steps of modern day England, Australia, Canada etc., where the people gradually compromised & conceded their rights away, to their current sad state of disarmament? This is what is happening folks...
    http://www.usacarry.com/forums/firea...pen-watch.html

    The Unabridged Second Amendment...
    The Unabridged Second Amendment

    The First Fundamental Principle of Constitutional Interpretation: Your Rights Don't Come From Government...
    Oath Keepers: CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC 101: YOUR RIGHTS DON’T COME FROM GOVERNMENT

    "Congress has no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American ... the unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." - Tench Coxe 1789

    WTFU SHEEPLE !!!

    TAKE BACK THE REPUBLIC
    XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXX

    "Perhaps with a better grasp of the framers founding documents, their writings and what the first 56 of them put on the line when they signed the Declaration of Independence; you & others herein and elsewhere would understand the difference between a rant and integrity, honor and veracity and the content of ones character..."

    Once again, your delivery is bad. Are you so arrogant that you think you are the only one that knows the intent of the Founding Fathers? Let me be the first to tell you that you don't have a captive audience on knowledge of that, or anything else for that matter.

    You just come off as a raving gun nut. That's OK with me and the rest here. We can deal with it. But for goodness sakes, do us all a favor, and don't spew that stuff to the non-gun owners ( I didn't say Anti-gun owners). You'll make us all look ignorant.

    And with all the quotes you post..the ones you like..but no others...I'll give you an attaboy for being able to use Google, Since you must think the rest of us either can't, or haven't heard of it yet.

  9. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Bohemian View Post
    The NRA Continues To Compromise On The Second Amendment

    While the GOA – Gun Owners of America, SAF – Second Amendment Foundation, JPFO – Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership, and a multitude of others have never compromised on the Second Amendment; much to this authors dismay the NRA unbelievably continues to compromise on the Second Amendment, while continuing to put their hand out for financial contributions from those that feel NO COMPROMISE on the Second Amendment or the Constitution is acceptable…
    Talk about a Judas…

    The NRA Supported the National Firearms Act of 1934, In fact, they've supported gun rights infringements "since...1871."
    Keep and Bear Arms - Gun Owners Home Page - 2nd Amendment Supporters

    "The National Rifle Association has been in support of workable, enforceable gun control legislation since its very inception in 1871."
    —NRA Executive Vice President Franklin L. Orth
    NRA's American Rifleman Magazine, March 1968, P. 22


    A few of the more heinous compromises of the NRA in recent history are:

    • Continued failure to seek repeal of 1934 NFA, 1968 GCA, 1986 FOPA, Brady Bill(s) (Including NICS Act).


    • Failure to follow through with their promise that repealing the Hughes Amendment to the FOPA 1986 will be a high-priority. Moreover, public education on the Constitutionally Protected lawful ownership of Full-Auto and other NFA/Class III firearms.


    • E.G.: Following the unconstitutional 1986 Class III weapons ban...

    Wayne LaPierre stated, "Repealing the machine gun amendment...will be a high priority," and promised the NRA's members that the organization would "actively work toward the repeal of the recent machine gun ban and will take all necessary steps to educate the public on the sporting uses and legal ownership of automatic firearms."
    They have not done diddly in over two-decades…
    WTFU Sheeple…
    • Endorsement of the original NICS Act. (The Brady Bill) – Arm in Arm with Chuck Schumer, Diane Feinstein, Ted Kennedy, and Sarah Brady… WTF?


    • It is long past time for lawyers and others to speak about the true meaning of the amendment. In an interview with Charlayne Hunter-Gault on The MacNeil/Lehrer Newshour on December 16, 1991, former United States Chief Justice Warren Burger stated that the Second Amendment "has been the subject of one of the greatest pieces of fraud, I repeat the word 'fraud' on the American public by special interest groups that I have ever seen in my lifetime." [105] He continued, "they (the NRA) have mislead the American people." [106] The gun control debate is difficult enough without entering false issues into it. [107]: Battle Over the Brady Bill






    • Endorsement of the NICS Improvement Act of 2007.

    Here is a statement from the Gun Owners of America:
    “When the NRA and Chuck Schumer (D-NY) agree, that tells you it’s something worth doing,” Schumer said. — The Associated Press, September 26, 2007
    The quote above explains the problem we are facing. Both sides of the gun control debate — with the exception of Gun Owners of America and many pro-gun groups at the state level — are supporting the Veterans Disarmament Act (HR 2640).


    • Failure to support the 10th Amendment Initiative, AKA: Firearms Freedom Act(s).

    September 2009 American Hunter NRA Official Journal of the National Rifle Association: Special Report By Chris W. Cox NRA-ILA Executive Director p17-18. “Firearms Freedom Act” One issue that’s received a lot of publicity is the “Firearms Freedom Act” – state legislation that tries to exempt firearms, ammunition and accessories from federal regulation, as long as the gun or other item is made in a single state, for use only in that state. This legislation was enacted this year in Montana and Tennessee, and proposed elsewhere. The idea behind the legislation is to challenge federal gun laws in court. While reducing federal controls worthy goal, this kind of litigation faces major obstacles – mainly because the Supreme Court has given Congress a very long leash when it comes to activities that could affect interstate commerce. (For example just four years ago, the Supreme Court held that the federal government could still enforce federal drug laws against Californians who grow their own marijuana for medical use.) Because of these issues the NRA will continue to focus on the other kinds of pro-gun legislation described in these pages. An even more important point is that no one should try to take advantage of the Montana or Tennessee “Firearms Freedom Acts” without consulting a competent attorney and being prepared to pay large legal fees. Anyone makes firearms commercially, without complying with federal law, is likely to be prosecuted. “Firearm Freedom Act” supporters have never planned to test these laws in criminal cases, and no one who puts himself in that situation should expect support from the NRA.
    This is simply spineless, I have discussed the FFA at length with the individual in Montana whom wrote it and they DO plan to test it in federal court ASAP. While I adamantly disagree with the way the Montana & Tennessee Firearms Freedom Acts are written; because they themselves compromise that the NFA, GCA, FOPA, NICS and other federal infringements still apply; and that as written it could simply be trading Federal Firearm Infringement for State Firearm Infringement; it’s a significant step in the right direction; towards the abolishment of infringement pre-existing, fundamental, unalienable rights, re-affirmed by the Constitution and the Second Amendment…
    For those that do not know the history of the NRA’s Second Amendment compromises; this is the Benedict Arnold approach; when it looked like he was going to end up on the losing side; instead of digging in and saying hell-no, like we did at Lexington & Concord and elsewhere; Benedict Arnold played both sides of the fence until he could no longer and was ultimately chased out of the country with his tail between his legs.
    Inviting Anti-Second Amendment Record Politicians to speak on behalf of Second Amendment support at NRA conferences… Such hypocrites include but are not limited to:

    • Governor Willard Slick-Mitt Romney (R-MA).

    • Juan McCain (R-AZ).

    • Senator Fred Thompson (R-GA).

    • Senator Lindsey Graham (R-SC).
    • Failing to oppose and condemn other Obama Anti-Constitution & Anti-Second Amendment record nominees, and their Senate confirmations thereof. (Besides Sotomayor)



    NRA Sells Out, Helps Pass Massive Brady Gun Control Expansion
    By Gun Owners of America , A No-Compromise Gun Rights Organization - June 14, 2009
    -- Deal between NRA leadership and Democrats leaves Republicans in the dark --
    Wednesday started out as a routine day in the U.S. Congress, with Representatives attending congressional hearings, meeting with constituents, perhaps devising clever new ways to pick our pockets.
    At 8:30 in the morning an email went out to House Republicans indicating that a gun control bill, recently introduced by Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY), was on the Suspension Calendar (normally reserved for "non-controversial" bills).
    Many Representatives didn't see that email until it was too late. Less than three hours later, the bill passed by a voice vote. The bill in question, H.R. 2640, is a massive expansion of the Brady Gun Control law, the subject of many previous alerts by Gun Owners of America.
    Its passage in the House is a case study in backroom deal making, unholy alliances and deceit. A sausage factory in a third world country with no running water has nothing on today's U.S. Congress.
    The Washington Post reported earlier this week that a deal had been struck between the NRA leadership and Democrat leaders in the House. The headline read: "Democrats, NRA Reach Deal on Background-Check Bill."...Opposing Views: NEWS: NRA Sells Out, Helps Pass Massive Brady Gun Control Expansion
    • For Those Still Believing In The NRA Or The Tooth Fairy

    By Michael Gaddy October 15,2003:
    Millions of Americans have joined the NRA, send money for dues and are solicited many times each year for donations to assist with the legal rights of gun owners-- or so they say. Well, they are paying their lawyers all right, but not to defend the rights of those they claim to represent.
    On October 8th, in a case before the District of Columbia Federal Court, NRA attorney Stephen Halbrook made the following statements to the Court in response to the Judge claiming the right of government to place restrictions on the right to bear arms.
    “YOUR HONOR, WE ARE HERE WANTING TO REGISTER HANDGUNS. WE ARE NOT HERE WANTING UNRESTRICTED ACCESS. WE'RE NOT HERE ASKING TO CARRY THEM, OTHER THAN IN THE HOME.
    Later in the proceedings there was this exchange.
    “THE COURT: YOU'RE SAYING THAT THE GOVERNMENT CAN IMPOSE REASONABLE RESTRICTIONS?
    MR. HALBROOK: YES, YOUR HONOR. YES, YOUR HONOR.”
    The complete annotated transcripts of the hearing can be found here… Keep and Bear Arms - Gun Owners Home Page - 2nd Amendment Supporters
    • For many years the NRA has been selling us out to the government. They have supported every restriction government could concoct to limit the right of citizens of this country to own and carry firearms. I documented this fact in an article over two years ago. Republished here… NRA: Pro Second or Government Lapdogs? Price of Liberty


    • Not so long ago I was having an email exchange with a writer at another site on the subject of the NRA sell out. I was amazed when this former law enforcement officer, who claims the Second Amendment is the “backbone” of freedom, said he would continue to support the NRA because they have a good youth education program (Eddie Eagle) and you had to be a member to belong to most gun clubs. Hey, Idiot, what damn good is that going to be when we can no longer own a firearm!

    Folks, it is time to fish or cut bait. Without the right to own and carry firearms we are done. If you perchance are waiting for those freedom-loving Republicans to come to your aid, please send me a note from the gulag. At least the democrats tell you they are going to take your guns if they get the opportunity.
    If you are standing around waiting on the "pretend to be Christian" to stand up for us by doing away with the assault weapons ban right before the election next year -- don’t forget to take your Prozac.
    Just like the NRA, we give the government power by recognizing and supporting it. It then uses our money to make them more rich and powerful and to ultimately sell us out and enslave us.
    Just keep voting and sending money to the turncoats like the NRA. Life as an unarmed slave will be your just reward.
    Perhaps they will let you watch as your daughters and wives are sold to the highest bidder, but probably not, as you will not have been seen for several years if you are a threat to government as a former gun-rights zealot. Just can’t beat that "Patriot Act".
    • Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result is a sure sign of insanity. – Albert Einstein.


    • Don’t forget to put that tooth under your pillow!


    • Is the blood shooting out of your eyeballs yet?


    • Apparently the NRA believes that true supporters of the Second Amendment have A.D.D. like the Socialist Gun Ban Obama & Company supporters have…

    I have been a lifetime member for decades, but I am sick and tired of the NRA’s COMPROMISE approach to their support of the Second Amendment. While I cannot take back the money I paid long ago for my lifetime membership, I certainly can stop flushing my Second Amendment support dollars down the NRA crapper…
    Moreover, instead give those dollars to the GOA, SAF, JPFO, GONV, and others who still hold that the Second Amendment is non-negotiable…
    I encourage all No-Compromise Supporters of the Constitution and Second Amendment as they were written and intended by our founding fathers to email, snail mail, telephone and fax the NRA – The National Rifle Association, to implore the NRA to cease and desist their Compromise approach to supporting the Second Amendment…
    Or your Second Amendment support dollars will go elsewhere…






    Ed Hamberger...

    I think generally we are on the same page, but when it comes to the NRA; they are undeserving of your support and trust at this point in time...

    I meant every thing I have ever said about the NRA and I researched every single piece of information in the original post...

    AND provided supporting primary source citations thereof...

    I encourage you to do the same and you will find its the real deal...

    My intent is not to be derisive NRA vs. GOA etc...

    but the facts are facts, the NRA is not respecting the Constitutional Republic we were founded as plain and simple...

    My ultimate goal is to get enough supporters of the Unabridged Second Amendment to contact the NRA and get them to: ONE keep the word that Wayne La Pierre has broken regarding the so-called FOPA of 1986...
    http://www.usacarry.com/forums/firea...fiscation.html
    http://www.usacarry.com/forums/firea...1986-fopa.html

    AND TWO stop compromising our rights away...

    The difference between Obama & his Liberal minions and the NRA is the pace they are willing to compromise our rights away...

    Until the NRA starts respecting the Constitutional Republic we were founded as... in a manner consistent with the way GOA does...

    MY MONEY & SUPPORT GOES TO GUN OWNERS OF AMERICA...

    AND I WILL CONTINUE TO EXPOSE THE NRA FOR THE SELL-OUTS THEY ARE IN PAINSTAKING DETAIL...

    "The people never give up their liberties, but under some delusion." - Edmund Burke

  10. #29
    Join Date
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    Location
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bohemian View Post
    Ed Hamberger...

    I think generally we are on the same page, but when it comes to the NRA; they are undeserving of your support and trust at this point in time...

    I meant every thing I have ever said about the NRA and I researched every single piece of information in the original post...

    AND provided supporting primary source citations thereof...

    I encourage you to do the same and you will find its the real deal...

    My intent is not to be derisive NRA vs. GOA etc...

    but the facts are facts, the NRA is not respecting the Constitutional Republic we were founded as plain and simple...

    My ultimate goal is to get enough supporters of the Unabridged Second Amendment to contact the NRA and get them to: ONE keep the word that Wayne La Pierre has broken regarding the so-called FOPA of 1986...
    http://www.usacarry.com/forums/firea...fiscation.html
    http://www.usacarry.com/forums/firea...1986-fopa.html

    AND TWO stop compromising our rights away...

    The difference between Obama & his Liberal minions and the NRA is the pace they are willing to compromise our rights away...

    Until the NRA starts respecting the Constitutional Republic we were founded as... in a manner consistent with the way GOA does...

    MY MONEY & SUPPORT GOES TO GUN OWNERS OF AMERICA...

    AND I WILL CONTINUE TO EXPOSE THE NRA FOR THE SELL-OUTS THEY ARE IN PAINSTAKING DETAIL...
    I'll not argue with you either... I stand behind what I wrote 101 %. I'm getting real tired of neophyte Organizations riding the coattails of the NRA, then crying like babies when they get left behind.You Sir have expressed your thoughts, as have I. Nuf said, subject closed!
    MSgt, USAF (ret), Life Member - NRA, Life Member - NAHC,
    Life Member - NCOA, Member - USCCA, Member - NCGR,
    Member - Oathkeepers

  11. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by GOV5 View Post
    XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXX

    "Perhaps with a better grasp of the framers founding documents, their writings and what the first 56 of them put on the line when they signed the Declaration of Independence; you & others herein and elsewhere would understand the difference between a rant and integrity, honor and veracity and the content of ones character..."

    Once again, your delivery is bad. Are you so arrogant that you think you are the only one that knows the intent of the Founding Fathers? Let me be the first to tell you that you don't have a captive audience on knowledge of that, or anything else for that matter.

    You just come off as a raving gun nut. That's OK with me and the rest here. We can deal with it. But for goodness sakes, do us all a favor, and don't spew that stuff to the non-gun owners ( I didn't say Anti-gun owners). You'll make us all look ignorant.

    And with all the quotes you post..the ones you like..but no others...I'll give you an attaboy for being able to use Google, Since you must think the rest of us either can't, or haven't heard of it yet.
    It never ceases to amaze me, the flames myself and others get from those that claim to support the "Unabridged Second Amendment"; and then result to insults & innuendo when myself and others attempt to open their minds; to the fact that in the history of the world the very compromises; they claim to be reasonable in the interest of public safety; or the common good have always led to confiscation, total disarmament, anarchy and dictatorship...
    Weimar Republic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    But what the heck what do I know I am just a dumb Jar-Head and Right Wing Extremist, incapable of being able to read and actually comprehend readily available information from primary sources...






    "The people never give up their liberties, but under some delusion." - Edmund Burke

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